We've locked the Aura Clash thread for blatant racism

…what exactly would this achieve? What would this fix? Essentually what youre saying is to waste our time to piss them off instead of doing the logical thing and just banning any bigots from the forum.

I actually do not get how you think this would fix any problem? Do you think it would make them regret their words? Do you think it would make anon actually moderate?

“Why dont you harass the racists back?” Because it is much simpler for us to exclude them from this space. that’s solving it. The issue has already been addressed and the solution applied.

Are you actually trying to make an argument cause what are you on about?

One more time for the people that lack reading comprehension: His ban has nothing to do with the fucking game.

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Im broken up now :sob: cuz i just finished the update n i loved it and now it feels like cuz bros actions its not gonna grt finished

Seems rather reasonable. Anon’s Discord server was rife with bigots, racists, and outright Nazis, which, while undeniably deplorable, was initially none of CoG’s concern. However, when these undesirables began flooding the forums, creating a toxic environment and consuming an unreasonable amount of moderators’ time, action became necessary.

Since Anon refused to cooperate with the mod team despite multiple opportunities given to him, that left them no choice but to ban him and his game from this most esteemed forum.

An open-and-shut case.

Now, let me preface the next part by admitting I’ve only read through first two hundred posts in this thread, so if anything major has been posted since, then I might look like a complete tool, but…

One would assume that it wouldn’t be much of a problem for the mods to post some clear evidence of having to deal with multiple bad actors originating from AC thread/Discord in a short period of time. Since if the only thing they were forced to do was to ban a user or two once in a blue moon it would hardly justify the claim of excessive moderator burden.
Otherwise, the closest thing to that claim right now is that AC thread was overly “horny” to the point of some users posting smut fanfics there. But this was dealt with rather swiftly by simply creating a dedicated NSFW thread, once again undermining the claims made by the mods.
Sure, the general quality of the discussion in AC thread was rather low, but it doesn’t warrant purging the game and its author from the forums.

Furthermore, one would expect you to be able to provide some screenshots of mods approaching Anon and asking him to rein in his Discord server, offering him a chance to make amends, or warning him of potential consequences. This is particularly important given Anon’s recent claim that no one ever contacted him regarding these issues.

At present, the only “evidence” provided consists of screenshots of slurs being used with impunity on Anon’s server and him doing nothing to curb it, forcing me to call bullshit on all this. Sure, since the ban there were more “incriminating” things posted on that server - calling people pedos, insulting individual mods, but it’s hardly relevant to this ban.

Additionally, this whole “wasting moderators time” justification was most recently used against two regulars in the Politics thread, who received six-month bans from Bryce shortly after his close friend, Juan, openly announced that he will be flagging every post made by them (alright, it was only in regards to Ramses, but it’s safe to assume the other guy got the same treatment by him).
It’s safe to assume that the same thing has happened here – some chronically online people likely bombarded the mod team with complaints about Anon’s Discord or flagged posts in his thread they found objectionable. And since Anon is…well, an anon and those people are on the “”right” side of history”, the decision the mod team had to take was rather obvious.

I just wish you had been more transparent about it – “We disagree with the politics of this author and their fanbase, which conflict with our core values, and thus we are removing them from the forum.” See how simple that was?

Either way, assuming this post doesn’t get hidden or get me banned, my shift starts in less than two hours, therefore I’ll be replying at my own pace. Might not have time to reply till the weekend.

EDIT Being at work, I don’t really have time to proofread or to pretty it up, so from now on my post will be in quite a rough state.

@MadAdam

You are willfully disregarding facts and bringing the argument from A to B to C with no logical/factual connections

If you had possessed reasoning skills exceeding those of an average middle schooler, you would have no problem understanding the connection between A, B and C.

Bryce’s chronically online friend had proudly announced that he will be flagging every post made by a certain user for his continuous defence of Israeli policies, which Juan found unacceptable (A). The other guy who got banned has also been a staunch defender of Israel (and possibly an Israeli himself, but I’m not sure, nor does it really matter), so it is indeed safe to assume that Juan (and his ilk) have been mass flagging his posts too (B).

How is it relevant to this ban (C)?

Well, in the politics thread, Bryce, instead of banning those wasting his time with false reports, has banned two users who didn’t break any rules other than “taking too much of his time”. Something they couldn’t help since every post they were making would get flagged.

Ultimately, Bryce has resolved that situation that way because it was his friends on one side and people he didn’t personally agree with on the other.

The same situation has been repeated here - on one hand some “4chan weirdo and his incel fans”, on the other Bryce’s friends and allies. The choice was rather clear for someone who has shown a tendency towards nepotism before.

@apple

NGL I don’t know why this is a controversial ban reasoning

I made it rather clear in my post, no? Provide some evidence of bad actors from Anon’s server repeatedly attempting to pollute these forums with their chud ways (AKA “wasting moderators’ time”) and no more questions in regards to that will be asked. By me, at the very least.

I’ve somehow managed to survive on this forum for over a decade now just fine despite getting fairly heated

Because ultimately you align ideologically with the “locals”.

It is totally fine for the locally beloved author to literally call people refusing to cast their votes subhuman. Wish for Morgenthau plan against Trumpists or lamenting how the tens of millions of them can’t be lynched the same way some French mathematician was.
You can be as extreme in your views as you desire as long as you are a part of the in-group. Ultimately, all your sins will be forgiven.

@Think_Manner

Are you being serious?

Are you?

The burden of proof, ever heard of it? You can’t just accuse someone and then refuse to provide any evidence because it would be too bothersome to gather.

Nobody said anything about being horny or writing smut

Reading comprehension is strong in this one…

What was meant here is there were no mass rule-breaking going on there, unless one considers being “horny” to be that.

As for MC’s sister, those users were condemned by the author himself right when that was brought up. He made his stance opposing incest more than clear.

Do you really believe that? Does it make sense to you?

All the more reason why they should just release the screencaps of their DMs with Anon. That would be fairly humiliating for him to have his childish lies exposed like that. Would make him look like a complete idiot. Possibly even cost him a patron or two.

When you accuse someone of something, even in such an environment as a privately-owned forum, there’s absolutely no benefit in withholding evidence… assuming you possess it in the first place, that is.

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People will always differ on morality after all it’s human to have preference. Most of the people we trust and hold in high regards like religious leaders end up disappointing us. I prefer to not be involved in speculations and moral discussion because one man’s meat is another’s poison. What I’d like to know is, what happens to the WIP going forward?

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Ok, I don’t really want to engage, because you’re stance is clear. But this is one of the most dizzying cases of logic I’ve ever read. I’m gonna discount the fact that you are defending racist homophobes, no that’s not it. In your retort, you use the words, “it’s safe to assume” twice, when it is clearly not safe to assume. You are willfully disregarding facts and bringing the argument from A to B to C with no logical/factual connections between those points other than you are a Karen yelling on your lawn “assuming” a lot of things that simply aren’t true. This is becoming tiresome.

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If I had to guess, the author will probably still want to monetise his work when it is finished, so the game will probably end up being ported to twine or something similar. I don’t think they’d be allowed to use choicescript for a final paid release anymore, but I’m def not an expert so take my words with a grain of salt please!

On another note, I’d like to take the opportunity to (as many people above me have also done) thank the moderators for their patience and for the way they handled the situation. This was clearly a thought-out decision over many months, and I appreciate the transparency on this thread! A lot of different opinions have been shared, and some have definitely made me a bit sad lol but this was clearly a long-time coming situation that couldn’t be ignored anymore, and i’m glad it wasn’t. So, once again, thank you to the mod team! Hoping this whole thing blows over soon

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NGL I don’t know why this is a controversial ban reasoning. Yes it is, technically speaking, rather broad, but it’s not as if it’s unwarranted. All it means is “we keep getting flags and messages because of your conduct, such that it’s clearly becoming a drag on the quality of the forum, please fuck off”. IDK why people say they should “do their jobs” instead, this is them doing their jobs by removing problem users. I’ve somehow managed to survive on this forum for over a decade now just fine despite getting fairly heated (and having had posts removed by the mods for said heat) at times by just… not being a shitter 95% of the time. It really isn’t that hard.

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Are you being serious? I really can’t tell because according to you, moderators are supposed to screenshot every single action they take and create an evidence folder like those 14 years on discord with nothing better to do.

Nobody said anything about being horny or writing smut. Unless you mean what’s been said about paedophiles infiltrating this forum and talking about wanting to fuck the MCs underage sister. In which case, that’s not being horny, that’s being fucking disgusting.

Nobody ever contacted him in the whole year that it’s been a problem and mods just waited for the problem to be magically solved instead of just talking to him and asking him to keep it tidy enough that it’s not a headache for them? Do you really believe that? Does it make sense to you? I’ve seen Anon getting complaints about his discord on Reddit and do you know how he responded? He said that his fans (the bigoted homophobic, misogynistic, racist fuckers) matter to him and the ones with complaints don’t. Are you really defending a guy like this?

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OFF-TOPIC

I’ve seen mentioned a couple of times the “anti-gay” code of Aura Clash. As a software developer I’m actually curious how the hell did he manage that, what kind of spaghetti code did he create to prevent the game from being modded? If any one knows and can share, at least a bird’s eye view of the implementation, I’d be interested.

And just to be clear, so people don’t get the wrong idea, I’m not trying to replicate it, being bisexual myself, I’m just genuinely curious.


Okay, got it. It wasn’t really preventing people from modding it, just periodically checking stats and resetting values if the gender was the same (gay romance). That is really extra work just to be spiteful. :joy: What a clown.

I thought it would either be something ingenious or a code so bad it would make it unmoddable. Turns out it was just a periodic dumb check.


If it was a subroutine, it would be particularly easy to remove, but yeah, I can see how that would be difficult for the casual player.


ffs, it wasn’t a subroutine! :joy: :joy: :joy: :joy:

The guy was really copy-pasting the same piece of code every now and then.


I do like to give people the benefit of the doubt–although, given the wider context I’m less inclined at the moment–, however I did a quick search through the souce files and found the reset snippet a few times, specifically at chapter2mission, chapter4, chapter5 and chapter6. To be fair, there’s none at the later chapters, but I’m not willing to stick my neck out for this guy.

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It can be modded out, pretty sure someone posted a modded version on cogdemos not so long ago, is just that an average reader won’t be able to change a couple vars and call it a day.

I guess that’s why people started to call it “anti-gay”. This weird part of code was brought up multiple times, as early as the game came out, but he always brushed it off. It’s not that the man is unskilled in coding, the rest of his code is fairly clean, and he always was able to fix anything that was brought to his eyes, he just never bothered to touch up that part of it for whatever reason.

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If it makes you feel any better, we would never be able to say of anon that his work ethic isn’t up to scratch. I doubt he’ll quit. Not when he’s this far in and has been successful thus far. It’ll likely be posted elsewhere. Perfectly understandable to be upset about losing the game, but I don’t think you’ve lost it quite yet. In fact, it might be more motivating considering spite is a powerful competitive drive, lol.

Were you under the impression I was saying Anon is the victim? I’m not sure how to read this comment’s tone, if it was addressed to me or just in general. Because if you scroll through my comments a bit, you can see I am definitively not on his side. I was joking that he personally feels he is being attacked by us unjustly and is spiteful, not that he is right. And I was comforting someone upset about the possibility that his ban means the end of the game outside of anything else. Which, it probably doesn’t considering he can bring it absolutely anywhere except here.

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Then that would count as censorship since this is a public forum and people are allowed to express their opinions.

Annoying or not, this thread was created for a reason.

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It’s good to see people taking a strong stance against things like this. The internet’s full of enough trolls as it is.
A completely deserved ban, and the right call from the CoG staff. :+1:

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Wow thats delusional Fr! Anon is not the hero of this story. Infact no one is the hero or villain here, actions have consequences and this is the consequence. Being an extremely disgusting bigot aside, he is not some underdog sticking it to the institution that is trying to push him down. This is the consequence of enabling a toxic machine that will keep churning out ambiguous nazi edgelords. Trying to paint us sane people as the bad guys is truly pathetic in front of so much obvious evidence. And i am pretty sure the other authors can make their own, even better stories in spite of Anon, slandering them all the time.

You are are absolutely correct to give people the benefit of the doubt. But if this incident was in a vaccum? Yeah this code would look innocent. But this is not a vaccum and we all know the context and the context makes this anti-gay code make much more sense.

I apologise as it does seem I am targeting you, also i didn’t get the joke. But yeah in general a shit ton of people still believe Anon has done nothing wrong and everyone is jealous of his talent and want to bring him down because he was spitting facs that the gay normies were too afraid to say. So far this is the sentiment of his general audience so…

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Short answer is, he didn’t.

There were a few options in the early chapters of the game, which generated romance points and weren’t gated behind gender check. Likely an oversight, as that would potentially create issues down the road, when characters would use romance text variants written with assumption the MC is of certain gender, which wouldn’t necessarily match MC’s actual gender in that particular player’s play through.

Tracking down all such options to fix them takes time and also doesn’t do anything for saves which already got the romance points mixed up. So two chapters (out of 4) published afterwards got a code at the start, which resets romance points in such scenarios, as a simple catch-all bandaid.

Some people would misinterpret that fix and/or took it as personal attack and decided it was their obligation to spread that misinterpretation wherever they could. Others who heard of it took it for a fact. And here we are.

If you check the link posted a bit upthread, you’ll note that the person who posted the code excerpt admit themselves, “I have neither the interests nor the efforts to check the rest of the code, but i’d say it’s fair to assume there’s more of this gender check code laying around”. If they did bother to check, they’d find out their “fair assumption” was just that, an assumption. You know how those tend to turn out.

This is an interesting issue – if i get it right, the Choicescript license has a clause that the work produced with it can’t be monetized outside of publishing through CoG. At the same time, CoG publishing through the HostedGames currently has only three real requirements: #1 the game can’t have certain content, #2 the game can’t have any AI-generated content, #3 the full version of the game has to undergo beta process through a thread on forums.

AC wouldn’t pass the #2 requirement (it has some AI-generated portraits) but presuming those were removed, it doesn’t really break #1. But at the same time, the #3 was made impossible by CoG itself, by closing down the very thread which was for the beta test of the game, as well as banning the author. Which created a bit of paragraph-22 case: the game can’t be published without beta-test but the author is prevented from performing that beta-test, and in this particular case it’s not because the game somehow breaks the rules, but because the author’s actions were found unacceptable.

Now, suppose the game actually gets finished, would CoG refuse to publish it, based on this? That’s just a guess for anyone but the company itself. Platform switch is an option (some authors did just that) but given what size AC is already, i don’t envy anyone who’d try to port such a project.

To be precise, chapters 2 & 4 and 5 have a single check for “childhood friend” romance. The only chapter which has checks for other ROs (and the one which got paraded around as the supposed proof of “anti-gay code spread throughout the game”) is Ch.6. In other words, the game isn’t targeting all same-sex romances at every opportunity in some sort of encompassing campaign, like some would present it. The instructions (ant their scope) coincide with reported errors which could occur prior to those checks, and since they are not repeated it the later chapters i find it much more believable that’s all they’re, a patch over results of said bugs, than anything else.

Wish people stopped propagating this nonsense. Fairly sure there’s quite a few published CoG games which limit availability of romances to certain gender combinations, and that includes blocking gay relationships in some cases. Going with this logic/naming they all use “anti-gay code”.

The public version of the demo was on cogdemos for months now, with code made visible to all. Besides, what, you think a guy who refused to even touch his own cesspool of a discord would remove some of the “anti-gay code” from his script but not all of it because, what? Clearly he isn’t embarrassed at all about what he’s doing.

It’s how the script was all along, then got blown out of proportion on reddit.

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I’ll be blunt, Ramses was asked to try to be more balanced and nuanced.

He was warned and suspended prior.

He did not alter his behavior and was suspended because by the end he was getting around 20-30 replies dedicated to refuting his claims and I just couldn’t keep up with all the flags and arguments so I made the choice after an egregious one that was bordering genocide denial to suspend him again.

I am not obligated to explain my choice, I’m doing so now so that people can understand that most of moderation is done like this.

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Hello @dfabulich
Thanks for acting. Your are right a little late but better then never. All so good Riplance. We need that rule really.

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Regarding the thread being open or closed:

However for those who don’t want to view the thread, you can mute it by scrolling down to the bottom and clicking on the bell notification icon as below:

image

It will open a drop-down menu with notification options for the thread. If you select the “muted” option, it will not appear on the front page of the forum.

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Lmfao.

Yeah man, I also wrote the new rule myself, forced Dan to give me his account so I could write up the announcement and make all the bans, and have Jason ubering me sandwiches every couple hours.

This I did after my daily brainwashing process where I turn Cataphrak into a puppet advocate for all my own politics and ensured Isobel will enact world communism after she married my OC and shoots all the nobles.

You people really need to get off my dick. It’s annoying being your boogeyman.

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Just consider yourself proud to be the new Juan wick

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