Right, so I created this thread because it seemed like the topic was derailing a different topic and thought it would be better for it to have it’s own space.
@Phenrex Apologies for tagging you since you said you were done with the conversation, feel free to ignore this, but I thought since you were a part of the original discussion and your posts, ideas, and opinions would most likely be being discussed, it would only be right to let you know they were being discussed. I thought it would be rude otherwise. Like I said though, don’t feel pressured to take part in this continued discussion if you don’t wish to.
@JBento @jay-walker I’m tagging you folks because you were the latest ones to be discussing it.
So, in my mind there are different ways to handle this. One of them is how Arcane handles it (which one of the writers has confirmed this) and just make it so there are no labels. At all. For any preference. In the world of Arcane, love is love, and it has never had labels or been seen as wrong in any non-harmful form. That’s why Vi asked Caitlyn the question in a very specific way in the famous “You’re hot, Cupcake” scene in the brothel. She said:
So what’ll it be; man or woman?
She asked it that way because there is no such thing as gay, lesbian, or anything in between or beyond; there is just preference with no labels. So that’s one way of doing it.
Another way of doing it is to have labels and have no negativity in the world towards them. This allows a writer to still shape part of who a character is based on their sexuality and not have to worry about putting any bigotry or homophobia in their world. Helping a character have a meaningful struggle in this world would most likely be done at a young age, or in a flashback of when they were young. Asking themselves questions like, “Almost everyone else likes boys/girls, so why don’t I? Why am I so different? Is there something wrong with me?”
The version of this world’s realism is more attuned to what I imagine Phenrex and saggittarius were expressing, where all of the struggles with sexuality and gender, along with how they helped shape the character, come from internal struggles rather than external ones. This is a world where that person who’s afraid to come out to their family doesn’t have the fear of history excluding and not accepting them, but it’s the fear of “I’m different, and sometimes people who are different don’t belong and get made fun of.” It’s similar to being afraid of the dark when you were 5 years old in your room alone. You logically know there’s nothing in there with you, but that doesn’t stop your mind from telling you there could be.
The last type of world (excluding the extreme where everyone is against LGBTQ+ people, which I’m opting to leave out of this conversation because… why would anyone write that, and who would they be writing that for?) is the world we live in now. Where there is such thing as bigotry, and homophobia, and transphobia, etc. I don’t think this world needs too much explanation because, well, it’s our world. Or at least, the values and beliefs of our world put into another one. This type of world obviously has struggle internally and externally, and would arguably help shape a character the most around their LGBTQ+ identity.
I would certainly say that because, in this world more than the other two, there is struggle. There is conflict. There are bad people who think and do bad things. All of that hate, and conflict, and devastation creates a stronger sense of self around what is being ostracized because people have to constantly be pushing back and fighting against injustices, inequality and inequity. Because of all that, it would add extra struggles the characters would face in everyday life and make that gender/sexual identity much more prominent and possibly at the forefront of what helped shape who they are.
That’s all my take on it, and that’s how I see the different options in how to portray them. Granted there are probably more options than these to help portray sexuality and gender, so feel free to discuss further. But please remember to keep it civil. If anything, we can all agree this is an accepting community here, and it should feel safe to talk about topics such as this to help us all grow as writers and understand one another a little bit more.
As for the term “realism” when talking about gender identity but also talking about leaving out the bad things and thoughts some people do/think about in the real world, perhaps it would be better described as “I would like to see characters with a stronger sense of gender identity/sexuality, and have continuity of that throughout the book.” Or perhaps the word “consistency” would pertain better when talking about a fictional world, rather than the word realism, and might possibly help clear up some confusion. As “realism” in fictional worlds is just really the consistency of the ideas and portrayals throughout the story, at least from my limited knowledge on this subject. I’m not entirely sure on this. I’ve never taken a fictional/creative writing class and I’m certainly no literature major. So someone can feel free to correct me on this if I’m wrong. I am always happy to learn!
. Though I completely understand that is your limit and what you know best.