Guenevere (WIP)

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@Lexa is correct; Mordred challenges Arthur on the basis of ideals.

Guen won’t be able to prevent them from going to war against each other (that’s kinda essential to the plot of part 7). It will probably be possible for Mordred to end up on the throne while Arthur goes into a peaceful retirement, if that’s what Guen wants to happen, but Mordred and Arthur are not going to live happily ever after together as father and son, nor will Arthur ever be able to see things Mordred’s way (or vice versa).

@Julie_Humbert Thank you! I look forward to the commercial release, too, assuming I live that long! :smile:

Oh, in this version, Arthur will probably be blindsided by Mordred’s betrayal. He will think the best of Mordred, just as he does with anyone (and Mordred is good at hiding his intentions, so even “hardened” Arthur is unlikely to suspect).

That’s one of those “would be cool if I could implement it; we’ll see” items. :slight_smile:[quote=“derekmetaltron, post:7932, topic:1996”]
I think the idea of her being on the opposing side of her son is almost as interesting as a pro Mordred Guen facing Arthur!
[/quote]
Agreed… poor Morgana!

Actually you’ll have to choose to go to either Arthur or Morgana first (that’s how Guen will find out what happened), and then you can talk with Lancelot later if you like.

Probably not particularly – it won’t be a special romance scene or anything (Lance will be upset, too, so I’m afraid you’re not going to be getting sexytimes from him at that point in the story). But if the romance is active, it will likely be acknowledged.

You have at least three already: Maris, Bretta, and Elise are all knights of the Round Table. :slight_smile: Maris and Bretta don’t own land, so they don’t have a lot of power, but they’re RT knights. You’ll see Elise if you go to Michaelsmount, and she’ll probably show up more in the future (and likely be retconned into part 1 eventually).

Galahad will be a RT knight, but right now I don’t have any plans for the perilous seat. I kinda want to stay away from those sort of virtue-tests if I can.

Very likely, depending on which of the two possible children (depending on the father) Guen has.

mmm… I wouldn’t rule it out completely, but to be honest I think it’s unlikely, because I’m trying to use the anachronism-mashup to give the Guenverse a timeless feel, without a sense of technological “progress.” So the 20th century in the Guenverse might still have knights etc.

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That reminds me of what I was planning to ask; who exactly will see through Mordred’s mask, if anyone at all? I mean like really early on or from the beginning, rather than being taken in and manipulated by his charm and then wising up to it, even for a short amount of time.

Obviously it takes a special kind of person to see through the kind of person Mordred is; in any universe fictional or no, the hallmark of Mordred’s type of people is that they can blend in to appear completely normal and give no trace of their…atypicality, even to the people closest to them and (apparently) know them best.

I’m assuming that Guen is relative to your playstyle; I would be shocked if a ditzy Guen would see through Mordred’s facade, whereas somebody as intelligent and perceptive as my Guen, I would be shocked if she didn’t. Perhaps Morgana would be most inclined, but seeing as how she could join Mordred, I’m a bit on the fence. I’m uncomfortable with the knowledge that she could see past him, yet still join him later. Lancelot I’m not sure about either; he’s certainly clever enough to notice something, but I don’t think clever enough to suspect anything.

There’s reports of people that worked closely with psychopaths suggesting that when you aren’t utterly charmed by them, there’s a constant sense of fear nagging at you, no matter how nice they are to you; almost as if something in your subconscious is screaming at you to get out of there and away from them, that they’re a danger. Of course that’s not the same as seeing past the mask, of course. But it’s a start.

I just imagine my Guen being the only one to wonder if Mordred isn’t what he appears; being the only one to see the apparent deadness behind his eyes, seeing almost imperceptible signs that his sincerity and compassion is forced. She’d be wary for sure. More than likely rather scared. I just wonder if Guen will be the only one to suspect or see, or if she will be at all.

Arthur clearly won’t see it, though; that much was evident from the start.

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Waitwaitwait… there’s another female knight other than Maris and bretta??? :scream::dizzy_face:Woh…you learn something new every day.

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I kind of want to ask this question, but kind of not since it might be spoilerific…
I guess I’ll just ask and let you (jeantown) tell me if you can answer or not based on the answer.

Question; will Arthur know for certain (once this whole doppleganger situation is over) that the real Guen is…well, real Guen? Or will he have to trust in himself (and Guen) that he did reunite with the real one?

Like, are the dopplegangers all going to disappear or be destroyed (boy that sounds mean) or do they continue to live even though they’re technically not… well gosh I don’t want to say they’re NOT people since they apparently think they are…

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Since you mentioned that it probably will be possible for Mordred to win the throne without Arthur dying, is the opposite true? Can Arthur win without Mordred dying? And does Mordred genuinely hate Arthur or does he simply see Arthur as the wrong king for Camelot?

Regarding the child, will it be possible to have some family moments with them like personally teaching them what Guen is good at, take them hunting, introduce them to other nobles and other stuff? And will a Guen that has a kid have somewhat lower stats than a Guen that doesn’t due to time being spent pregnant and recovering from said pregnancy?

Dunno if this is too spoiler-y or not, so I’ll just cross my fingers. Is the treaty you can get with the Franks just (or 'just" since it’s still pretty good, of course) a peace/trade treaty or is it a military alliance?

I can’t wait to see this on Steam either so I’ll be cheering for you for whatever it’s worth.:smile:

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So, I do like the character of Arthur, in fact I love all the characters, but I am curious about something. I have tried really hard in my last few play throughs to get the different characters to lash out at Guen and really just lose their tempers.

Morgan’s cold enough if I treat her like absolute crap, but it seems no matter what I do, Arthur and Lance never get truly angry at Guen. Is there some way to do that in book 1 or the first half of book 2? Maybe some options or reaction I haven’t unlocked or seen yet? And if not, when will the first time they can really angry at Guen and blow up be? What will it take to make them act like that?

I feel like a horrible person asking these questions, but I just really want to see what furious Lancelot or Arthur would be like. :sweat_smile:

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In my case it’ll probably be…

Guen: Well, shall we go?

Arthur: Wait! How do I know you’re not the real- MWF! (Kissed passionately by Guen) Ah…

Guen: (Smirk) You’re an idiot sometimes, but you’re MY handsome idiot.

Arthur: …yeah, you’re the real Guen. :sweat:

Guen: Well come on dear…

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@Jeantown

Well, when the Frank army retreats, would it not be good to finish them off? One can inflict many casualties in the pursuit of a retreating enemy, right?

Although, I can imagine the other government officials saying that the priority should be Camelot’s defense rather than obliterating the Frank army.

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This is actually addressed in the existing text - if you summon a Morgana doppelganger in the course of your escape from the ship, she winks out of existence later on.

The doppelgangers Mel created at the castle will all be gone by the time we get to Michaelsmount. Though that’s not to say that he can’t summon more… but they don’t last forever.

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Does that mean Guen will be stuck “legally” married to Arthur even if she manages to get rid of Arthur. Does the same apply for Morgana and Lot, or Lancelot and Elaine? What about annulment? Even if divorce were legal, my Guen would refuse for that would require acknowledging the validity of the “marriage” in the first place. If there is no legal way to be rid of Arthur and free to marry as her heart desires, then she’ll have even more incentive to have Arthur executed. If the religion of Britain at that time forbids it, then my Guen would also probably do what Henry VIII did in disestablishing the state religion to permit her to do as she saw fit. My Guen might do that anyway since while there is nothing she can do as Queen Consort, there is no way she would tolerate as Queen Regnant worship of any deity that would bless forcing Guen into a marriage against her will.

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If Guen gets pregnant can she have an abortion or regret getting pregnant or show neglect if the kid is born?

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@jeantown

How long ago was it that Lance had the relationship with the person who is going to appear in part 3? Does Lance keep that person in mind often after the breakup, especially if Lance enters a romance with Guen?

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I hope I can give Guen the option to. Morgana will suspect, but may be somewhat in denial, or hoping that things won’t be as bad as she fears? Lancelot will similarly be worried but hope for the best, and may even try to do what he can to prevent disaster. (edit: by trying to help Mordred be a better person, not by trying to kill Mordred or anything like that!)

Yeah. :slight_smile: Poor Arthur.

Yes. As @bobsmyuncle says, all of the doppelgangers will have disappeared by then, so Arthur will have no problem believing Guen is real if/when they’re reunited at Camelot.

That, I don’t know yet. Maybe it will depend on Arthur’s “hardness” level whether or not a victorious Arthur spares Mordred (with Guen perhaps interceding, or not).

Mordred passionately hates Lancelot. His feelings toward Arthur are less passionate, somewhere between indifference and vague distaste. To him, Arthur is mostly just an obstacle to be gotten out of the way.

I hope so! :smile:

Nah. A pregnant/recovering woman isn’t so incapacitated that she can’t keep up with studying magic or tactics, nor does pregnancy have to slow down an athlete for very long. Keep in mind that Guen has healing magic available to her at Avalon, and that she’ll have servants to help take care of the baby.

It’s just peace and trade, no military. But that doesn’t mean Guen couldn’t ask for a military alliance in the future if relations are good.

They can’t, really, in the parts that are available so far. I will probably tweak what’s there a bit, so that Lancelot and Arthur will act somewhat differently if Guen is mean to them, but they’re both decent people who feel bad for Guen if she’s unhappy, so they’re both being very patient and hoping for the best. But no, they won’t be doormats forever. If Guen and Lance are not friends, you may start to see some flareups if they both go back to defend Camelot. As for Arthur, if you really want to see him lose it, sleep with Lance and then tell Arthur in the most tactless way possible at the end of part 2. :relaxed:

Under some circumstances you can get an option to send whatever’s left of your army out to try to cut them off before they get back to their boats, but… well, if you take that option, I hope you have a lot of your army left to send. :slight_smile:

Yes. That will definitely be said.

She can remarry if Arthur dies. (As can Morgana if Lot dies, or Lancelot if Elaine dies.) No annulment, I’m afraid. Best option for your Guen will probably be Arthur’s death, which is not difficult to achieve in part 7 (I mean, look at the title :wink:)

She can’t get pregnant by accident – she’ll have to decide in part 3, once and for all, if she’s going to have a baby or not. If she decides yes, then part 4 will begin with Guen giving birth at Avalon. She can, however, hand the baby over to the servants to raise, and have only minimal contact with it. (Or she can keep it with her all the time if she wants.)

Hmmm, let’s see… he was 17, so it was three years ago as of part 1, six as of part 2. He was heartbroken and has never been quite the same since, but I think he would see a romance with Guen as healing some of that pain. By the time the person shows up in part 3, Lancelot will have moved on emotionally no matter what (not that seeing an ex is necessarily easy).

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@jeantown

How did the person who broke up with Lance feel about the breakup?

Also when Guen gives birth in Avalon, who will be present on that day besides I assume Arthur?

If you leave Guen’s kid in Avalon, are they going to stay there until they grow up or will they also spend time in Camelot as well?

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Good questions! :slight_smile:

Sad and guilty.

Vivien and Morgana. Not Lancelot, actually (at least not in the current plan).

You can’t leave Guen’s kid at Avalon – the child will grow up at Camelot no matter what. Guen can be more or less involved in the child’s life (servants will do whatever Guen doesn’t).

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I’m curious as to what will Morgana and Mordred’s relationship be in the Guenverse. Since it was said that Morgana will see some of the warning signs from Mordred but she’s in denial about them then can we assume that their relationship will be a lot like the ones she has with her other children with Morgana being a very devoted and loving mother despite the circumstances around Mordred’s birth? Since he has very little regard for Arthur how does Mordred feel about Morgana?

Oh! And Merlin! Will there be anything from him about Mordred? Any interaction? He knows exactly how things are gonna play out, right? I always thought that comment about fate from a seemingly napping Merlin at the round table meeting in Part 1 was referring to Mordred.

@darkwolf76 And that’s exactly why I can never commit to a playthrough with jerk!guen. Arthur, Lance, and Morgana don’t seem to get truly pissed at Guenevere no matter how snappy she gets they just alternate between surprised, hurt, and various shades of guilty. Like you said Morgana and Lance will sort of withdraw at a certain point but being mean to Arthur especially just feels like smacking a excited puppy in the face with a newspaper and I just can’t deal. I feel terrible. :sweat_smile:

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I replayed this game just the other day and clicked a choice I never had before. I was very surprised, and super impressed.

After doing the diddly with Lancelot he asked if I thought the magical badtouch was affecting our minds. Guen answered that it was probably affecting his, but not hers because she wasn’t having any woo woo dreams, and he got pretty creeped out by Guen.

I didn’t even think about it that way, but he should be! That’s so rapey. I wonder, if it really is affecting him more than us, if he’ll be pissed about it later? Not even at Guen (since she probably doesn’t know-- although I did notice that choice took a relationship hit!) but at the situation in general. He seems like the type of person that prides themselves with being honest, at least with their own conscious.

That’s some prime angst, mi amigios.

I’m so excited.

But that’s the best part! :dagger::sparkles:

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Damn those flawless characters!! That’s why I’m never mean to them. :persevere:

Also, I’m imagining a tactless jerk Guen being like: “oh, and by the way I banged your best friend while you were risking your life for me.”

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I’m just picturing those universes where Guen is as clueless as Arthur and Morgana’s in denial…and Lancelot’s all alone in seeing that something’s off, for years and years, and nobody believes him. Poor, poor Lance…

Of course she will. Psychopath or not, he’s still her child.

By the way, you mentioned that Guen can have a child that thinks somewhat similarly to Mordred. If she does, will Guen and Morgana be able to talk about/bond over their experiences?

And speaking of that child…I wonder who the father is.

If it’s Lancelot, with him and Mordred will be pretty much mortal enemies because of Mordred’s tendencies, how would he react to seeing those same behaviors in his own child?

If it’s Arthur, then he might have not one, but BOTH his children (and possibly his wife) plotting against him. :cry:

Whoever it is…wow, so much DRAMA.

(Though I’m kind of hoping it’s Lance. Poor Arthur deserves at least one happy parent/child relationship. Plus I’m really interested in how Lance would deal with THAT curveball. :smiling_imp:)

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IKR. This is one of the few WIPs where I’m playing a total Angel of Kindness and Honesty. :laughing: Not that I planned it. I just really like the characters. Specially the main trio.

(Unlike, say, Choice of the Romance where I cared for no one and thus became an awesome and mighty Evil Queen in the end).

I’m thinking about joining Mordred tho. Because DRAMAAAAA. :imp:

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