The Wayhaven Chronicles General Discussion (SPOILER FREE FOR BOOK THREE!)

I hate that this makes perfect sense and fits so well, but it also made me laugh out loud in a public place(ish it is public, but I was the only one there at the moment, so win), so now I’m both annoyed it works and that it made me laugh.

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That post was actually the sequel to Gore’s 2006’s An Inconvenient Truth: JBento’s 2022’s An Annoying Truth.

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This is a very good point, and a good summation on why M is having such trouble. A couple of things that don’t quite fit…

Only M isn’t polite. I don’t think they’d even do this for the rest of UB (they can get their own damned seats/windows/whatever). This was one of those instinctive things that, had they thought on it, would have sent them into a frowning face moment of “wtf is happening?”

The house of mirrors thing fits perfectly. Same with arm of the chair. We’ve seen M plop down next to F on occasion, so when they’re comfortable, they do sit or sit near one of the team. But, again, there’s no thought process to it–M just goes with what feels right and plopping on the arm of the chair next to the MC feels right and, like you said, MC is part of the team now, so whatevs.

You also parsed the rooftop scene perfectly. It’s just “weird.” I think the only time M has really been hit with, “something is amiss here” was in the bk3 demo. First, it was at the supernaturals’ house after they head to the car and M thinks that they know lust, and this isn’t just lust. But they don’t get it.

Next, is the bakery scene. Again, they act romantically without realizing it. But there are other issues at play in this scene. Their reaction completely contradicts Sera’s claims that M will be cool with realizing it’s love and what we’ve been told about M not caring what other people think. Because M didn’t just scoff at Haley’s comment, they went full-on, balls-to-the-wall denial and got pissed it was suggested. Then they chase after the MC if they leave but quickly give up.

Again, you get the “I don’t get this” (this time, they say it out loud) when the MC shows up at the warehouse and M tries to make amends about what happened at the bakery. Amusingly, M says this not five minutes after they were thinking to themselves that the MC is just fun to screw or chase (if the MC said no to meaningless sex) then wonder why they even give a crap if the MC is hurt over what they said.

What my point is here is that, you are correct about M not being able to correlate their behavior with actually having feelings (past team loyalty) for the MC, but I think there is more than that. M, who is all “I don’t care what people think unless it’s something that can get them into bed” can’t abide anyone thinking they care for the MC. And they react in a violently negative way (jerking away from the MC A-style, like in the first scene of b3 if M gets caring about the MC, or snapping at Haley and all but calling the MC a fucktoy because they can’t stand anyone thinking it’s more than that). Throw in their stubborn resistance about “feelings” (M is like “that’s the plague, and so are relationships!”) and you have the makings of something more miserable and lengthy than A’s path.

I have been convinced for a long time that it will take something extreme to make M realize their feelings (i.e., them almost losing the MC for good), but after reading what you wrote, I think it may require a few elements. Unfortunately, I think one of them is the MC declaring their feelings first to get M thinking–and I think that, when the MC does that, it might send M scurrying away for a bit (avoiding the MC because “it’s just sex/want sex” and don’t want to give the wrong signals). Even then, I don’t expect M to realize it. It’s if something traumatic happens after that, that M will get hit with the reality.

I’ve always pictured the moment as something entirely not romantic. Like M and the MC are arguing, and the MC (being fed up with hot/cold) is like “What the fuck do you care?” and M’s like, “Because I love you, you idiot!” MC: stares at M like they were possessed by an alien

Of course, that may just be fitting for my M-mancer, but I just can’t see M making a big deal of it. Or even saying it unless something forces the issue.

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Rationalisation is a hell of a drug. Apparently, not one vampires are immune to. Better than DMB.

“Weird.” isn’t my parsing, it’s M’s. They literally go “Weird.” when the POV switches to them at the end of the scene. It’s right near the end, before they light up the cigarette (IIRC; it’s been a while). So M knows SOMETHING is amiss, but it’s, y’know, eels (filling up her hovercraft). And eels aren’t fish.

I can’t speak to the B3 events yet, but hopefully Soon :tm: . :smile:

EDIT: Also, a recent ask again solidifies M as best partner (in this case, tied with N):

Ask

It’s made pretty obvious the the Detective is absolutely exhausted- like in the Book 3 demo when they mention finding time to advertise the blood drive between everything else.

How would the ROs react to finding the MC passed out on one of the common room couches- especially if they fell asleep surrounded by work or research?

Anonymous

Yeah, the MC is sooo tired in Book Three, lol! I actually hadn’t planned this, and it wasn’t until Nai pointed it out that I realised :smiley:

At this point in the romance?

Adam/Ava: Would feel an ounce of pride that the MC had been working so hard and so late, for a start :smiley: But then they would probably be torn between waking the MC or leaving them, in the end just tidying around them to try and make them comfier, possibly throwing their jacket over them (could they have used a blanket? Yes. Did they unconsciously want the MC to know they care and that’s why they used their jacket? Yes, definitely!)

Nate/Nat: Would try to wake the MC carefully in order to help them to an actual bed so they didn’t ache in the morning, while gently saying that the MC shouldn’t push themself so hard until they pass out at their desk.

Felix/Farah: Would probably just watch the MC for a while with a happy smile and then sit with them until they woke up, not wanting to disturb them but wanting to be there in case they needed anything.

Mason/Morgan: “Hey, what are you doing? You’re human, You’re going to have a stiff neck if you sleep like that.” Lift their chin to check their face for exhaustion. “Go to bed already.” Then walk with them to make sure they actually went, lol.

Thank you so much for the ask! :slight_smile:

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And self awareness is not for everyone (hello M and A!).

And yeah, I knew you weren’t the one who said “weird” but you were the one who defined why M used it. I had tried working that out as well, and came to a similar conclusion as you, that M simply can’t do the math on it. Unless I am in a particularly frustrated mood with waiting for M to catch a clue, at which point, I jump to assuming the worst and figuring M will never feel a damned thing because M’s words and actions are so discordant that it gives me (and my M-mancer) whiplash.

OMG, that ask. I saw that and grinned. I find it interesting that the best responses were from M and N. And Sera even said that it was at this point in the romance. M: I couldn’t care less about the MC. sees them sleeping at a weird angle, yells at them to wake up, checks their face and frowns because they’re tired Go to bed! nudges them along till they get there :heart:

Edit: I think my M-mancer would be wondering if she was still asleep and in some weird dream, and glancing at him the whole way like he was an alien. She figures the only time he wants to be around her is for sex or because he has to for UB stuff, lol.

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It’ll never not be peak irony that M “wtf are even emotions that aren’t anger and lust” Nosurname is the best at caring. Or maybe it ISN’T ironic. Maybe it’s a reflection of the fact that their brain isn’t getting in the way and having them baby the Detective because they’re human. Remember the start of B2, where they’re the only ones that DON’T go “oh woe is I that I couldn’t protect you from Murphy”? Newsflash to the non-M three: me having my forearm torn to shreds isn’t actually about youuuuuuuu.

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I’ve been teetering on the idea of playing these books and I’m glad I finally gave in. I loved them enough to even go and romance every single character which I usually don’t. And I love N so much I thought nothing could top that but then I romanced F and they are so sickeningly sweet it makes me happy. My little meow meow… forever torn on N and F now. Woe.

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This series was my very first experience with IF and I was not at all prepared for the addiction it spawned!
I had to play Wayhaven through with each RO, and then switch their genders and play them all again!
I think my favorites are A and N, (I can’t decide if I prefer them separately or together!) and I love switching up the relationship with Rebecca.

While I wait for Book 3, I began exploring other CoGs, discovered HGs and HCs too, and suffice it to say, I may or may not have purchased 80+ titles. :open_mouth::see_no_evil:

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Another M-ask today that was quite interesting…

Makes me even more curious about where bk3 is going with M…

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“At the end of the Book Three demo, I think even M is starting to realise that the loyalty they feel towards the MC isn’t the same as they feel with the rest of UB, and they’re not sure how to work out why that is.”

And it only took Sanja literally telling them exactly that. The vampire with super-hearing finally hears.

M’s hovercraft is full of eels, but eels are clearly not fish.

This is the analogy that never ends, it goes on and on my frieeeeeend.

I finally found one that works, I’m not letting go of it that easily. :stuck_out_tongue:

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Still on that analogy then?

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Not sure Sanja actually helped M there. M was basically typical M, sneering at all the “destiny” mumbo jumbo. He doesn’t buy it at the carnival, even if it does give him pause before he blows it off and storms out of the tent.

Even in the unseen scene, where he encounters Sanja again, he tells her to piss off because what she says isn’t useful. Again, M needs a hammer to the head–hinting and doublespeak are of no use to them, unless it’s sexual, which they pick up on fast!

Going with your eel/fish analogy, M is looking at the MC at this point, comparing them to the rest of the team (also eels), but this eel has a weird coloring to it, not the same as the others in UB. But it’s still not a fish… just a weird eel.

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If seeing the future were ever useful, all seers would be millionaires from winning the lottery and wouldn’t need to be working in carnivals.

A:
image
N:
image
F:
image
MC:
image
It’s gonna be a shock.

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So, so fitting…

F (because you’re right and F would be helpful): Hey, M, that’s a fish.
M, glaring: What the hell are you talking about? It’s an eel!
F, smirking: No, it’s called an electric eel, but–
M, smirking: Yeah, the MC definitely has some sparks when–
F, rolling eyes: It’s a knifefish. snorts at M’s dumb look It’s the only animal on the planet that can paralyze its prey using electrical current. And it’s a fish.
M, frowning, looking at the MC…: Well, shit…

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F is super-appropriate for that sketch, because they have a pretty big rapport with animals, a result of their Echo nature, where all animals are intelligent and can talk.

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For you fellow M-mancers out there… I did a happy dance on this one:

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I don’t really care if M hooks up with people in a version of the story where him and the detective are just friends/coworkers, but whew. Imagine M hooking up with people WHILE MC and M are in their weird ass not-relationship. That would be horrible :sob::sob::sob:

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Yeah, I had fears of M doing that (hooking up with other people while in their “no strings, not-a-relationship-thing”) but I don’t think Sera would do that to us. I think she might shove M’s exes in our faces for the angst, though. She seems to like torturing M-mancers as much as A-mancers, just in different ways.

But I actually had no desire to see M hooking up with people constantly in the other routes, so this made me happy.

By the same token, I kinda wished that the MC on M’s route (and A’s, honestly) could “date” people, since M is “no-strings-I-don’t-do-dates” and A is just… longing looks and shit. Not that my MCs would do it (my M-mancer has eyes for no one but M, even if she thinks she’s nothing but a fucktoy to him, and my A-mancer probably wouldn’t), but it’d be nice to have the option.

Plus, there’s no way in hell my M or A detectives would ask them to go to what is basically a dinner date to Tina’s or Verda’s with them, but they would totally ask someone else just to let Verda meet a supernatural and, on Tina’s route, to get her to shut up about the supernatural. So being able to date someone else for that situation would be perfect. Plus, M and A could suck on it–let A mope and M wonder if the MC is going to make out with their date. If M doesn’t like it, they shouldn’t be such an ass about not wanting to be around the MC unless it’s for work or screwing, and if A doesn’t like it, they can start showing how they actually feel.

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The reaction you get if you turn M down at your apartment pretty much ensured me this won’t happen.

Geographically tricky, though. Unless they’re other agents. :thinking: I’m not sure how much angst you could get out of that, though? I mean, it’s not like M would’ve had an emotional connection with them, and you can ALREADY have sex with M, so at most it’d be angst for the exes?

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I think he’s banged a lot of other agents (the last Christmas scenario showed one that works at the facility who is still in love with M–and she’s apparently the team leader of a team we may encounter in b3, if I remember correctly), so this is possible.

As for angst… it’s all in the optics. In a no-strings thing, if the MC wanders up at the right moment–like when one of these exes or wannabe exies of M’s is putting the moves on them–then it could very well look like M is about to do the do (and there is no reason for MC’s to believe he wouldn’t, whether or not they’re getting it on with M). Some MCs may not care, but it’d give Sera an in for some serious angsty moments of M either not caring enough to explain or falling all over themselves trying to make the MC understand it was nothing.

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