Alright, I’d just like to know. Thanks for answering back, and yeah, I realized how invasive that question was. Sorry for asking you that.
Well, I was one of the beta testers, so I suppose they should fire me . . . not that you can exactly fire this sort of beta tester. Disallow? Disavow?
You know, when I played through as a beta tester, I sent loads of feedback about certain issues. They weren’t the SAME issues this thread brings up, though. I didn’t feel like I was pushing against constant platforming (preaching, I mean) in this title.
I picked the game up again after reading through this thread (and especially after seeing @Jenna_V’s first comment on it - thanks for putting your thoughts out there!). I attempted to play through as a high-flying character who wanted to be a super star, and who was mostly self-focussed. In trying, I didn’t find the game ALLOWED me to play that way, really. In fact, especially in the first chapter, my limits were rather clearly laid out:
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The MC is taking care of the sister, and really seemed willing to sacrifice life and limb to that end. I don’t think just anyone would have this take on their situation. There are so many other ways a character could have gone; institutionalising the younger sister, or at least leaving her care to others, abandonment, etc. But no, our character is a hyper-responsible older sibling who is trying to save both self and sister from sinking into oblivion. No options here to just let her slide and focus on winner-take-all in the Hero Project, or even just self-survival.
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When I was asked to choose why I came on the Hero Project’s second season, even though we can’t say the real, game-driven reason, there wasn’t really an option for a more self-focussed character. No “I think I totally deserve this opportunity and I’m going to astound you all!”, no “I will burn this earth to the ground and rebuild it in my image”, no real show-boating options, whether good, neutral, or bad. The reactions ranged from sort of mild nothings to social justice (and an occasional ‘mysterious’ option thrown in that felt very Batman to me).
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Every time the social system is brought up, it’s made plain that the MC cares about it for some reason - or if the MC doesn’t care, it’s presented as a ‘keeping my head down’ kind of option.
And the pattern continued. There was never really a path for someone who didn’t care at all about the social system, but was determined to succeed at any cost - inside, outside, or in the ruins of that system. Nor were there really any options for show-boating.
I didn’t mind, though, and I had a long think about why I didn’t mind. The original trilogy was not my favourite, because the parameters for my MC there which I felt were inescapable - young, hot-headed, impetuous, stubborn, idealistic, sentimental - did not suit me very well. I quite disliked, for instance, that I was forced to abandon sending letters to my parents in the Void. Or to jump into things that were not my business. Or to let my grandmum push me into take a sidekick, even when the situation was clearly pretty fishy, I had other issues, and since when did my MC listen to her anyways?
With Redemption Season, at least I knew right away which direction my character’s personality was trending - hyper-responsible, stubborn, and mind on disembodieds, a broken class system, and the like. And I found this MC a lot more palatable.
The original trilogy really pounded social justice issues too, just different ones from a slightly different angle. I admit, I kind of read that one like, ‘Presidency/politics blah blah, reality shows blah blah, cults blah blah, evil powered mafia blah blah.’
Can you imagine what it might have been like if our MC from that one was a young Meek cultist with a power who had been strong-armed into the situation? The author does seem to write fairly defined MC’s, but I don’t think it makes the games badly written - just very different to games with open-ended MCs. And thus they strongly connect with some people, and others really can’t stand them. (I didn’t enjoy Versus much either, because I didn’t like the role/character that was defined very much, although the world-building was intriguing.)
As to characters - I though JK was pretty well-rounded; little things like her differing reactions to her illness depending on mood, her first meeting with Star Soar, even her musical tastes were excellent. I didn’t think she was any less defined than the grandmum from the first trilogy, and we’ve only seen JK for the one book so far.
And I actually did like Transfer, and felt there was some depth there. I liked that Transfer wasn’t portrayed as some innocent lamb, but in fact could be just as blinkered as some of the ‘bad’ characters.
I don’t think this game has a tonne of replay value, necessarily, but I did enjoy playing it.
On the other hand, I usually come into superhero games expecting to be pushed in directions I don’t like. My ideal game is one is a dramatic, adventurous one in which there is no fighting or violence of any kind. There aren’t many. I’ve gotten to that point after years of trying to find some sort of well-maintained middle ground between games with fighting and otomes, I just put up with all the fighting-oriented games and enjoy them on their own terms.
So, a hero game that was mostly NOT about punching bad guys and shiny superhuman powers was a nice surprise. And the genre has a lot of room for all kinds of interpretations, not to mention social platforming (I hesitate to bring up Sandman, but I will because it’s about as non-traditional a superhero work as there is, to my knowledge).
I also paid absolutely no attention to the marketing, so that may have a lot to do with why I view the game the way I do.
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So, since I just finished it, I feel like I should hurl some pennies into this.
Personally, I adored the first trilogy. It was my first big CoG I had been interested in, it was fleshed out and in-depth, it was well developed, and being part of minority groups myself, (I’m both genderfluid and bisexual, as well as racial minority) I found it relatable, if a little heavy handed. The one thing the original didn’t do for me, was really flesh out my character’s relationships in any meaningful way. The only romance options I cared about were Jenny and Prodigal, I felt that grandma was a bit of an ‘excuse ex machina,’ and one of the characters that I actually wanted more about, Sanders, turned be a bit-character with a mysterious backstory.
Now fast forward to now.
JK’s relationship is heavily explored, you can see through the eyes of other people, I especially liked the fact that the producer is dating Jury, should you not have loaded a character already doing so and there are (from what I’ve seen) more romance options in this one game, than in the entire previous trilogy, and all of them seem more meaty (literally in the case of our new zhir) than the previous ones. As well as this, your character is an actual minority with a disadvantage. Your previous character was pretty damn well off, this new guy/gal? Not so much.
Lastly, is the option for no personal gain, and this has been mentioned before. If I wanted to be a ‘for-the-fame’ Paris Hilton whore, let me be. Seriously. Please. I tend not to play these kinds of characters anyway, but having the choice… Well the publisher 'ain’t called ‘Choice of games’ for nothing now…
Of course, this is just first impressions. Knowing me, I’ll play it another 40 times to get every achievement, and get a better look at the whole thing.
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The producer is sleeping with Jury regardless of romance
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Eh, haven’t played enough with enough different characters. Thanks for the heads up.
You know, I completely forgot our character knew Martial Arts until someone else mentioned it. There’s surprisingly little combat for a Superhero game, is it even possible to hit 0 Health/Power?
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When is the next part of this hero project series coming out?
This game struck a weird note with me. I consciously agree with the point it’s (very, very blatantly) trying to make, but the implementation was so ham-handed that by the end of the free segment I was apparently a hyper-traditional self-obsessed ass.
Is the whole game like this? I’ve not bought it yet and to be honest I’m not eager to based upon what I saw in the preview.
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I’d feel bad if I said, “No, don’t buy the game, at all! It’s not worth it!” because that’s certainly not why I put my feedback in on this thread. I just needed to express my own frustrations. So, I’m just gonna say that if you didn’t like the preview of the game, you’re probably not gonna like the game itself. I wouldn’t turn myself completely off of it, though, because I think Zachary Sergi is a fantastic writer and the original trilogy of the game was one of my favorites in the CoG series. There’s still some heavy handedness in the original series, but it’s not exactly to the extent of this one.
If anything, though, I’d go back and read both the positive and the negative reviews of the game in this thread, in particular. It’ll give you a good idea of what you might be spending your money on. Cause I know a lot of people had a lot to say on both sides of the spectrum, myself included.
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I’m sorry, I meant to reply to this earlier but…
-Deep Breath- YEAH. THAT’S EXACTLY HOW I FELT. Just the moment I read his intro, my instant thought was, “This guy’s probably really, really attractive and probably gets exactly what he wants all the time. Well… I’ll give him exactly something.” And by something, I meant a punch in the face and another thing you don’t mention in polite company.
But, you know, my romantic heart tends to come out on top in these scenarios and I was just waiting throughout the second episode the opportunity to more than just jump his bones. I just wish there was a lot more to the romance than Jury redeeming himself. And it felt cheapened when you learn they just break up in the next game. I have a firm belief that you don’t go up to someone who made out with you on live television with the intent to spill all of your precious daddy’s secrets (this is your rival, dude; that was established in the beginning there) without surmising the idea that maybe you’d like to spend more than just time fighting this person and maybe a lot more time (to steal an innuendo from Captain America) Fonduing with them.
Like, I feel if you’re a villain and you do a complete 180 all because of a person you think you may have fallen for (someone who’s best friend you almost killed, mind you), that you wouldn’t, for the life of you, let anything come between you and that person. That’s a lot of trust you’re giving to one person 100% capable of doing a lot more than rejecting you (especially if you almost killed that person’s best friend).
That’s probably why I’m still so hung up about the Jury/MC deal. And the fact that I, at least, know my MC had a good month of wallowing in his grief with numerous buckets of ice cream and a lot of cheesy rom-coms. And a lot of superheroing that he didn’t do 'cause he was too busy frowning at the empty bottle of hot fudge that was supposed to distract him from his sorrows.
Okay, I’m… I’m getting a little way too off topic. Ahaha. ;3; I’m just gonna take my heartbreak headcanons somewhere else…
I’m sorry I came off wrong here. I worded it totally wrong. I just meant to emphasize the point that, while Jury was an asshole who almost killed/killed your best friend, a surprising amount of people really liked him as a character. (Like, so much that people are still surprised that there are people upset about the Jury/MC break-up).
He just got a lot more fans than I think Sergi or anyone expected when he was first introduced. But, while I love him as a character, I can definitely see ten way to Sunday why anyone would hate his absolute guts. I mean I was conflicted about him, especially in The Hero Project episode like god, what an asshole still hot though. dammit. And I have absolutely no problems with anyone who hates him for any reasons outlined because, yeah… yeah I think that was the original intention. Jury’s a great example of those characters that you love-to-hate and a lot of people still do, even if some people have come to drop the ‘to-hate’ part and just stuck with loving him. And some people think he’s annoying and should just go away. I understand that too. I have that issue with a lot of villains in a lot of shows and games (coughgrantwardinAOScough).
So, yeah, I definitely understand your hatred for Jury because I loved Jenny too. I just… happened… to love smooching Jury’s smug face a lot more. [Insert Waxing Poetic About True Love]
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I had a different interpretation of that original “Sonja or Sidekick” choice. As a Justice-focused hero, I consistently chose to save Sonja. My reasoning was that the Sidekick was, at least in some way, “in the hero business” and knew the risks involved, while Sonja was effectively a civilian (later games might cause the reader to reevaluate this assessment of Sonja, but we didn’t know then what we know now).
Of course, with the benefit of hindsight, choosing Sparrow as your sidekick simplifies things quite nicely, doesn’t it? 
I also think it just makes for a better story to have your sidekick turn out to be your arch-nemesis (read: one true love 
) in disguise.
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Wanted to say;
The writing was solid. The narrative okay BUT there was something off here. The heavy attempts at telling the reader how they feel unfortunately shoved me out of the MC’S perspective.
Beyond that you’re swamped with ‘big picture issues’ with a character that by rights should feel very down to earth.
All n all the experience was very disembodied coincidentally.
On the up side when we had those moments to just be and freely immerse were great. Then came those moments that tried to push a certain perspective.
Anyway figured I’d share my opinion. Good story but distorted by the big picture.
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Your Sidekick doesn’t die. Only Sonja dies if you choose to save the other person.
I can’t remember who said it (whoever did please let me know who you are) but someone mentioned that the breakup and Jury’s appearance effectively just pissed everyone off since the people who don’t like him are going to be annoyed to see him, and the people who like him are going to be mad that their character broke up with him offscreen.
I’m finally putting my Jury romance through the game just because I want to see whether or not the romance is salvageable and also I did pay money for this so I’m going to get my money’s worth dammit. If it is salvageable, I’m going to write up a post about it but I’m not sure yet.
I also agree with a lot of people pointing out how the discrimination is breaking the rule of “show, don’t tell.” Like, the only times I felt truly discriminated against was when my mechip was mocking my appearance and when people in the competition were like “Oh.” This could have been solved if we were allowed to actually sign up for the show on our own, by showing us having trouble signing up due to our status, and then have that moment introduce us to Weaver, a character we never actually meet prior to “Do you think they’re hot???” Then, have Weaver help us with the signup, like GG did in the second game. More could be added, but that was just an example I was thinking of that would help resolve the show not tell thing, and also show us who Weaver actually is.
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I adore the first trilogy in the same setting and was looking forwards to this new one with a great deal of excitement. While the writing is regularly excellent, I remain disappointed with the story. Not only does it feel linear, good for a single read and then done, but the ending follows a frustrating trend towards CoGs that are not complete except in a set. The original three Heroes stories are better together but are also satisfying to me when played individually whereas the ending of this feels just shy of deliberately unsatisfying.
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One of the big reasons I was turned off by the demo was the complete lack of build-up. We start right at the beginning of the competition. There’s no time to introduce characters, develop the MC’s personality and backstory, explain the HR world (including discrimination), etc. We just, well, go.
All in all, my biggest problem with the game is that the series seems to have taken a step backwards. The author listened to feedback during the first trilogy and used it to fix a lot of problems. Each game was better than the last when it came to railroading, characterization, and exploring social issues instead of just lecturing about them. However, this installment takes all that progress and throws it out the window.
I know that the author likes to use pre-defined MCs, linear plots, and social issues. I don’t expect any of that to change, and I don’t want it to, since that’s how he likes to write. However, the first trilogy was thoroughly enjoyable, even for people who don’t care for any of those things. Personally, I don’t like heavy railroading, but I still loved the series. The latest game, however, failed to be entertaining for those people. The railroading and preachiness got worse, and the things that make the series appealing in spite of that, such as the characters and superhero action, are lacking this time around.
In short, Sergi dropped the ball with this game. I hope he manages to pick it back up and score a homerun in the next one.
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At first I didn’t really like this game…strike that and reverse it …I really didn’t like this game. It was the powers the MC has that really put me off. I play these games for a little escape, and I found myself thinking things like “I just want to be pretty” when I woke up as a chicken, our with a dog’s snout, or…so on.
Honestly pretty or not I found not knowing what I would look like or what my powers would be made it very hard to identify with the character. I couldn’t really get inside her.
I actually quit halfway through. But, I kept thinking about the game and I realized that a lot of those feelings were things that the MC might be having herself, and I was struck again by the power of this genre.
I finished the story, and enjoyed it in a way I haven’t with any other CoG game.
If I did have a criticism it would echo what some others have said. The discussions of discrimination, bias, and privilege were a little forced, and heavy-handed at times especially when nearly every character in the story already agrees that those things are problems with society that need to be rooted out.
Other than that though this game was a wonderful experience, and I look forward to more.
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Now that I’ve played through it, and discovered that there is no way to get Jury to stay with you…
I kinda hate that entire part of it. I did a f*cking heel-face turn for the guy and he abandons me?! OFF-CAMERA?!
Feels strange.
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The restricted options and the preaching are basically the same point. Most people who are disappointed in the game expected a superhero game. Instead they got a social issues awareness campaign game which happened to feature super heros. All the things that make a good story, action, character development, plot and in this genre meaningful choices suffered at the altar of the author wanting to beat us over the head with non-subtle social issues messaging. It’s not just that the game is linear it’s that the game is linear in a boring way.
I feel that if the beta-testers did not point out that the story was suffering for the author’s identity issue piety and no one thought to point that out then the beta testers were negligent and did us all a rather significant disservice. I would have given the last games a 9, this game was perhaps a 5.
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