Hi. In case you still haven’t solved your query, I’ve now brokered peace between the vampire factions by…
Being a bit cagey and dishonest with both sides (you might need to pass a Manipulation & Subterfuge test).
Tell your human friends in Ch.11 that your actual aim is to broker peace between the vampires, and then move in close to Chastain.
Break up the fighting and persuade the two vampiresses to bury the hatchet, so to speak. Or try to persuade Monroe to leave town - which resulted in her dropping her hatchet and returning to Chastain!
I don’t want to post a negative review on Steam, so I’ll leave my comments here. I am happy to have bought the game because I want to support your writing. I am a big fan of your Zombies series and also enjoyed A Wise Use Of Time. That said, this game fell flat for me.
The first third (returning to your hometown, reconnecting with people, trying to save the store, etc.) was great. You really got me invested in rebuilding my MC’s life there. The moment we learn that there are vampires in town, it all fell apart.
I could not make the jump from learning about vampires to suddenly wanting to hunt and kill them. I mean, why? What was the MC’s motivation? More importantly, why would an average person think they are fit to hunt a supernatural predator?
It got even worse, when you introduced my team of vampire hunters: A child, a guy in a wheelchair, a single mom, the ex-deputy with the drinking problem and some girl. I appreciate that you were inclusive, I really do, but who in their right mind would hunt anything with these people? I would not have minded so much that you force this team on us, if there had been repercussions. They should have died in the final fight. We all should have died. Instead everyone wore plot armor in my playthrough.
The game breaker for me was how weak and clueless you made the vampires. Centuries old Amanda gets outwitted by the MC and his/her group of nobodies? All we did was break into her house during daytime (which made no sense + we learned nothing) and then we spent half a day doing research at the local library (again learned nothing). We were hardly a brain trust, yet we won the final fight. That is not how WoD vampires are supposed to be. I didn’t expect much from the thin bloods, but Amanda should have been considerably more intelligent considering that she survived this long.
The final battle was a disaster. No one fired a single shot. Instead of killing both vampires (which was the option I chose) or getting murdered by them (rightfully so) Monroe killed Amanda. Adam single-handedly faced off against a ghoul and lived? Really? Then the MC got recruited by some secret organisation to study the supernatural? Again, why would they want him/her? All game we had done nothing noteworthy.
I am happy that people seem to like the game. It’s great that you are updating it. For me, I don’t see myself replaying this one.
Revenais (Post 208) addresses this issue in his/her reply to questions I posted. Apparently, in one recent playthrough, my MC created too many ripples regarding the existence of vampires in town - which caused the FBI to be tipped off and storm Bleakrest house when my MC was meeting with Jayfield and Monroe. In my next playthrough, I was more cautious about letting information slip about what my MC had learned - which led, after brokering peace between the vamps again, to my MC being offered the Embrace by Chastain. My romance option during this play was Jace, though - and he didn’t show up after my MC became a vampire. From what I’ve read on this forum, if my MC had remained human, she might have got a romantic ending with him.
Honestly, I was fine with Bloodlines because I hate the Camarilla and everything they stand for. I actually WAS willing to risk Julian’s vision because honestly? He’s right. The Masquerade is doomed no matter what we do and there’s no point in kowtowing to vampire aristocrats for safety that will inevitably collapse in on itself anyway.
I love Jim’s work and I’ve thoroughly enjoyed all his previous writings, especially Night Road but I can’t help but feel this one to be pretty lackluster. And it’s a bummer considering its an incredibly interesting premise not often used in CYOAs. I guess these are just some thoughts on Out for Blood.
The Good:
Summary
Interesting premise and really good build up. I really felt like a fish out of water, being thrown into a world where vampires are so overwhelming that its scary.
Amazing inclusivity. Characters feel unique and have their own demons. For once, there wasn’t a “perfect RO” or Ace character that steals the spotlight. Your team is a ragtag bunch of misfits in every sense of the word.
Humans fighting vampires.
The Bad:
Summary
Plot points with such intriguing buildup are pretty much left hanging. Either that or they have unsatisfactory “conclusions”.
No real sense of urgency or motivation. I get that vamps are feeding on the people of this town but I never got the drive that really made my MC get off his ass and do something about it. Funny enough, the only moment I truly felt bloodlust was when my cat got killed.
Final battle was anticlimactic. Chastain got taken out like a punk. At this rate, local law enforcement would be able to take her out.
Was the deadline an issue or something? It felt like halfway through, the plot was trying so hard to wrap itself up.
The Wasted:
Summary
The vamp reveal. This is probably the most important scene up till this moment and I was flabbergasted at how it was portrayed. The build up was amazing with everyone being gathered in the store but holy crap did the team go from 0 to 100 quickly. If people found out vamps were real there would be much more denial, contemplation and fear before acceptance. It just felt like it went from “Vamps aren’t real > Vamps are real > Lets hunt them” in like 10 minutes.
No real sense of danger. I never felt like I was a human fighting a vampire. No real strategy or combat tactics were involved other than “Light em’ up”. We didn’t use the sun, blood or anything really. The thinbloods really did most of the “fighting”. The term Vampire could have been replaced with Mob Boss and combat interactions would have had little difference.
Weapons descriptions. I mean, we’re humans fighting vampires. The guns and CQC weapons are the bread and butter of what brings us on a closer level to the undead. They should be like the cars in Night Road. I wish weapons were given more love to shine.
Team worked together seamlessly. It would have been great on seeing some of the team bicker or butt heads due to having conflicting ideologies. Some were explored with Adam and Salem as well as maybe Mikayla and Lacey, but they ultimately didn’t amount to anything.
Would have loved to seen some of the members second guess each other, or even outright suspecting that some may have betrayed the group. There should be a lot more friction between members especially since they only know nothing about each other save that they live in the same town.
Overall it’s a passable game but the World of Darkness moniker can really be taken out of the title, and there would be marginal differences at best. I liked it but I was also mildly disappointed. Hopefully updates can help improve the game and pacing as a whole. Looking forward to ny DLCs like Night Road had.
Edit: My apologies, Night Road was by Kyle Marquis. Not sure how I mixed that up. Still, credit where credit is due, I love Jim’s Zombie Exodus run. Safe Haven is in my top 5 CYOA.
The “get the team together, reveal vampires” scene did feel weird even on my first play through. It almost felt like a 4th wall break where the story went “okay we only have so much time left so yadda yadda vampires don’t exist, yadda yadda oh they do?, yadda yadda gotta kill them.” Along with some very on the nose dialogue which paraphrasing went something like “I’m denying vampires exist because I’m afraid to admit it. But don’t worry I do believe they exist because the plot has to happen.”
It seems you need to get yourWillpower+Resolve high enough to do this. Some says that withhigh Intelligence and Science you can make something to help you transforme, but I didn’t try that path so I’m not sure.
I agree with a lot of these criticisms. The game doesn’t feel rushed, just not fleshed out almost at all. If it set that precedent by not having as many stats, then something could be said for that. But alas, it feels like it was supposed to be bigger and more in-depth than it is. This is only predicated by the jarring ending and extremely lackluster on all fronts finale. It’s certainly not the vampire hunting tale it proclaims. It’s a game that feels like it had content cut out or canned during writing. If neither of those things are true, then it certainly was written to be on the lighter side of things, although, again, it doesn’t show that or act like it. This one was a miss for me, and I say all this with the intent of honest, straightforward, constructive criticism from a massive JimD fan.
Hi. I got the Toreador vampire Ending on my seventh play. I don’t know if you do need to have strong Willpower, as the other poster suggested, but that seems to make sense.
My MC got the vampires to reconcile (can’t recall if she had previously sided with the thin bloods or not - but my MC usually does). She was on the Path to Immortality. I had a Ch.12 with the MC being invited to Bleakrest House and meeting Monroe and Jayfield, but Monroe goes out to meet friends. Then Chastain makes her offer to Embrace the MC, and my MC accepted. But since my MC was Jace, the ending for my MC’s friends was a bleak one…
I suspect if you do side with Chastain - and then either help to kill Monroe, or push for peace - Chastain will return the favour, given her apparent honour and her wish to ensnare your character. What offer she will make might depend upon which Path your character is on (Righteousness/Knowledge/Immortality). But this is my speculation. The last playthrough I had involved my character on the Path to Righteousness - and she helped to kill Monroe at the end. Then Ch.12 involved Chastain inviting my character to Bleakrest House, in order to buy the store (“You tried to have me killed - and I cannot trust you, if you stay in town” was effectively the vibe). This was the first time I got this, which led to Ending 1 - despite previous adventures when I tried to have Chastain killed, only to broker peace. So the Pathway choices do seem to make a difference as to the final outcome.
Has anyone else got an ending that wasn’t numbered? I’ve just had another playthrough where I got a new ending - but here’s what happened:
I sided with Chastain in advance of the Ch.11 battle - and helped to get Monroe killed. Eric and Jace legged it.
Chastain invited me to Bleakrest House and offered to Embrace me (Path of Knowledge 60+ %; Path of Immortality 42%) - but I turned her down. The text consequently read it would be my last visit to the house, and that our relationship had come to an end.
By getting the Mayor to like me enough, and having enough Resources, I was able to pay off grandad’s debt.
The scene then changed to me drinking with my friends, before we went over to the cemetery to spend the rest of the night. No Ending Achievement or Number popped up!
PS: If your character does get invited to dinner by Chastain, only to then be offered the Embrace - and your character accepts and gets pulled into the transformation there and then by an over-eager Chastain, does anyone else feel for Jayfield who’s probably muttering ‘I cooked all this food, in anticipation of mortal company - and I’ve got to eat it all alone, AGAIN!?’
Thank you to everyone who has provided feedback, constructive criticisms, and bug reports.
In VtM V5, it feels like the company wants to move away from the Occult, so I probably didn’t explore it as greatly as I would have liked. That being said, I can see a few areas where I would like it to be increased in the narrative. I can add that to my list.
I appreciate that.
I appreciate that too.
I understand your concerns. I’m working on fixing some of them and appreciate you spending the time to provide your feedback.
There is actually a path where several of them can die. I’m wondering if it’s not getting triggered off by variables.
Re: breaking into Amanda’s house: there are a number of things you learn there and also could potentially meet Amanda early. I’m not sure you want to retry it to find those things and you may not actually care if the game didn’t hold your interest, but I wanted to explain that anyway.
Thank you for your review as well.
Out for Blood is 455,000 words. NR is definitely longer at 650,000 words, 850,000 with the DLCs.
I liked the game overall, but I did feel that the whole “getting the team together” moment felt rushed and unearned.
A 12 year old calls us all together to tell us vampires are real. Lacey goes “no way!”. You go “Yes way”. And then you’re all vampire hunters and everybody rolls with it immediately. This includes Marcus, who you haven’t even met if you didn’t talk to him at the dinner party.
I feel a better way would be to make people meet Marcus beforehand(unavoidable conversation at the party would work here), and to also give everybody else little things like Lacey’s anemia in prior conversations, so that you can use them all to build a more convincing case for vampires. Adam’s burning man could come up in an earlier conversation, and the others could get little things that you could piece together to build a case for vampires, at least enough to justify people looking into it.
Ok, so I crafted a computer worm in grandad’s secret lab, and then employed the worm against the hackers system. Then Nothing. It just seems like a redundant path, much in the way trying to investigate Dr Lobo, the vile found in the car, the soil in the globe, or the blind girl etc are. It looks like some things were started, but not finished, or amI missing something?
