The Emigre: Wagon Train (WIP and DD) | Updated:01/15/22

[Xoromin]

I think that the most inclusive reaction for a resentful or similar MC would be to simplify the conversation a little bit and leave the tone more open for any type of emotional response. Kind of like how an actor reads the same line in different emotions to come up with different interpretations.

The ellipsis in “They are offering a reward for you… why?” could just be reduced to a response such as “They are offering a reward for you? Why?” which leaves it very open for the player to decide what emotion to use on the delivery rather than the thoughtful or emotionally distraught tone that is implied by the pause in the question.
In the line “A fresh start… but where, Kim?” the usage of the name at the end implies that the character is more concerned with the person and if it was removed “A fresh start… where to then?” it could be more indicative of a resentful person who’s insecurely signifying that they feel they’re being abandoned again by focusing on the act of leaving rather than the person doing the leaving. It could also be taken as someone who is inspired by the idea of starting over and excitedly asking where you could go to find such a thing.

Overall, I think the sentiment is there in the original, but with some small tweaks the character, currently acting concerned just in general or concerned for Kim specifically, can be more concerned with themselves (possibly the other kids in the gang, but that can probably be left up to the player to decide without text) by toning down some of the more emotionally distraught lines. The character might appear shallow or emotionless on the surface despite what they might be feeling inside, but that emotion is ultimately decided by the tone the player chooses to read it in.

[Eiwynn]

@Xoromin – Thank you for the clarification … as you were reading the Origins, were you happy with this scene until the “Kim Leaving” section, or did you feel the entire scene needed more agency and development for your particular MC personality and play-through?

If you feel more is needed, did you read the pace as being rushed or “too fast”?

Other than the Kim leaving section, did the flow of the narrative take you where you wanted the character to go?

I appreciate you going the extra mile in your feedback here – you are helping me isolate some issues that perhaps not just yourself experienced and that if I can nail them down, I can address them.

[Starkness]

like it so far but i would prefer it if instead of the choices just being

you react:

1. neutrally
2. aggressively
3. scared

if maybe the choice actually told you what you said or a summary of what you said instead of just the different tones in a list

and i’m a little bit confused over Elitha because I thought they are nonbinary and used they/them pronouns but when I choose to involve them to choose supplies with me my options are to choose from 'offer to help her", “find something to do until she finishes”, “demand that she drops her hunting to accompany you” or “go get your hunting knife and help her in her hunting”. It’s possible that I might be confusing character or completely misreading tho.

[Xoromin]

@Eiwynn - I think the player character development is solid throughout the Origins section and I was effectively able to create quite a few varied characters with different personalities that I liked. The section that I mentioned previously and one other one that I will mention later in this post were the only parts where I felt confused as to why and how my character was acting. The only other thing I will mention is that I did feel like more ethnicities could be represented. On my initial play through I had been developing a Latino character and had to rework them once I saw that it wasn’t a choice later on.

Initially I did feel like the pacing was too fast although I feel differently now and I have a theory as to why. I think when the time skips happen through the MCs childhood it is a little jarring for a first time reader who has to reestablish themselves and figure out what is happening in the setting. They have to determine how much time has past, what has happened in that time, how did that affect the character and those surrounding them, and then finally they ask what is happening now. In the beginning we expect the skip to happen and then when it does the new setting is explained to us in a detailed scene mostly through the dialogue between our mother and the madame. Then in the next time skip we enter to some dialogue from Kim and pick up some of the setting before being asked to choose our best friend with no context. It’s a little jarring but then once we choose we’ve immediately jumped forward again and now we aren’t entirely unsure of the context in the last section and we have to figure out what’s going on in the new section making it feel rushed. On a reread this isn’t really a problem because we know what’s going to happen.
So I think if we’re just given a little more information about the location and people in the scene then the pacing will feel a lot more natural.

This leads me into my next point which is that I don’t really know the kids in the gang. We pick up on their dynamic, and a little bit of David’s backstory given the information that he’s part Native American, but aren’t really introduced to them. We see some of their personality bleed through in the group dynamic but we don’t know our individual dynamics or what their primary personality traits are. This made the Decision To Leave Scene seem confusing for me because it’s hard to tell who’s excited about the idea to go west.
To me it reads that we’re upset, our best friend excitedly suggests we follow Kim and find adventure which MC was kind of thinking of doing away, we say “Give you my word, I’ll go check it out and let you guys know.” best friend responds “Wait, why don’t we all go?” you respond “I don’t trust Kims motivations. We won’t be apart that long.” then best friend says “Ok.”
I don’t know if the best friend is excited and wants to go west, but when they find out that only you are going they become reluctant, or if you were excited cause you had the idea for a while anyway and they’re reluctant about it the whole time, or if they’re excited the whole time and you reluctantly decide to venture out and see if it’s safe on their behalf.
I think I’m confused here because I’m misreading the best friends tone since I don’t know them well enough to understand what they would say and why they would say it.

Other than these things and the ones I mentioned previously I think the Origins chapter is a really good hook and transition into the main story. I think the main character develops in a fascinating way that allows you to really understand who they are and makes their decisions and dialogue very impactful when the story really kicks off.

[Eiwynn]

@Starkness – Thank you for the feedback.

• Regarding the choices that have one word lists: It looks like these are not working for everyone, so I’ll need to review and revise them. Thank you for pointing them out as not working for you.

• Regarding Elitha and their pronouns; I found the erroneous pronouns and so will be working on a fix for updating. So good catch!

Edit: Fixed.

I hope you have been enjoying the Donner clan characters, despite my coding errors.

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@Xoromin – Once again, thank you for expanding on your experiences, this helps me understand what is going on from your perspective.

I have a lot to think on, and I am already planning a few revisions, specifically focusing on the kids in the gang.

[Petrichor]

I must not have been paying attention when reading the description and such… got to the family choice and saw the names and I was just like “Oh. Oh no. No no. That’s not good.”

[Normie_noob]

Loved the demo. Always love a western cog.
An “off topic” question, will there be any older RO like Elisabeth. I think it would add more flavour to the thrill of wild west.

[Eiwynn]

@Petrichor – I’m glad you enjoyed the story

@Normie_noob – I’m glad you also enjoyed the demo!

@Normie_noob

will there be any older RO like Elisabeth. I think it would add more flavour to the thrill of wild west.

Romance for the MC will only take place once the MC turns 18; before then, you’ll be building relationships up for potential romance and rivalries. (Tracked through friendship and flirt stats)

[Schliemannsghost]

I’ve given it one playthrough so far, with the Reed party. I look forward to seeing how different it is with one of the others!

I enjoyed what I played a lot. It’s such a great concept for an if, and I can definitely see the potential for some really tough decisions ahead. It reminds me a bit of The Oregon Trail game (here’s hoping I don’t die of dysentery!), and I enjoy seeing anything historical.

I did run into a few continuity-type issues in the trading post section on the way to Independence - I’ll flag those below in the specific comments. Once or twice, I felt like I was making a decision in a bit of a vacuum. This was most notable when I was asked to choose my best friend, and presented with three names I had never seen before, I don’t know whether that choice has any significance for stats etc, but still, it felt like I was just picking a name out of hat, which isn’t great in terms of player agency. A similar issue is with background. I chose the Fence background, and, while some of the skills that I was told I had acquired for choosing this made sense and felt appropriate for a fence, others were a bit surprising. It might help players make a more meaningful choice if you could find a way to indicate what skills each profession will get you before choosing. One other choice-related quibble: I felt like one of the most serious decisions I’d been asked to make in terms of the future of the wagon-train, and certainly the earliest, is what to do with Luke. I opted to leave him behind, because I didn’t want to risk him passing his sickness on to the others. But then the game forces me to take him anyway! I understand that you need to do this sometimes, but it’s a real downer that you do this with the first really significant choice of the journey. It makes me worry that, later on down the line, my other choices will be largely cosmetic and illusory too (I’m sure they won’t be, but if I was a first-time player, it’s a bad first impression to get).

Specific points:

“Whose”

I’m not sure what has happened here. Is this placeholder text?

These choices aren’t what you character actually says, so they shouldn’t be in quotation marks.

“There IS still something…” Also, space between the comma and the friend’s name.

I live in Ireland, and I felt slighted on behalf of my adopted homeland. Ireland is extremely fertile, very good agricultural land!

You need to pluralize “Fence”, and get rid of the capital f.

I think you need “emigrate”, not “emigre” here.

“sets off”

“scarred” his soul

The first and third paragraph include moments when quotations are missing their closing quotation marks. I found quite a lot of examples of missing quotation marks throughout (too many for me to take a screenshot each time), so when proof-reading you might like to pay special attention and look out specifically for that.

The person I had been speaking to when I got this option was called Nelly, not William.

I didn’t “turn away the refugees”, so I shouldn’t have got this text. I rescued some members of the Miami tribe with Nelly, and then let them join the wagon train.

I think that’s everything. Anyway, as I say, I enjoyed it. I look forward to more playthroughs and future updates!

[Eiwynn]

@Schliemannsghost – Thank you for your wonderful feedback!

It is great to see people outside the US are enjoying this game. It is always a worry that a tale of this nature will not be enjoyed outside the original culture, so seeing I achieved this is humbling

• The Oregon Trail game is both a direct influence and an inspiration for this project. I am pleased it makes that connection for you!

• Regarding continuity errors: Thank you for the screenshots; I shall be getting those fixed asap.

• Regarding Jesse, David and Jill: One constant theme of feedback is the need to revisit these “welchers” and give them more screen time and a larger role in the Origins of the game. This has become this month’s focus and I hope to have a deployable patch this month addressing everyone’s feedback.

• Regarding the skill sets: For game continuity and cohesion, I tried to have a standardized set that worked for both the different origins and the future wagon train needs – it seems I might not have accomplished my goal of making them universal for all backgrounds. I will revisit this for sure now.

• Regarding Luke: A controversial npc in my prior testing; he is a huge learning experience for me in implementing game-design. I see where you may feel railroaded here by events for the moment.
  This choice does have consequences, and I hope the consequences of this decision will have a big impact when they come home to roost. I have tried to make this a delayed branching and consequences choice, and I hope that when this all happens, the reader will realize just how much this choice does matter.

I’ll be using all your screenshots to track down all those pesky unwanted bugs and mistakes.

Once again, thank you for all the feedback you have given me today!

Edit: Fixes completed

[K_T]

Summary

[Eiwynn]

@K_T – Thank you for the screen shot.

If I am seeing the error, it is the line of dialogue saying: " Blueis right…"

I’ll add that to my next batch of fixes.

Thanks for playing my demo and taking the time to report what you find.

Edit: Fixed

[PrinceJackal]

Hi @Eiwynn

It’s pretty neat that you published your WIP since we last talked. Congrats.

So I read your WIP and I can say I enjoyed it. My feedback here is really focused on the beginning of the game.

My main issue is the MC’s POV and the relationship with the mother. I hope I’ll make sense here with my explanation below:

The game seemingly begins with the mom’s POV. Which I think is fine since the MC is a newborn baby. But then there’s a timeskip where the mom is going to visit the madam.

I think the MC is like 6 years old. So I was expecting as a reader to get into the mind of a six year old and see the world through this lens.

What pulled me out a bit was how the mother’s POV seems to be priotised still. The story tells us that she can no longer support the MC because of difficulties.

But as the reader, I was not given the chance to experience the mom’s struggle with her. The reader does not see the mother coming home tired, never sees the mother cry herself to sleep or even sees the mother struggle day in and day out to make sure that her child sleeps with a full belly.

Intellectually, I can understand that the mom is struggling. But as the reader, I don’t feel anything. The mom is dumbing/selling the MC to a Madame pretty early in the game. So the options on how to feel about the abandonment feel rather empty.

I think establishing some kind of relationship with the mom, even if it is doomed, is important for the reader.

Have you read ‘Where the Crawdads Sing’?

MINOR SPOILER

The protagonist is abandoned by her family. But what’s lovely is that there was some kind of relationship established. The mom does leave the protagonist but it is presented in an understable way. The reader understands that the mom has left because of the abuse of the dad. But the protagonist, from the POV of a child, knows that mom is seriously leaving but holds up hope that her mom will return as usual (even though she suspects otherwise). And through the progress of the story, the protagonist reveals what her mom taught her and how she uses these skills to survive by herself.

So what I’m trying to get here (hopefully in a clear manner) is that the MC and mom’s relationship is probably going to be important for the reader to immerse themselves in the world.

Anyway, I liked the game. As a South African, I’m coming in blind into this historical work about this time period of America. But I think I still managed to follow the story. Kudos to your writing skills. So I’m excited to see what comes next.

[Eiwynn]

@PrinceJackal – Thank you for reading my demo!

@PrinceJackal

As a South African, I’m coming in blind into this historical work about this time period of America. But I think I still managed to follow the story.

It really is great to see this game is reaching people outside the US and that you enjoy and like the game. It is a great compliment to know this.

I’m working on new material for the Origins section, even as I write this, so hopefully, I’ll have an update that makes that section even better for everyone.

@PrinceJackal

Kudos to your writing skills. So I’m excited to see what comes next.

I’m excited to get this new material out for everyone to experience.

[lokidemon007]

Loving this game so far!

[Aselia]

I don’t know if it was necessary to add the adjectives “brawny” and “delicate” to the gender choice for boys and girls respectively. “Wonderful” for the non-binary option is neutral enough, but the former convey a stereotype, yes?

[Eiwynn]

@lokidemon007 – Thank you for playing my demo; I am happy that you are enjoying the game.

@Aselia – That was one of the choices that was supposed to be updated, along with the eyes and other customization choices. It shall be updated with the next push, either way.

@ everyone – as I stated in my last post, I am working on new material for the Origins section. I have most of the mechanics and structural code completed, and now I am writing!

It really feels good to be writing new words. I can’t wait to get this new material out, but I won’t push it live until I feel it is ready.

[CC_Hill]

Finally got around to play the game and I love it so far. Keep on the good work.

I did not read all the reviews on the thread, so disregard if what I say have already been mentioned.

What I really enjoyed:

All the thing you get to choose. I’m a sucker for high customization of my MC, and having to choose, their origin, best friend, skills, jobs, and which family to travel with was very appealing to me, and I really enjoy making those choices.

I like how the origin of Mc does mater throughout the story, you get a reference here and there and even some weird jokes about who MC are, that really gives the story a sense of real-life situation.

Meeting Luke and Gerald. The game gave me so many chance to just give up on the kid but for some reason I couldn’t, and I can’t wait to see if Luke makes it out all the way to the end.

I can already tell that Gerald will be my favorite character to interact with, he has that wisdom about him, and I really like the way he is written.

The game give the reader the chance to experience what is life would be like traveling as a settler during this time and I really like the journey so far.

Some notes:

This line, my MC is supposed to be 6 years old not sure a six year old would get this line of thinking, not because of the word whore, we all know children often repeat what they hear but, the whole sentence is sort of too deep for a six year old? Maybe it’s just me lol

Introduction of characters:
There’s a lot of characters that are introduce all at once to my MC and I could barely remember them. There’s the Madam, Angel, and someone name George at the Beginning which I never encounter again. There’s the twins and some of the other children which my MC barely spend time with, I hope we get the chance to meet those characters again if not, then good job on naming all those short-lived Npcs.

I wish there was a short scene at the beginning where my MC get to practice some of that “how to steal” that Kim was teaching the children. It seems that we spent our childhood being a swamp rat and learn stuff from Kim, but the MC or other kids never get to be in such situation at all.

In the scene before my MC leave for California, it is described that MC has money saving up and is living comfortably, while I would expect a swamp rat thief would be living in dire condition and have all the money they stole goes to the leader of the group, (hence to Kim)

I wish there was more dialogue choices to respond to certain situation. Talking to the friends or talking to Kim, or even the guy Dan see example below:

Giving the reader the choice to respond a certain way for me would have been great instead of my MC firmly expressing thought about people they barely even know lol

About the origin and what it entails:

Although I like that MC origin matters, but I feel like sometimes it is just too much and almost free insults lol.

I played as someone with Native origin and dare I say that the insults and offensive language was a lot.

Having an NPC reminding my MC of their origin was a refreshing at first because it mirrors what the real-life situation would be, but having that reaction from several NPC was… a bid discouraging lol.

All I can say is you’ll need a lot of sensitive readers for this especially that scene :

Possible things as trigger warning if you want to add them. Child abandonment, Strong language, child spanking (although it’s only implied) possible offensive language. Mentions of drugs

Other stuff:

delete space before period

missing close " for the conversation.

Usage of both he and they for John Henry pronouns, I don’t know if it’s on purpose

I like the story so far and I’m looking forward for more

[Eiwynn]

@CC_Hill – Thank you for taking the time and providing me with this feedback!

I will be reviewing and digesting everything later tonight and this weekend, so if I do not reply right away, you know that I am still taking everything in.

If I have any follow-up questions regarding anything, can I PM you with them?

[CC_Hill]

No worries, take your time and yes you can PM.