Vendetta: Rise of a Gangster -- Reinvented

gender-choice
adult-fiction
historical-fiction

#21

La Mano Nera?

Plus 20.


#22

The story has essentially been continued / expanded accordingly, not entirely reconstructed as such. The order of some familiar stuff has changed, however – for instance the Prologue is back to being the City Morgue scene as it was originally (plus some choices), while the current opening scene in the old demo (the dream-memory sequence of your wild youth on the streets) now takes place after you first hear from Nick Morello that Billy’s murderer, Danny O’Hara, made parole. On the following morning, you decide how best to wreak your revenge… or not.

There is also more variety possible in the smaller, ‘connecting’ scenes between the bigger stuff, rather than always be fixed. For instance, after leaving Morello’s apartment and deciding between heading home, going to Chuck’s Place, or Ma Gioverdi’s Diner, on the way to any of those three “main scenes” you will now encounter either “The Tail”, or “Cap’n Jack”, or one or two other (completely new) possibilities… In effect, it will now vary for every play-through, even if your own choice of destination never does.

Quite the opposite! Angel being possibly the most popular NPC in the early stages of the story, I’ve gone to extra lengths to make sure she can figure more prominently throughout. Before, there was roughly an 80% chance it would all have ended tragically (one way or another) around the middle of Chapter Three, but in view of her popularity the chance of that particular outcome has now been drastically reduced.

It’s now at least possible for the both of you to make it to Game End alive, and to live Happily Ever After (cue the violins). Possible, just not very likely… :smiley:

There are now relationship meter bars behind the scenes, so to speak (romance was previously handled in rather more simplistic fashion) but is not presently made visible. The intention is that you have to “feel” your way through a relationship based on narrative alone, but this is one of the things easily tweaked (and actually be included within the ‘Current Perceptions’ section of the M.O.) if beta feedback seems to indicate it would be better to do so. Just one of many topics we have to cover, certainly.

It is indeed possible to just be good friends, I’m happy to say. This applies to all the main female NPCs (Carina, Monique, Lucinda, Donna, Angel… albeit the latter is inclined to be overly affectionate in her friendship, as she is with a male protagonist). The main reason being – sexual orientation completely aside – each of the girls is important to the overall story in her own way and it would have been extremely unfair to a female protagonist to be denied those plot lines simply because a particular girl is not interested in her “that way”.

Did you have anything particular in mind? The story intro / background setting is briefly covered in the “Story Synopsis” section in the opening post above, and expanded on in the Game FAQs and various Dev Blogs. If you have any particular questions in mind I’d be happy to answer as best I can – if someone here doesn’t beat me to it first!

Always a popular one, too (and a fun one to write!). You can probably imagine the difficulty I had in deciding precisely which pair of female / male Backgrounds to make the initial Primary Background choices… The old feedback was pretty spread among several popular ones, with Veteran Soldier just pipping the post overall, but what really decided the matter for me was that I already had in mind (and extensive notes) on the unique stories for both the Soldier and the Veteran Nurse, so they were the most enjoyable (and easiest) to write in detail.


#23

Hey @Vendetta, just out of curiosity, is Rosie gonna feature heavily in the game ? Admittedly, I always felt that she was gonna one of those supporting characters if she wasn’t going to be a main RO.


#24

I was sadly not here when the original demo came out and the story was introduced, but I have heard great things and these long posts and in game faq/explanation is great! Keep up the good work I really enjoyed the demo! :+1::+1::+1:


#25

Ah, I wasn’t here for the original, but the additional gender options are very nice considering I always feel more comfortable when playing a woman! This is very interesting and I can’t wait to see where this goes!


#26

nice one, this and that one about the being queen of england, and choice of exodus were my favourites by far


#27

I would prefer you to stick with your chosen backgrounds for development until they are played out.

Both the soldier and the nurse lend themselves to the historical narrative much more than such backgrounds as “college boy/girl” and as such, it will be easier for you to set the “control” as the soldier/nurse and once you have that baseline down, you will find it much easier for the more deviant/less likely backgrounds to be worked on.

I’m sorry but I feel that following @idonotlikeusernames 's suggestion here would lead you towards more work within and less completion of your developmental cycle - you used the soldier during pre-alpha and alpha as your slice-of-life examples for a reason.


#28

What do you mean by that? That is should be the only background until the game is published and all the others should be dlc? Not that I begrudge Vendetta the extra money, but his core concept is based around being as much of a sandbox as a choice game can reasonably be and for me the soldier background, from a mechanical, gameplay way sets up the stats in a combination that is highly undesirable and apart from gradually elevating the current secondary backgrounds as @Vendetta proposes the only way forward would be to diversify the primary background.
For example I like the erudition (for roleplaying my mc) and leadership (my fave gameplay stat in the old beta) bonus the college kid brings to the table. To do that within the veteran soldier background you’d have to make the mc a mustang’d officer so they at least get some leadership training and learn to more effectively communicate with those of a considerably higher social standing. Needless to say that this is just as much work as gradually adding in more of the other backgrounds and would continue to feel more restrictive for that amount of work.

In addition if the other backgrounds are only developed in a post-release dlc cycle they will be less well known to the general public (as even the best DLC is always purchased less than its base game) and might risk feeling grafted on, particularly if the DLC has no or a less extensive (beta) testing process.


#29

I think there is a disconnect; my communication skills may be faulty here.

If you look at the FAQ, you will see an outlined testing schedule of Bob’s developmental cycle. As of now, he is planning three distinct phases with phase one focused on the game with the soldier/nurse being the “primary” background (or the canon background) - this is for testing purposes only.

Phase two would be to bring online, subsequent background arcs, incorporating them and using extensive playtesting to ensure that they are the equal to the soldier/nurse backgrounds both in depth and breadth.

I am sorry for being frank and blunt but what your feedback would do would be to muddle these two phases of development and even overlap them into one giant mess. From a development standpoint, this would hurt the entire development of the game - all the 18 backgrounds would be demanding developer and testing attention and the net result - speaking from personal experience - is that the backgrounds would suffer in the final release.

One example of this is seen in Dragon Age: Origins with their backgrounds. The human noble background ended up being the strongest and most developed and I fear that many of the others (such as elven slum) got the short shrift because they all were developed simultaneous and tested as one giant lump.

Elder Scrolls Online is another example, I can’t go into details with but I see consequences of the way development was procedurally handled …

Like you, I want all 19 backgrounds to be super detailed, super deliciously different and endearing. The replay value of this alone, would be massive and we are not even touching the other mechanics such as the arrays of business and personal opportunities.

tldnr: I’m talking pre-release, developmental and testing procedural bs with regards to the backgrounds and not release and post-release plans to turn each background into dlc.


#30

Yes it’s back!:sob: Can’t wait to see the new version.


#31

Dusts off the old 45s.

@Vendetta good to have you back.


#32

Oh, ah in that case sign me up for rounds two and three of the testing, Soldier was always massively popular without me being around to beta test it and the stats it sets by default are absolutely frustrating for how I usually like to play my games.
But personally I find going the way of the gun in Vendetta to be incredibly frustrating and far less fun than the more subtle ways to deal with our problems. Case in point the subplot of avenging Billy’s murder, I never quite liked the improbable solo fight/massacre in the Irish pub, while may boyfriend at the time thought if was “badass”. Whereas I loved enlisting Rosie to help my mc blackmail the bureau of prohibition into doing his dirty work for him.
But that is also me being spoiled by knowing those options are available in the game and had Vendetta developed this as more of a combat oriented game I would probably still have liked it, but since I have had a taste of the other methods this game often allowed me to use to resolve my mc’s problem’s, for me the combat approach usually cannot hold a candle to them.

By the way I’m curious what the female counterpart to avenging Billy’s murder will be.

I think this may be a miscommunication on my part, as I was under the impression that these would be post-release polishing (or DLC development) works.

As long as I can still choose the other backgrounds (even if they get less content) in the new public demo and the round 2 and later beta’s and Vendetta just said I should be able to do so I’m happy.
Heck if you do want me to participate in round one I can probably give you an impression of how easy, or difficult and frustrating it is to try and develop the mc away from or in opposition to the starting skillset.


#33

Well, I’m glad you’re officially back, now, and I hope all goes well. This game definitely deserves the attention you’re now giving it.


#34

This type of feedback would most likely be very welcomed - idk Bob’s take but finding a person willing to articulate their frustrations in a positive and conducive manner is awesome for testing.


#35

I’m just glad the maze isn’t there anymore. I never did get to the other end of it.


#36

Sure, though doing a “pacifist” run with the soldier starting background is more one of those challeng-y things veteran gamers like to take up on themselves (and then brag about on video sharing platforms in today’s world) than something that needs to be carefully balanced for by the developers.


#37

Holy shitsticks it’s alive!


#38

Yes thank goodness this is back


#39

Rosie is a complex character with several sides to her personality, and can play quite a significant part in the story – more so now (being a lesbian) that we have a female protagonist. In either case she can be a very good friend, and is also now a potential gang member (under particular circumstances).

@Eiwynn & @idonotlikeusernames

I guess I should clarify where we stand (and where we’re headed) with the ‘Primary Backgrounds’ concept.

Firstly, pretend for a moment that the distinction between ‘Primary’ and ‘Secondary’ doesn’t actually exist, and that I have absolutely no plans for development of Vendetta post-release. That would give us a huge variety of backgrounds to choose from, for those of us who like to replay these things to death. Granted, no one background would be as fully… embellished as we might like (since we all have our personal favorites) but they would all have distinct advantages (and disadvantages) at different points, would have narrative flavor differences where it seems particularly important or relevant to make the distinction (including some bits unique to each background), and – most important – would also have widely varying Attributes and other stats influencing your choices and possible outcomes.

That is more or less what Vendetta was always intended to be, and that will be the game upon its release.

But there will now also be a bonus, one which was never originally intended or planned, and that is the elevation of Veteran Nurse / Veteran Soldier backgrounds to ‘Primary’ status – chosen partly because of the Soldier’s popularity in earlier versions of the game, and partly because it most closely resembles a very popular character (James Darmody) in a fairly recent, really excellent – if you like that sort of thing! – and remarkably successful TV series actually set in 1920s gangland, Boardwalk Empire. Y’see, here I’ve also got my marketing hat on, with an eye on the broader picture of “untapped potential”.

On the very sound basis that a large number of players apparently play these things just one or two times, it made sense to have a ‘Primary’ background with the widest possible appeal, and to devote more effort to making that one something extra special.

Will there be more Primary backgrounds? I fervently hope so – because if this happens, it means the game sold well enough to warrant all the extra effort each requires. To elevate all backgrounds to Primary would take (judging by the extra time already spent on Veteran Nurse / Soldier alone) at least two years. It would only be possible as DLC updates, and then only if both sales of the main game and feedback from you guys suggested that it’s actually worth the effort!

If not, well, I have other ideas for new games that I wouldn’t mind pursuing, either… :smiley:


#40

In other words in the release (and beta) version of the game the College Kid will be fully playable and our mc will be acknowledged as having that background where it is appropriate for the narrative. So kind of what it was like during the old beta and the current (old) public demo? As an example Morello will still chew out my college kid by pointing out he could have easily used his education to go straight and earn a very comfortable living doing so in the new versions, correct?
Only, in addition to that, the veteran soldier would also get extra missions and side plots tailored exclusively to them, that no other background gets (until possible DLC).
Have I got all this correct now?

I hope college kid wins the vote if and when it comes to possibly elevating another background though, as gameplay wise my main beef with the soldier remains that he is a lousy leader and doesn’t seem all that clever at the start. :wink: Ugh, now that I think back, playing soldier was the only time I suffered the indignity of having my poor mc end up a follower in Dino’s gang. :fearful:

Interesting, seems that character, unlike our WWI vet has some college kid in him as well, only he didn’t graduate, whereas for the Vendetta College kid graduating is rather important in order to avoid a long and nasty prison sentence, presumably as convict-labour in the chain-gangs the US was still fond of using at the time.

This wouldn’t be “Leisure suit Barry on the planet of the killer vixen Amazons” would it? :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: