The Wayhaven Chronicles General Discussion (SPOILER FREE FOR BOOK THREE!)

Hosted Games
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I’ve got four different saves, one for each RO (I might have to double the Morgan playthroughs for Book 3, one with sex, the other without, just to see how that plays out), and I think the only route where Farah isn’t the bestie is the one where she’s the love interest. Because, well gestures wildly in the direction of everything that is Farah.

On the Farah romance route, the BFF is probably Nat, because my Detective and her are two peas in a pod, provided that pod has a comfortable couch and lots of books to read. Also, the reading hours with Nat provide a much-needed counterbalance to the constant whirling tornado of
FARAH
FILLED
FUN
!

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I love this reasoning! Honestly, I love everything about F. And they came close to bestie material because of how fun they were but Yuri really vibes with Mason in a closer way. Despite the fact that she’s super friendly with all of Unit Bravo, Mason gets the BF title haha.

Oooh, that sounds like such a nice time ~ Definitely a way to wind down consider F is such a constant ball of energy. xD

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I can’t believe how many people have managed to friendzone Mason! My MC has been a sucker for him since she met him :sleepy:

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Sorry, in my defense, I have a type. My friend knows this well. I am just attracted to the brooding leaders (please also see SHoH’s Blade). I apparently like to torment myself with frustrating slow burns. But also. They’re absolutely adorable in their awkwardness when trying to portray their feelings. x3

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Agreed. And she’s starting to do that, thankfully! Well, except to Mason. With him, it’s a good case of Adam-impersonation–bury the feelings down and pretend they don’t exist. That path is going great for her. Not…

I do worse than this… I have saves like “Dezh-final-Abff-notests–final-noreallyfinal-nothisoneisit!” I go to play book 2 and stare at all the saves going cross-eyed. I saw someone on another thread suggest making a dummy email for your actual final saves and think it may be a good idea. I have saves for test characters I ended up using elsewhere. And other saves for characters I was trying to figure out and used Wayhaven to do it. So my save list is one big mess.

Ooh, that’s what I was talking about, not b2! Brain fart. When Dezh did that, my jaw hit the floor. And he was shocked as hell and made some comment about her being so intimidating (83%, lol) that he didn’t expect that from her. It’s like, you and me both, buddy.

I can just picture these two being sent on a mission where they have to communicate with people. A disaster in the making. Dezh: What the hell are you crying for? I just asked a question! Lukas, you deal with this shit!

Dezh doesn’t suffer from that affliction. She assumes everyone but her is fragile and will die if she doesn’t fight the world for them. And now that she’s attached to UB (and Mason even more than the other three), she’d throw herself in front of a speeding train to save them.

I’ve had a rough two weeks, so I understand. I’m glad that this helped! It helps me too. :slight_smile:

Don’t hold yourself back! The first part/book of my Dezh fic is like 130k words. The outline for part II, which I am about 2/3 finished with is around 90k words. I think I have a problem…

Poor naive Ellie. Dezh assumed he’d actually keep his word if he made the deal, but when he refused (and Mason basically refused, too), she knew they were both in for it. She did figure that, if she could get Murphy to take her, she could free herself. She has good reasons for believing this, as insane as it sounds.

That scene is hilarious. Adam’s response cracked me up. I loved Mason’s, too (I’ll get your glide going–yes, Mason, you will get her glide going just with a look, thank you).

For the BFF question:

Dezh (M): Adam is her bff, oddly enough. I’m tempted to go through and try to force her to be Felix’s bff… or even Nate’s (honestly, I think Dezh could use Nate’s influence most, and she’s going to need some reassurance about Mason for the next few books, until M actually decides he’s in love). Really, if it wasn’t for book 1, I think Nate would be her bff. The two of them just got off to a really rough start because Dezh thought he was being nice to trick her into trusting them.

Zaraya (A): Mason is her bff by far, which is hilarious. She gets along with all of them, though, and has from the start.

Jax (F): Mason is her bff. Adam hates her (for good reason, probably). She gets along with Nate pretty well, though.

Triss (N): Felix is her bff, with Mason as a close second. She and Adam get along, though.

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Please don’t do this Dezh. It’s the worse path. Mason is already an oblivious mess when it comes to feelings. This cannot end well. xD;; (As someone on the receiving end who is much more empathetic… Yuri sometimes wishes she were oblivious to Adam’s feelings. >.>;; )

Omfg what a title. xD And damn, a dummy email? Hmm, maybe. I just have everything written out nicely in a document (well, documents). And I keep them fairly organized. I’m glad I only have Yuri… for now.

Y’all MCs are crazy (@Lambkin You know we love Ellie but sometimes she is too… good. Yuri wouldn’t have her any other way but also it makes Yuri worry immensely. ;w;) And, I mean, considering it turns out pretty well in the end… depending. I guess you’re right. But still. Yuri is definitely not the type to give herself up. She’s so fight-y too. xD

Oh dear. I can’t recall this when I did his route (for writing purposes… but it was also fun haha) but yay. Paper plane choice is the best choice. xD

I’m loving these answers ~ I can’t wait to read more from others! :3c

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Oh, I don’t want to do it to her. She’s just… difficult. She had started to let the walls down in b2 with Mason, despite her constantly reminding herself that she’s nothing but a sex toy and means absolutely nothing to him because that is what he said and she takes him at his word. But she gave in to the feelings she’s having and intentionally not naming. She showed some softness. Then, at the beginning of the b3 demo, things were great.

That scene in the bakery, though? After that, the walls went back up because he reminded her in front of someone she’s known for a long time (even if she’s not close to her, which she’s not) that Dezh is nothing. Zero. Zip. Garbage. Sure, he apologized. Something that shocked her, but she assumed the apology is because he just doesn’t like her being upset because if she’s upset, she won’t put out. And now she has convinced herself that when he’s nice, it’s only because a) he has been ordered to keep her safe and when he’s nice, she’s more cooperative and b) because he wants to bang and figures that’s the way to keep her agreeing to it.

Did he say this? Nope, but it’s the only way she can reconcile his behavior with his words. She may change as book 3 proceeds, depending on how shitty he is to her, but that’s where she’s at when the demo ends. The worst part is that she knows she’s in love with him, even if she doesn’t even admit it to herself. So it is just nothing but pain now, with her assuming every time he touches her it is probably the last. :frowning:

That’s the funny part with Dezh. She’s a fighter to her last breath. So her offering herself up to save UB, specifically Mason? That was a big deal. Though, again, she figured she could get free. The woman has no fear. Except for insects. And feelings…

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Dang, this is kind of rough. As you know, Mason is Yuri’s bestie and I have a hard time reading this without getting a little prickly haha. Dezh’s thoughts are definitely her own and whatever she’s feeling is totally valid. But that doesn’t necessarily mean what she thinks it means. I know you already explained it’s because she’s equally emotionally constipated but maaaan it’s difficult not to wince a bit at the harshness with which she decides to interpret things. ;w;

Pfft, it’s funny you say that, Yuri is also afraid of bugs. She’d gladly take on a supernatural before she face insects. xD

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As a huge Mason fan, I get it. But Dezh has a point, given Mason’s words.

Well, only part of it is interpretation. The rest is directly from Mason.

You and I know he’s actually beginning to fall for the MC (I guess beginning, given what Sera’s said??), and most times he behaves like someone who is in more than just a f-buddy relationship, but him saying crap like he did in the bakery is pretty shitty, no matter how much I like the guy.

For the happy and secure MCs who are actually capable of interpreting his mixed signals, I can see where they’d just sigh and keep going and hoping he hurries up and catches a clue. For those who are as clueless as he is, and will continue to be as clueless as him, it’s also fine because it didn’t really hurt them. But for the non-shunshiney, emotionally constipated, oh-shit-I-don’t-wanna-fall-for-this-guy-who-says-I’m-nothing MCs? All they can do is take him at his word and try to explain away the moments when he’s nice or soft to them, because the dissonance screws with their heads.

Honestly, going back and glancing at my saved doc from the b3 demo, Dezh was just left there with her head spinning after Mason kissed her on the cheek and went to go help with the cleanup. She had no clue whatsoever to think about that.

Yes!! Jax would totally prank them both and leave fake spiders and roaches to scare them. Then run. Because Dezh would kick her ass for it, lol.

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@EvilChani Honestly? All of this seems much more subjective than objective - and once again I’ll state that this is your own MCs emotional constipation interpreting Mason’s actions because that’s all she knows about him. And she’s not gonna try so she doesn’t think he is and will always take his words at face value without even considering he might actually care and is inept at even realizing it. It honestly seems like an MC not really compatible with Mason or it’ll just take a long ass time for anything to happen. I really do hope things get better for them. Dezh won’t see change if she doesn’t try to initiate it. (This is what I say to Adam all the time… but he seems equally stubborn to keep up walls sooo we’re all gonna be here for a long time waiting I guess xD).

Yuri will definitely kick Jax’s ass for it too. Please don’t do it. xD

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A great deal of it is my MC’s emotional constipation, but look at it from the perspective of a character who doesn’t get to look into Mason’s head as we readers do. Mason said in the beginning that it meant nothing. He reiterates that at Haley’s bakery, to a complete stranger, and acts pissed off and pouty as he snaps at the woman–after he kisses the MC and has acted soft.

We know he is clueless about how he feels. All the MC has to go on is a mixture of actions and words. Saying “the only thing she’s seeing is me naked” to a freaking stranger is a pretty rude and shitty thing to do. But, in Mason’s defense, he has said in the past that the sex means nothing and is no strings, so it’s not a surprise. Even Mason thinks, during his thoughts on the warehouse roof, that the MC shouldn’t have been surprised because he told her how things were.

So yeah, it’s not all on the MC. Mason needs to learn to think about what comes out of his mouth. Dezh needs to learn that Mason is an idiot who doesn’t recognize his own feelings. There’s room for improvement on both sides.

I think the problem is that Sera puts everything on the MC. The MC has to pick up on Mason’s feelings despite his words, and not all people are capable of reading those types of cues. I mean, let’s get real–Mason is the one with superpoers here, so he should realize how the MC feels, especially after being able to pick up on the MC being upset even when the MC tries to hide it. Basically, it’s a plot device that won’t be resolved until the author says so. But YMMV.

That’s your opinion. I disagree, because I’ve written these two up to the point where they actually both realize their feelings (and yeah, she does first, and even admits to them first, though it has disastrous results because Mason isn’t ready).

That’s actually kind of funny. In my fic, it happens much quicker than we’ll get it in the actual games. In fact, by the end of the b3 equivalent in my fic, the two of them have admitted it and are together. Without pushing or having them OOC, save for me throwing a couple of life or death situations at them and Dezh sacrificing herself to save him, which she would totally do.

Telling Jax that is like waving a red flag at a bull. She’ll totally do it and hope she’s fast enough not to get her ass kicked (she can’t fight her way out of a box, but she can run!).

This actually begs the question, and I kinda want to do a survey for it, but… until I do, here goes…

Do all of you think that the only way Mason and the MC will actually get to the “love” stage is if the MC is the one to initiate it (in other words, will Sera force the MC to be the one to take the leap because M never would)?

And, do you think Mason will ever actually say the words “I love you” to the MC (and take into consideration that Sera, on more than one occasion, that M won’t say the words)?

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Areylia’s best friend is Mason. The first couple times I played her it was Felix, but now it’s Mason, and I think that suits her much better. She is completely unbothered by his abrasiveness, and the fact that he’s so honest is a major draw for her. Most of the “friends” she had in the past all wanted something from her, so Mason’s blunt manner just assures her that when he’s around her/being nice to her its because he actually likes her instead of just wanting something from her. She actually gets along fairly well with everyone in UB though. Lukas’s best friend is Farah which is actually funny because he spends a lot of time in book 1 flirting with her before he decides to pursue Nat, and him and Farah just end up being really good friends instead. He clashes with Ava all of the time though, like I swear by the end of book 2 he has like a collective 3 friend points with her, and those were from choices that gives you a point for the whole unit. Riley’s best friend is Adam which I really like. They first bonded over professionalism and mutual respect, but Riley has next to no self-esteem, so every time Adam makes a comment about how valuable she is to the team it hits hard. She doesn’t get along with Nate though, not intentionally, she just doesn’t read social cues well, and often ignores Nate’s overtures of friendship without even realizing. Cat’s best friend is Nate, and they’re adorable together. She also gets along well with everyone. (Let’s be real who can possibly dislike this woman.) Rhiannon’s best friend is Felix who’s really good at brining her humorous side out from her stoic shell, and Eleanor’s is Mason which is just adorable because unlike Areylia she’s not teasing or sarcastic with him, just genuinely kind which often baffles him.

Haha! This made my night. Especially since Lukas cannot do tears, and it’s worse when the person crying is a woman, under 20, or both. (Let us hope Verda’s daughter never finds out about this weakness)

I’m gonna add Cat to this club as well, but for her its specifically spiders. She really dislikes insects, and finds them disgusting, but she refuses to be in the same room as a spider.

Lol. She really is perfect for Felix then. This is such an F thing to do.

I really don’t think so. I doubt she would force the MC to be the first one to say initiate it. Also, I’m pretty sure there was an ask (it’s late where I live and I don’t feel like fighting with tumblr right now, so I’ll try to find it later) where Sara said for Mason it’s less about resisting a relationship and more about not realizing he has feelings, but once he realizes he’s pretty chill about it.

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Definitely. I think that’s all I want to say on the matter. We all know that Mason has his own issues, but obviously so does your MC. I’m not even looking at it from a reader’s point of view, and having an M-mancer best friend, I can say that it’s definitely a two way street. Both have to work at it and it really can’t be read so black and white.

Indeed. Because all I have to go off of are your statements of your MC thinking that Mason thinks nothing of her and is willing to stubbornly believe it despite her own feelings and seeing the moments that show otherwise. I don’t think their relationship is impossible. But definitely gonna take a lot of work to get anywhere.

I feel like this could be said of many fics, simply because we can’t expect to write a 7 part book ourselves haha. I’d definitely love to take a read and see the softer side of Dezh because it seems like Yuri would really get along with her once she lets people in ~

Good luck Jax. You’ll need it. Yuri is also really fast, agility being her strong suit in any martial art. Though I think the fear as Jax ran away would be enough… and eventually Yuri would have a good laugh about it. xD

This is definitely not what I meant when I said she needs to initiate change. But I do not think that it will fall entirely on the MC. Simply because there is the option for Bold and Shy and honestly that will definitely be taken into consideration? But that’s just my take on it since I can’t speak for Mishka haha.

I mean, does he need to? Sometimes actions speak louder than words. Which is probably what she meant. He is also definitely the type to put his feelings into his actions opposed to his words. I don’t think you need to be told “I love you” to feel it.

Yuri’s is centipedes. God. Too many legs. Too. Many. Legs. It’s like a long spider. D;

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@Cat-Toes Oooh <3 I love these! I really only have Yuri. And soon to be an F-mancer. But aaaa, I don’t know why bestie feels kind of feel better than the actual romance? (Probably because I’m an A-mancer and my romance is gonna take forever lmao).

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Ellie’s bestie is Nate. From the very beginning, they got on; his friendly and open demeanor was definitely a pleasant contrast to those of…other certain members of UB who shall not be named out of politeness. :smiley: I also think Nate’s presence was quite soothing overall just because Ellie had just started as the detective and was thrust into such an intense case, so it was really nice to have him there to help keep the peace. As they got to know each other though, they realized that—aside from having complimentary dispositions (I can think of two times when Mason has commented on their similarities)—they also enjoy a lot of the same things. Ellie is totally happy to chill for an afternoon in a library surrounded by books – listening to the swish of turning pages, breathing in that particular book scent (you know the one). They also totally have friend-dates; I like to imagine that when they’re in the Big City, they’ll grab lunch at different restaurants just to try the food, or they’ll go and see a show together – musicals, plays, whatever’s playing really. Nate is someone Ellie can be comfortable around and talking to, and they’ve had serious conversations in which he’s helped her see different perspectives other than her own.

As for the others, she got on with Felix right away, but it took a bit for her to become comfortable with Adam. Though their execution in carrying out tasks is different, they actually share a lot of the same values, and once that became apparent, by the end of Book Two, they were good.

A problem? No way! You have admirable dedication and discipline! I’m always in awe of people who can keep up with their long-term projects! :star_struck:

Yeah honestly, thank goodness for Mason putting a stop to that nonsense or she would have absolutely handed herself over, no questions asked. She protested when he told her she needed to get going though, so she does feel responsible for how her actions contributed to the situation (even though it obviously turns out the same way no matter what you choose XD).

From all you shared about Dezh, I don’t think it’s unreasonable for her to have confidence/believe in her skills. She’s had plenty of training and experience, so she’s definitely more than capable. :slight_smile:

I only did the paper plane option once on my first Mason playthrough, and when he said that, I was like, “Yes please and thank you. :pleading_face: ”

Girl, me too. Bugs are scary. I have accidentally (though not apologetically) killed bugs while dramatically running away from them. (…Wasp in the shower; -1000/10 would not recommend.) But on the MC side of things, Ellie is neutral – some are okay, and some squick her out. Depending on how she’s feeling, she’ll either squish them or let them go outside. She is benevolent to spider friends though.

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My turn to ask a seemingly-random question, because some people in the threads of some WIPs I’m following are apparently super-into (romance-wise) characters who’ve tried to deliberately murder them (and one that has actually succeeded), and there’s so many of them that I’m beginning to think I’m the one who’s messed up in the head by going “what? no, these people tried to MURDER ME, I’m not going to ROMANCE THEM, what the hell”:

Has anyone played Wayhaven and thought “gosh, Murphy would be a great RO, I really want to smooch him?”

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Cat totally did this too, and it was a good thing he did because Cat, like Ellie was naive enough to think Murphy of all people would honor a deal. After he got her though, she was super nice to him for some reason. I was like Cat, Sweetie the man kidnapped you and murdered several people, you are allowed to say something mean, and she just gave me a disappointed mom frown, so I was like Okay you win, be nice to Murphy.

I second this sentiment. If anyone could it would be Dezh. Also I think Areylia also believed that she could free herself. In her case though, it’s because she’s that guy who always thinks she’s the smartest person in the room. (In her defense she usually is.)

Oh my goodness! That sounds awful. You were okay though right?

Clearly, you did not read the early stages of this thread where there were a lot of people who wanted to get with Murphy. I don’t see the appeal either. I typically play villain RO routes if they’re already in the games since I tend to play every RO route in a game at least once, but i’m not going to ask for the writer to make a villain an RO if they aren’t one already. In general though I agree with you on the why would I want to date someone who has tried to murder me. My one exception to that is if it’s like an assassin who ends up join your party instead of fulfilling the contract, and that’s just because one of my favorite troupes of all time is: the assassin hired to kill us is now found family.

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:roll_eyes:Clearly I did not, and now I’m very glad for it because in the long list of things I do NOT want in my life is more people who think MORE toxic relationships in media are a good idea. :face_vomiting:

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Mmmmm, Angel from 180 Files. :heart_eyes: (Although, to make it clear, I think they are a terrible, horrible, no good, very bad person and would never support, condone, or pursue a relationship with anyone like that in real life.)

Personally, no; Murphy doesn’t do it for me. He’s just too…creepy…and ugh, just no. But as @Cat-Toes said, there was a lot of Murphy-thirst back in the day. No one ever seriously said a relationship with Murphy was healthy or a good idea though. (Pretty sure he was dubbed the ‘Garbage-Husband’ or something.) But yeah, it all seemed to be done in good, non-serious fun.

Haha, Cat’s adorable. I do love how she and Ellie can have similar thought-processes about and ways they handle certain situations. :smiling_face_with_three_hearts: Ellie’s highest stats have always been Genuine/Friendly/Optimism/Heart (plus, People/Psychology is her primary skill), so she’s nice to a fault, and sometimes I want to shake her for it. In Ch. 18, these were her responses to Murphy (“Then how about you take some and let me go?” (willing to cooperate); “You put that in me, and then what?” (trying to understand him/what he’s doing without being confrontational about it); “Don’t you even care about the people you’ve killed?” (because, as always, her heart goes back to his previous victims and their families)), and she did wind up getting the gentler treatment from him.

Yep, I was fine (more fine than that time I slipped in the shower and nearly took the shower curtain and rod down with me; sometimes, I am a coordination disaster :sweat_smile: ), but the wasp definitely wasn’t.

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Oh ho ho, are we talkin’ 'bout my boy, Murphy??? :eyes:

Trash husband, garbage fire, etc—the list of cutesy and wholly accurate nicknames goes on! lol

But seriously, I don’t think anyone (at least on here, that I am aware of) has genuinely expected Murphy to be an RO, I just…have trash taste is all, clearly. I don’t romanticize the idea of an abusive relationships at all, nor do I condone or justify them in any way whatsoever, and I fully support and wish we could expand on the systems in place to help people in abusive relationships to escape and recover.
I myself have experienced profound and extended abuse in my life when I was younger, and while my abuse was not in the context of a romantic relationship, I was still at the mercy of my abuser for several years and kept isolated for…much longer than I’d rather dwell on. Suffice it to say, I’m not coming at this from a place of ignorance, I’m coming at this from a place of genuine pain and understanding, with no illusions of the kinds of things I’m talking about.

I won’t presume that none of you are unfamiliar with PTSD, but for the sake of those who might not, I’d like to make it clear that escaping and overcoming abuse doesn’t mark the end of it. There’s many times where I’ve had to pull over on the side of the road from how blinded I am with tears because I’ll remember something fucked up from my past and I can’t get it out of my head. Clawing my way back into the present is exhausting, and when I was younger I had almost no way of controlling this except to shove it deep, deep down where I could not and would not engage with it. That is harmful in its own ways that I won’t get into because this is getting long enough and preachy enough on its own. My main point is that (for me in particular), reading these things is incredibly cathartic.

In Wayhaven, my main RO is Nate—who I will love until such time that I buy Dune on 4k Ultra HD 3D for VR or whatever and get to stare lovingly at Oscar Isaac’s beard and bod because I am w E a k—which I realize may be a shocker, considering how much I love Murphy but like…Nate kinda serves the same function to me? Sometimes I want to be held and comforted and made to think that nothing can ever hurt me again, and then sometimes…I want to look my pain in the eye, examine it from every facet, to understand why something can still hurt so many years after the fact, and while the Murphy presented in Book One is a great setup, it doesn’t actually deliver in the kind of understanding that I’m looking for, hence…him being a trash husband, lol.
Exploring what it would be like if he won is exactly what I need to explore my own pain in a safe and secure manner, because unlike in real life…I can close the book. I can stop writing the fanfic. I can move on with my life and obsess over Oscar Isaac (which I can, have, and will, thank you for coming to my TED Talk). I have a control over this scenario that I never had in real life, and that is what’s cathartic. Reliving the same experiences is hell until you know you can stop it any time you want, and then come back to deal with it whenever you’re emotionally ready again. It helped me learn how to put my guard back down, because I don’t need it up all the time anymore, not when I can shut off my phone…metaphorically speaking. I don’t think anyone under the age 45 actually turns off their devices anymore, lol.

TL;DR

I don’t actually want to romance a Murphy in real life, fuck no, but exploring that kind of relationship helps me deal with a lot of things that I otherwise have immense trouble facing, that I can’t do if I just bury myself in Nate’s route over and over again.

And lastly, I blame Sera because c l e a r l y she is incapable of writing uncharismatic characters, how dare she, lol. I mean, look at Verda. He had like two minutes of screentime in Book One and he’s a fan favorite and has been for years. You can’t blame me for loving her characters, even the ones I’m supposed to hate, lol. I’m only human.

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