You make several starts to escape the circle, but they stand fast, adjusting themselves to keep you trapped. The family may have you surrounded—and the crosses hold you captive—but you feel no fear. You have not made it to this age without facing down much greater challenges.
All you need to do is break the circle and then you will be free. The ${bespectacled_italian} urges them to stand fast as you draw yourself up to your full height.
In the text above it says the crosses did have an effect on West. When one selects him as one’s Dominus it eventually says that West doesn’t believe in superstition. I would think that all religions are under “superstition”, so I count him as one of the atheists.
@CaballeroDeAndromeda This is the thing, we know crosses don’t work on atheist vampires, but an atheist vampire could use them.
As for West we know he fears crosses for whatever reason. As someone pointed out how they’re used in the homestead and I believe the German tells us about how we know West fears crosses. I imagine that fear stretches back into the hidden story of how West was made mad in the first place by the sleeping vampire underneath the city. Unfortunately that aspect hasn’t been fully written yet for the player to access. So we know with West at least, the fear of crosses goes beyond belief. It’ll be interesting to find out why.
Reply @CaballeroDeAndromeda: I understand your logic, but as someone above pointed out an atheist who tries to kill the priest in Parish is unaffected by his cross. The atheist domini, when asked about it in the relationship building/feeding scene says there’s nothing to fear. If the vampire is not overly religious and superstitious they can attend mass and stand on holy ground, bits of taster text allude to that former part.
So if a lot of atheist vampires are fine with crosses, why does West react differently? Despite his atheism and deep anti Indian religious sentiments too. It’s a question the games poses, that we don’t get a definitive answer on. It’s a strange contradiction for sure.
On another note I don’t think we get enough time to discover West’s weakness to silver. There’s a couple of points where we can research Werewolves but if we do something ask like write to Bowater about the Shepherds and Wolves book we don’t have to chance to learn about silver on time. It’s true that there’s a further slot if we get made tribune, but that means we can’t make a silver weapon or get extra people to help us. There’s plenty of slots like where the gunslinger fights West or the countless ‘investigate arsonist’ options, which is very anticlimactic anyway, that would give us a bit more time to better prepare.
It could be that it’s not a matter of the vampire’s belief but rather that of the person holding the cross or other religious symbols.
If the person using it has enough Faith, maybe that will translate into repelling an atheist vampire.
On the other hand, despite West’s disdain for Christianity, he actually has 63% Superstition. So, it could be that while he dislikes the Church, he still believes in an Higher Power.
But then again, the priest in the Parish has a very strong faith and the vampire just laughs in his face and kills him. So clearly it’s something beyond those stats, possibly it’s linked to the silver? I know in the code that if a character is overly violent and evil, they can touch a lady’s ring covered arm at the end of St Louis and react negatively to the silver. So perhaps the two are linked somehow?
Maybe the priest in the Parish, despite all of his loud protestations, isn’t actually all that faithful.
Or maybe it has to do with West losing himself more and more to his inner beast which leads to him becoming more vulnerable to the costumary weaknesses of the vampire such as silver or crosses.
The great mystery behind it all, that we know from the code, since the game hasn’t been completed sufficiently to get to it, is that there’s a ancient vampire under the city called Tryphon who somehow made West mad. If you’re able to wade through all the code, perhaps there might be an explanation for all this.
Yeah, it links to Memeskia’s hidden agenda and all the rest of it. If you look through this (replace the ‘startup’ bit for each scene, you’ll get the full scenes up) it’s referenced constantly: https://www.choiceofgames.com/vampire3/scenes/startup.txt
That’s really cool. I missed it completely during my first playthrough, I just thought that West was there for Memeskia and, possible, the MC if he is his childe.
Any advice for getting those scenes ingame or basically, all you have to do is earn enough rapport with Memeskia?
Also, I was under the impression that Adonis was the first and only Consul that the Society had until Stone’s revolution.
How does Sostrate fit into this?
@MisterJB The thing is a lot of it I’ve never been able to play because all the prerequisites to discover the full mystery behind West and so forth aren’t entirely enabled. But it’s been a matter of going through the code, a lot of it I can’t quite make out, and seeing what it says.
I think this is probably one of my main gripes with this game.
While it is great how much variation there is, it sucks how easy it is to miss really cool stuff like this ancient beneath St.Louis just because you missed something in a list of 7 things. I mean, do we really have to be a criminal to learn of this?
That’s an interesting theory. But if true Padre Carlos should have been able to kill West super easy. Also, I believe Sabine mentions that she still believed in the religion of her people. If so, West should have had a harder time throwing her around.
I’d say he has a hard time denying higher powers when He himself is an immortal being with superhuman abilities.
Or maybe it has to do with the blood… Estefania, I believe, harvests the blood…
I believe that’s basically what Padre Carlos says. The more one gives in to the Beast the more vulnerable one becomes to silver.
Maybe he’s the owner of the “chamber of secrets” found in Memphis?
If I recall correctly, he says that West is back/drawn to St. Louis because of a battle that took place there in the past.
The chamber is another interesting bit, because a character with high enough lore who joins the Klan can notice the similarities between the imagery of both. Decoration in their meeting places I mean. And Withers can let slip that she’s in cahoots with Harding if we tell her about Jesse James being killed. And we know that both have used old Confederates to try and retake control in the south, whether to get back at Apollo or for other reasons like taking back control. And likely had something to do with the Klan. It was also explain why she supports Lyschneski or whatever his name his, because he has an interest in discovering more about the mysteries underneath New Orleans.
But then, and well done if you’re still with me, how on earth does Andrew Jackson get brought into all this?
