Does Transfiguration follow the laws of equivalent exchange like Transmutation in FMA?
yeah that’s what make transfiguration so mana expensive , to transmute matery in energy you has to waste doble of matery to a x energy. e=mc° . So that’s way transfiguration is so expensive and only good to small target objetives that you could kill cheat with less expensive magics
I’m going to further elaborate on what I said about characters.
Academagia manages to handle a cast of over 100 characters in a number of different ways. Each character has one adventure devoted to them. That would be a single vignette in a choice game. I think they expand on this with just raw code of having people attack you, etc, randomly, randomly adding in names to actions, they’ll randomly show up in vignettes, and the formation of your clique. If I recall they also show up in the occasional adventure.
While you could manage a choicescript game in a similar manner, I’d say choose to start small instead. Have a look at Hanako Games’ Magical Diary. It’s similar to Academagia but the cast is a lot smaller, and it only tackles one of the four colleges in the first game.
Also look at Waywalker’s University, it’s the choice game most similar to what you’re intending to do setting-wise. It has a handful of teachers, a few clubs you can join, a handful of students who can be your friends, a few that are your enemies. This is far, far easier to keep control of, while having an interesting storyline.
Have a look at Zombie Exodus too. Zombie Exodus is the game which handles NPCs in the most elaborate manner. At one point you can have Emma, Heather, Tom, Mindy, Uncle Lou, Jason, Devlin, Eugene, Candace, Carl, Badger, Colt, Kelly, River, Starr and Toby. Not to mention other characters who’re also around but play less important roles. That’s sixteen characters, it’s absolutely crazy and it’s a huge amount to keep track of. Just have a peek at JimD’s code for any scene. It needs to take into consideration who’s alive, who’s in the group, who likes you, who hates you, your past actions, who may or may not be present in any given scene. It also needs to consider which of the characters you’re in a relationship with. And that’s just 16 characters, but they add so many layers of complexity to the game.
Keep in mind that Zombie Exodus started out with you. Then Emma and Heather. An encounter with Devlin. Then slowly the group started getting larger and larger.
Anyway I’d say think about your cast. Think about what characters you need. Think about what you can control. I, for one, would never dream of doing what JimD’s done with Zombies Exodus. It’s far, far too complicated for me. I marvel at what he’s done, just as I marvel at the sheer number of characters in Academagia, however there’s no way I could even consider tackling that.
@MaraJade Then I’m definitely practicing Charms and Transfiguration. I will be Edward Elric. Now where’s that axe? Need to chop of an arm and a leg…
Oh, good! I was scared you’d never finish the romantic relationships. And also, can you manage a network of “spies,” per se? So you know who’s against you, and other things, etc…
One of the things I love about Academagia is the insane amount of freedom afforded to players. You, and not the developer, decide who you want to befriend or antagonize. As much as I would love to make things easier for myself, I think that taking away this choice will really hurt my vision of the game. The appeal of Choice Games is that they allow players varying degrees of freedom in how they shape their world – and for me, it’s important to be able to choose your friends and enemies.
I’ll admit, having 84 interactable students is too ambitious, I’ll probably narrow it down to 7-8 per college, but it’s easier to pull off than it seems. As long as your story is plot-driven rather than character-driven, handling many students is possible. And like you said, Academagia uses many tricks to create the illusion of a large cast. I can think of some I can use in the choicescript format:
- Minor characters who don’t require names: scenes where you interact with students that you may never see again
- Dialogue injections: Set variable ‘cliquemember1’ as “Ron Weaseley”. When you go off on an adventure, ${cliquemember1} shows up and does things
- At least 1 dedicated, extended scene/vignette for each character. And if they can be romanced, a dedicated scene for that too
Of course, the problem with Academagia’s cast is that sometimes it feels like your choices don’t matter, or that your interactions with the characters are generic. Like you suggested, I could start by fleshing out only 2 characters per college, with extended scenes and more character-specific quests, which would give the cast depth as well as breadth.
Do you think that would work? To start with 2 detailed characters and 5 other ‘supporting’ ones per college. This way if players wanted to see more of a specific minor character, I could then work on that one.
Another thing I could do is limit the size of my clique. If the maximum clique size is 3 members, then instead of getting myself into a situation like Zombie Exodus where I have to keep track of character variables for 42 (!!!) students, I could instead just keep track of 3 clique variables. That would make things significantly easier, coding-wise, and it would still allow players the option of choosing their allies.
Have you ever made a game before?
I’ll suggest take a scene, anything and try writing it with different options.
I have a game with dragons, for instance. Stupid me decided to have five dragons. Five is a small number, isn’t it? However it means every single scene I need to write sections for the reactions of each dragon.
So I have
You arrive at the restaurant.
*if (dragon="fire") Sparky decides to show off and flambeau the soup. Everyone's impressed. You're not sure if he's started a culinary trend, or if they're just scared he'll set fire to them.
*if (dragon="water") Aqua doesn't sit still, she spots a few stray crumbs and off she flies to clean it up. A smudge on a wine glass is quickly erased. A dirty plate is carried through to the kitchen. It seems as if she's found her vocation in life.
*if (dragon="poison") Swampy is so happy to arrive. The hostess however takes one look at him though and shakes her head. "You can't bring that in here. It smells." Swampy drools a little, tail thumping hopefully on the ground. Maybe if you both stand blocking the door, preventing anyone else from entering she'll change her mind. She crosses her arms and stares at you sternly. Maybe not.
*if (dragon="song") While you're waiting for your first course to arrive Chime decides to make music by blowing on the wine glasses. Deciding that's not enough she then starts to bang the cutlery together. The waiter hurries over, not at all impressed with the impromptu concert.
*if (dragon="heal") Lilac clings close to you, gazing curiously around at his surroundings. The flowers in the vase on the centre of the table catch his attention and he delicately nibbles at a few. "Those aren't for eating." The waiter chides. Lilac startles at the sound of the harsh voice and immediately takes refuge under the table.
So one scene, five different iterations if I want the dragons to have personality. You’ve a similar issue if you have five different best friends.
Speaking of which, I also have a number of love interests in the game. So imagine it was a date. In order to write the above scene properly, I then have to write it with each possible love interest.
Now there are ways to cheat. You can do stuff like.
You arrive at the restaurant with ${dragonname} and you order some ${dragonfood} for ${dragonhim}.
That’s lacking in personality though and if you use that trick frequently, you might as well just have the one dragon.
Take Choice of Romance 3. You have two romance options, yet a lot of their dialogue is just interchangeable. Two completely different characters saying the exact same thing.
The main thing is I don’t want to see you getting overwhelmed. So I’ll say try it out first. Do a small scene, however you intend to use your characters. See how many you can handle.
Test out the cliques. That would at least make things manageable. Three cliques, sporty, academic and musical maybe?
I understand your concern, but don’t worry, I know what I’m getting into. 
Again, I want to emphasize the difference between plot-driven and character-driven scenes. In plot-driven scenes, characters usually react to a situation in similar ways, no matter how different their personalities are. For example, if you’re adventuring in a dungeon and set off a fireball trap, your dragons are probably going to try to evade it and let out an exclamation of surprise, no matter how different they normally are.
In these situations, using the “cheat” wouldn’t necessarily make them generic.
Certainly, I COULD write out individualized reactions for every dragon: for exampe, I could have your water dragon try to dispell the fireball with her powers, or I could try to have your fire dragon control the fireball – but where’s the fun in that? If I write a scene like this, your dragon friends start becoming the “main actors” of that scene, instead of you. In this game, I want you to be the one to counter that fireball with your Primal abilities, or dispell it with Negation – not your friends.
Sometimes it’s not necessary to place the focus on the characters – you could focus on the setting instead. In your example, your dragons follow you into a restaurant and order something based on their personality. But the scene could be written in an entirely different way: it could focus on the atmosphere of the restaurant, the way the waiters glare at you (“a group of students at a high-class restaurant? Almost certainly going to be poor”), and other details that bring the setting, rather than your companions, to life.
Similarly in games like Academagia, you are usually the sole determinant of an outcome. Your skills and your stats determine whether the adventure succeeds. Characters are mostly there for flavour, but they shouldn’t steal the spotlight from you.
Now, that’s for plot-driven scenes.
Of course, when the scene becomes more character-driven , it should be tailored to the individual student. That’s why I have dedicated extended scenes for each student – you guys do your own thing, and the focus is as much on them as it is on you. In these scenes, you get to know them personally, and their dialogue is unique and reflective of their temperament.
Some games are entirely character-driven. That’s not a bad thing, but it’s more appropriate for games like HG’s Magical Diary (great game, by the way), which is technically more of a Dating Sim set in a magical school than an RPG/Choice game.
edit
I hope I don’t come off as too rigid , I really do appreciate the feedback and the concerns you brought up. But if I made the cast significantly smaller, I feel like it wouldn’t be much of a school.
Oh no, you’re not coming across as rigid at all. You have an idea of what you want from your game and are sticking to it, which is great.
Hearing all this makes me worry about my own game (Chronological Caverns), given I was intending the player to be from one of 8 different time zones, to have four possible character types in each zone, to befriend one of three possible allies at the start, for all of those possible three and three other characters to be romance options, to have three possible factions for the player to ally with AND let the player decide an important element regarding the main enemy from one of three options.
It occurs to me that’s a lot of stuff. And that’s just one game, given I have a second one in mind too.
@Derekmetaltron I take Zombie Exodus as the prime example of a long game, which has lots of choices, which matter. Examine how it manages to achieve that. Poke at the code. Play it a few times. Decide how much of your choices you actually need.
With Zombie Exodus you have the choice of 5 different careers. Carpenter, Minister, Athlete, Soldier, Scientist. Mostly that effects stats but there are situations where each is taken into consideration. So you won’t be offerring confession if you’re a basketball star.
It’s the dealings with people in which it really shines though and the sheer depth of possibilities. There are four main characters who’re always with you regardless, but all the other possibilities are built on top of that.
Apex Patrol does a fantastic job of having a villain who can have 4 (I think) completely different motivations.
I think to some extent you need to ask what’s most important, a zillion choices and possibilities or story. And do the choices you have actually increase replayability and make it more fun.
Like in the situation of Choice of the Dragon, where you have five different dragons you can romance, or none at all, but really it doesn’t matter in the slightest which you pick since none of it effects the game on any real level. I think sometimes you’re better to focus on doing a smaller amount of choices well.
@FairyGodfeather Thanks, I take ZE and Allen’s games as prime inspiration of how to devise my upcoming games too - Allen was in fact nice enough to send me the code for parts of Marine and Apex to show me how they worked, though I’ve only had recently to start learning stuff through that. I’ve had an idea that players would have their stats determined through their background with similar situations in each time (say a Gladiator, Viking or Space Marine all having a high strength score even if they happen to be from different eras) but they would also impact your relations and options as well. If my first two ideas go well I want to restart on my Ozoic idea, which will hopefully be my own Zombie Exodus, since I have a lots of ideas on what to do with it.
For the villain I have something akin to Apex’s effects for the Exec Officer and Villain in mind for my second game, without spoiling things too greatly, you’d have the chance to learn who of 3, maybe 4 options for the leader of your enemy. Whereas in CC, it’s going to be the type of enemy who works for the villain instead. But yes, I’ll likely need to decide how important the choices are, what’s there to be essential and what else will be background stuff.
@Derekmetaltron You can read any code on the website by just adding /scenes to the end of the url and looking in that folder. I found looking at code is one of the best sources for inspiration. I love to find neat little tricks that people do, even if it’s beyond me.
Paradox Factor was actually my favourite for looking at the code. (Which I can’t do anymore since it’s not out on chrome store.) I just couldn’t work out how it was done. Yet when I looked at the code, after playing it extensively, it was so simple, and incredible how he managed to do the time travel. I was amazed.
Hmm maybe we should be chatting about this on your thread, since I think we’re now spamming poor Evaporate’s.
@The_Ravenclaw
I love Snape:/ he was the biggest hero in the whole book.
@FairyGodfeather Sure, I’ll bump it up and open discussion a little. I have seen a few of the Scene folders, it is a good way for a game developer to see how it’s done.
@MaraJade Sorry, but I have to step in and say you are wrong about Transfiguration. It is most definitely not useless. You keep saying that any Transfiguration magic is always temporary with a very, very short duration. Going back to poison, since that seems to be the main topic concerning Transfiguration, you seemed to think that the poison would last only about five seconds before reverting to its normal state as wine when you said that it would need to be drank the instant the spell is cast to be effective. When is that ever the case, however? What RPG has Transfiguration magic that lasts that short a time? I would think that as long as the wizard can keep focus on it and keep the spell lasting, it will stay poison, at the very least. Otherwise the only practical use for it would be to wait for a large plank of wood to fall from the sky and Transfigure it into a sharp object the instant before it lands on top of someone to impale them and kill them (or a similar circumstance where it only takes a single moment for something to happen), and that is not very practical at all.
If you insist on a short duration for a poison, change the wine into a very quick-acting poison that will kill the target and then revert back to wine soon after they are dead, thus erasing the evidence of the poison. If you use a mundane poison, there will be poison in their systems, and it will be obvious that the person was killed by poison, but if the poison suddenly disappears and it appears as though the person was drinking normal, unenchanted wine, they will have to figure some other way that they could have been killed. Also, normal poison would have to be placed in the drink by hand, or levitated through the air to be applied, whereas a flick of a wrist and a quiet incantation could Transfigure the wine at the very instant the drink is being lifted to the target’s lips or even as they drink it, all from across the room where you can make a quick exit out the door.
Ejem @Galador this is a Magic setting no CSI about poison. You lost all about my messages ALL. Its not the duration is The COST of mana . If to transform wine in poison you.
1-Expent all your mana totally due all rpg make your spells cost doble as rest of magic.
2-The transmutation need be in the proximity of victim. Poison not.
3- You poison queen drink moving your hands and cause light effects Sure people dont note it at all.Why the drink is changing. Well supose they are so stupid to dont note it. the queen doesnt want drink in that moment. Maybe in 2 hours she doesnt drink you are waste all your mana for nothing,
I love trasmutation concept and if where do it right it was one of my favorites magic, but is terrible doing and developed it couldnt be practical when transform a great oil zone in fire to kill merchants cost same mana than destroy a entire game area with direct fire spells.
I hope this game doing it right, because i dont like direct magic. so transmutation could be a nice add if dont cost same magic transform a pot in a spoon same magic as kill ten enemies.
A good use to transmutation could be the burden or feather spell in morrowind even if not remember in what magic is there.
You transform mass of the target making it more heavy make him impossible moving . What is best spell ever i used it in my bard imperial in morrowind burden then stab them with my bow or tanto. or feather you to carry more loot or be extra dexterity.
So maybe i judge too badly transmutation here even if i dont wanna use it in game, i dont except mana cost is afordable or there is a burden feather spells to help in combat. So i would be a Azanell even if transfiguration is obligatory, after all im not obligated to use it in game i could just learn it and let there witnout use it.
Any way i only want learn mind magic and poison the rest of magic use is useless for my role play style but that dont means it had to be useless for you. I only talking for me not in general to all people
@MaraJade Transmutation can be in close range as well and still be useful, like in a dinner with the queen, It also adds availability instantly, you don’t have to look suspicious (in some cases at least.).Maybe if it’s white wine or something, it is the same colour as arsenic, right? I mainly want transfiguration to be like Edward Elric, I wanna be a badass, though I forgot it goes into more than just that.
Ooh, what if I group the students into cliques? Then instead of befriending them individually, you ‘join’ a clique, and they become the cast for your future adventures. And I can just check for clique variables instead of character variables. I can make the dialogue more unique, and members of the clique could actually realistically interact with each other. I think you were actually alluding to this in your earlier post, but I didn’t understand what you were getting at. x_x /facepalm
There would still be quite a lot of writing to do (2 cliques x 6 colleges = 12 variable checks), and I’d also have to keep the old system because some NPCs are loners and aren’t part of a clique. For the amount of effort involved, do you think this would make the game more fun?
P.S. for those who are interested, I found a painting that looks very similar to what I have in mind as the city of Tarant The only thing it’s missing are blimps and flying airships.