Vendetta: Rise of a Gangster -- Reinvented

gender-choice
historical-fiction
adult-fiction

#668

The thing is people are not constantly one setting all the time. Maybe there are times when we act out of anger when we’re normally calm and quiet. Sometimes there are characters we treat and act differently around, some characters will lash out around Rosie others will know how her little games work and know how to play it.


#669

Fair point. I guess I should expand on my rather broad description to mention that Mentality is not intended to significantly limit or reduce your freedom of choice, but rather to better describe a given situation in a particular sense instead of just assuming “one size fits all” as is usually the case in these things.

That Rosie scene, for instance, is a perfect example of the “one size fits all” standard approach which might in fact benefit from a touch of to-date Mentality in the narrative (because, clearly, it does not fit all!).


#670

At beginning mentality can’t assume due there is no player agency enough to guess . That is why you should let choose and start creating the mentality from there. And it should alter flavor choice but not limit real ones, even if should alter the success. If you are f.i. a hot headed intimidating punching guy you could try a choice of remain calm after someone insult you but probably you will fail.


#671

I think Mentality should influence flavor text (the MC’s thought process, etc.) and the opinions of characters who truly know them, rather than their actions. It seems to me that it’s meant to represent exclusively the MC’s morality, not their self-control or propensity for violence.

It should be possible to play an evil character that keeps a tight leash on their emotions and doesn’t like getting their hands dirty, instead delegating tasks that require violence to their (eventual) minions. Conversely, you should also be allowed to play as a good guy with a short temper and a tendency to get aggressive when their buttons are pushed. Indeed, seeing that both examples are popular archetypes in fiction, it’s quite probable a lot of people will want to do so.


#672

Mentality is not Morality. It is different and does not assume a karma. For example, you could be hot tempered mentality but being a good person doing good things just you tend to jump before thinking


#673

True, but in this case the Mentality bar ranges from Stone Killer to Good Samaritan, so I believe @Vendetta is using the terms interchangeably.


#674

If that’s so I found it an error @Vendetta
I think both should be separated. One thing is morality or karma and other mentality or way of act. You culd be calculated, grumpy, rude, lustful etc… and that doesn’t mean you can’t be good orbad.
The only way it would have sense is mentality means Brutality… but even then is not the best.


#675

Thanks guys. I’ve given this a lot of thought and will, after all, change the stat label from Mentality to Morality.

Originally I’d conceived of something a little more all-encompassing than pure morality (hence the current label) but, having now closely reviewed the situations later in the story to which this new stat has already been applied, it’s clear that in the vast majority of cases it’s almost always addressing morality specifically. Evil or just downright, unnecessarily nasty acts push towards the Stone Killer end of the spectrum, and charitable or other kindly acts invariably head towards Good Samaritan. In essence, whatever my original intentions were, it’s clear that the MC’s essential morality is the character trait actually being tracked here.

Thanks for raising the issue. :slight_smile:


#676

All the usual suspects …

:drum:

Perhaps there should be a tacker for perceived morality and another for actual morality. As I see it, the two would diverge for the MC, especially since the time-scope of the story is so narrow.

YMMV.


#677

This is essentially where we’ve ended up, yes – ‘Morality’ ( what used to be Mentality) is now actual morality (Stone Killer<–>Good Samaritan), while perceived morality is something we’ve always had in the Public Image stat (Notoriety<–>Benevolence).

By the same token, Morality is included on the ‘Personal Details’ page of your M.O. whereas Public Image is included on the ‘Current Perceptions’ page.

All’s well that ends well. :grin:


#678

Morality is far more accurate than mentality if you want represent evil vs good.
However where you track personal mood like, hot tempered, cold … It goes by intimidating or coglioni… Because you should check that in the game because if not You will end up with people jumping up and punch people when has been calm and collected (even if evil)


#679

Yep, fair point. This is the difference between making reasonable assumptions (based on current Morality) to just better flavor text in certain situations, and complete railroading. For instance, just because you tend to hit first and ask questions later, doesn’t mean the game will immediately have you do that. What it will do, though, is offer that option in more situations because your Morality to date suggests it’s highly likely that you will probably want to do precisely that in this sort of situation.

That’s the basic idea in general terms, anyway.


#680

So just out of curiosity, which backgrounds would you lean towards the impulsive/emotional/reckless behaviour and the ones towards the calm/calculating/stoic side of things, if I’ve got this right. For some reason, and that’s cause I never change backgrounds (I’m stubborn like that), I have just a feeling at the back of my head that a veteran male MC is more prone to make mistakes, possible due to his PTSD. Of course, I could be wrong and just spewing nonsense instead.


#681

I’m not sure about the term itself being used in the story since no one even knew that PTSD was a serious mental health problem back then during the 20’s. “Thousand yard stare?” Probably could see it being used to describe PTSD since that’s how it was usually described as during both World Wars.


#682

Although there’s probably some flavor text here & there leaning one way or another, for the most part I actually see that type of thing as something best defined by the choices you make in a given situation, i.e. as optional types of response more than something automatically determined by a specific Background. You may see your Veteran Solider as impulsive / emotional, for example, but another player is almost certain to view / want to play their Vet as the exact opposite…

There is however some conditional narrative based on actual stats in some situations. Leadership, for instance, is one of these. A poor leader can say the wrong thing at the wrong time and make a bad situation worse (and it then falls to your actual choices / other stats to get you out of that hole) whereas a very good leader would instinctively say exactly the right thing and immediately defuse the situation / resolve the matter to everyone’s satisfaction.

‘Morality’ (formerly Mentality) is the tricky one and I need to walk a fine line here to avoid the feeling of being unreasonably railroaded (I can see lots of future edits as a result of feedback from the final beta!). In hindsight, I’ll be using it more to determine the type / range of options available in particular situations, and less for actual flavor text – for the same reason as the Background example mentioned above.

Shell Shocked was probably the term most used during and after WWI for PTSD, although these days the phrase usually suggests only a short-term effect, not the often long-lasting condition it referred to back then.


#683

Vendetta started to explain a bit:

This state has been known for a very long time before the Modern Era as a medical condition - one that was treated as a temporary mental fatigue more than a complex multi-phased issue.

With the advent of electricity, shock therapy and other “cutting edge” cures were put forth - in the timeline of this game, I think including ptsd and its effects would be too constraining - by the time the MC (vet or nurse) got over their episode, the game would be over for many.


#684

POLL RESULTSFavorite Scenes / Sequences

An interesting one this, with quite a few surprises. In the lead by a fair margin is The Bathhouse sequence, with almost half of you choosing this one. Hellions-related scenes also figure prominently, with several of them chosen by roughly a third of all participants—not bad considering there were eighteen sections to choose from, and a maximum of five able to be picked.

In the bottom half are mostly the ones I would have expected to see here for one reason or another, but also one or two I didn’t. Hmm.

Conclusions

I’m sorely tempted to have the next poll repeat the options but instead ask you to choose the five least favorite sections… partly to see what it might throw up in contradiction of this recent poll, and partly to see if we can prompt more helpful comments about what you most dislike about those scenes. If any common themes emerge, perhaps something can be done about that. It’s not good enough to just shrug it off and say “Oh well, it’ll do”.

Am I obsessing too much about “perfecting” (if such a thing is even possible) the Public Demo chapter? Yes, quite probably. All I can ask is that you bear with my abnormal fixation just a little longer. The simple truth of the matter is that when these things get published we have one chance to grab a particular reader’s interest. Once lost, it’s usually lost for good, and the Choice Game market is not yet big enough to be blasé about such things—especially if you spend more time in developing a single project than is good for either your pocket, your health, or your sanity. :grin:

As always, thanks for participating in the polls, guys, I really appreciate your input. It’s proving extremely… educational.


#685

I am extremely good pointing what i don’t like and infamous for it lol :wink: So don’t worry i will answer the poll.


#686

NEW POLLLeast Favorite Scenes / Sequences

For this poll I’ve again broken down Chapter One into eighteen distinct parts, listed roughly in the order each appears in the current Public Demo. Please choose your least favorite scenes, and if you could also spare a moment to elaborate on why / what you especially don’t like about a particular one, I’d appreciate the insight. It would also be very helpful if you could Like any other player comments with which you agree.

Please choose up to FIVE of the following:

  • Dream-memory ‘flashback’ as a teenage Hellion on the streets.
  • City Morgue / meeting Nick Morello / identifying Gina’s body.
  • Leaving Nick Morello’s apartment / encountering Tony ‘The Tail’.
  • Joining Dino & Emilio Zaganis in their Factory Payroll Stickup.
  • Encountering Vinnie Mangano at the Diner / Truck Hijacking.
  • Visiting Chuck’s Place / meeting Uncle Luigi / Cap’n Jack Travis.
  • Lawyer Cesare Gaspone / Louis Campanini at the Pool Hall.
  • Meeting Salvatore Panzarelli / trying to sell him the Pool Hall.
  • Sireno Pacelli — choosing ‘Spider’ McGeeghan or Pete Rossi.
  • Rosie Mallory the Streetwalker / Nick Morello at Greasy Joe’s.
  • Hellions Revenge sequence — “This is personal…” shootout.
  • Hellions Revenge sequence — Rabble-rousing gang attack.
  • Hellions Revenge sequence — Ask Rosie Mallory for a favor.
  • The Barbershop — teaching ‘Smelly Guy’ a hard lesson.
  • The Bathhouse — meeting Monique / Carina / Lucinda / Felipe.
  • The Tailors — meeting Adamo Ruggerio / buying a new suit.
  • The Diner — meeting Donna / Old Ma Gioverdi / ‘Cigar Guy’.
  • Gina’s Funeral / ‘Reflections’ / Chapter Summary & Stats.

0 voters


#687

I still nurse a bit of a dislike for having to cover Dino from the cops, and dying if I either drop him or tell him to find somewhere else to hide his shit.