Choice of Rebels: Uprising — Lead the revolt against a bloodthirsty empire!

[comradelenin]

I’m replaying the game again and once again faced with a dilemma where I must balance my desire to explore the low anarchy route with my immense, unyielding desire to kill every noble I come across. I’ll let the priests alone but I can barely bring myself to spare the t’Plematou, let alone do that AND be passive enough aside from that to keep my anarchy below 21. This is a revolution, not a political debate.

Note: I hate the nobles FAR more than I hate the Theurges and priests. The Theurges and priests are just as often genuinely well meaning practitioners of the faith even if they are members of a horrific state apparatus while the nobles are the main benefactors of said apparatus. Also, the worst deeds aside from the harrowing seem to be done by nobles. I also don’t care about their nationality. Being ruled by a Shayarin noble is no different than being ruled by Karagond noble and a democratic, egalitarian government will rule just as well in Karagond as Shayard. Nationalism has no place in my cause.

[Ramidel]

Then Kalt is the right guy for your rebellion. A more passive route requires being willing to hold back on the murderization.

In general, the most anarchic thing you can do is threaten the institutions of the Hegemony, so scaling back on killing Alastors is advised even if they deserve it worse than the nobles.

When dealing with nobles, remember that one way to avoid anarchy is to seize the means of production, and not murder the de Merre outright. Their time will come, and in the meantime they’re unable to fund any action against your revolutionaries because you’ve collected their wealth. And after that…well, wrecking any more estates is wrecking the Rim’s existing social order.

If nationalism has no place in your cause, though, then you could consider whether the yeomanry are your friends. They tend to be strongly nationalistic and supportive of the Laconniers. It might be a good idea to, ah, tax them (and if you do it judiciously, it won’t drive your anarchy too high).

[Azthyme]

Slaughtering the aristos in their homes is giving an eye for an eye, treating them with cruelty and a brutal disregard for life. Mercy means breaking free of the violent world they’ve created—that they’re blinded by greed and power, and they can rot in their fear while their helots take what is owed for their labor.

‘Taxing’ the yeomen and repaying them with a fraction of that wealth later really is a safe way to survive the winter, and it’s easier to win them back to your side, as an economically aggrieved class.

Nationalism and grassroots democracy are intertwined in Shayard, with the traditional village moot as a basic level of local government, but I question how much popular support the Laconniers have among the yeomanry, judging by Cabel’s supporters.

“Ester Cabel was betrayed by the nobility. Maybe some stripling Rimmer [lord/lady] doesn’t have reason to remember it, four and a half decades on. But those of us whose kin fought and died alongside her do not forget.”

I suppose we’ll find out once the right, glorious Season arrives for the Rising to start again.

[comradelenin]

I think the primary issue I’ve had with low anarchy is the fact that if I mess up, I need to either reset, or go through the motions of finishing the current chapter and then replay it. If I could just restart the chapter without doing all of that, I could do it. Every time I’ve made it far enough with low anarchy, I screw it up with one choice.

I need 21 anarchy and no more, I need the DeMerre Alive which means I can’t have someone else do the raid because at least one always dies, and I need to not use theurgy on the ecclesiast during the winter temple raid. Theurgy is my primary means of fighting, I can’t just not use it unless I want to take numerous casualties.

I have no idea if the steam guide I got that from just assumed I’d be raiding temples (which I don’t, I’m a devout, if heretical, believer in Xthonos) or if I can raid a noble and get away with it, or if I can raid whoever I please with theurgy as long as it’s not in week one. I don’t have time to test all of these variables. Some goes for whether ALL of the DeMerre need to be alive or if one can die in the fighting.

If I want low anarchy, I need to basically NOT FIGHT A REVOLUTION. To have low anarchy I need to basically let my comrades starve or just not save them at the start because I’m too much of a pansy to actually fight. Begging Helots for food and hiding in the woods while everyone dies of tuberculosis isn’t a revolution, it’s the world’s worst camping trip. If I’m not actually fighting anyone or shaking things up, then what am I doing? George Washington didn’t get independence with a strongly worded letter, Lenin didn’t overthrow the Tsar by begging for bred and grain from the people he fought for while avoiding the white army whenever possible, and I can’t establish an egalitarian socialist democracy by camping out in the woods during a famine while the Hegemony keeps grinding my people up into magic juice.
A regime run on human sacrifice is not one that can be toppled with civil disobedience. Bread for bread, blood for blood. THAT is how you beat a dictatorship.

I wouldn’t even CARE about low anarchy if it weren’t for the fact that my end game plan involves getting captured so I can get the magic sword. I need Simon because my combat isn’t high enough to free the others if that happens and I need to free them if I want to take Breden into the Xaos lands with me (and for its own sake). If anyone has any ideas on how to get captured while letting everyone else flee so I can do that, it’s a moot point.

It’s actually really funny that the role of mercy in revolution came up because my current character is named Chara. I did this because a) I’m a huge Undertale fan and b) Chara is actually a real Greek girl’s name and the Hegemony is a Greek-esque culture. Of course, we’re actually British but I forgot about that so I guess Chara is half Karagond.

So far, I’m living up to the name. I’ve tried doing it the peaceful way and I’ve lost my patience, so for now I am Chara Thresher, Butcher of the Rim, Heretical Hero of the Helotry, founder of Catholic Democratic Communism, Comrade of the Commoners, Savior of the Slaves, and Bane of the Bourgeoisie. I will bring salvation and prosperity upon the downtrodden, redemption to the misguided, and swift, brutal justice to the wicked.

I spent way too much time on this comment.

[Ramidel]

@comradelenin

If I want low anarchy, I need to basically NOT FIGHT A REVOLUTION.

And if you fight a revolution, you turn the Rim into Afghanistan. At this stage, all you’re really capable of is running around breaking things, not building a new Order. And when you run around breaking things without having a plan to put them back together, the people who suffer most are the helots and yeomanry.

Remember that when you raid the first estate, it mentions that the Keriatou are far too strong to attack just yet. So you might consider whether it’s more important to gather resources than fight. And Simon is a resource.

@comradelenin

To have low anarchy I need to basically let my comrades starve or just not save them at the start because I’m too much of a pansy to actually fight.

Now that is wrong. You’ve seen my guide, haven’t you? It’s entirely possible to feed your band, and even make a huge profit, without mass wrecking (and you know that I was also playing an arrogant aristocrat who wanted to cooperate with the nobles, and succeeded!). But if you don’t have the necessary restraint to avoid constant plundering and destruction, then embrace the anarchy.

[idonotlikeusernames]

@Ramidel

They tend to be strongly nationalistic and supportive of the Laconniers.

I thought Cabel’s rebellion was the rebellion of the yeomen, at least in the more anglo-saxon parts. They are also less noble friendly and not as enamoured of the Laconniers as the folks down south.

Now the Laconniers may well have significant support among the yeomen too…but from the earlier tidbits of @Havenstone I thought that support would be greatest among the Southern French-esque parts of Shayard and their yeomanry, while the northern parts lean more towards Cabel’s version of nationalism that emphasises the smallholders and craftsmen and not the old nobles.

[Azthyme]

@comradelenin

I need the DeMerre Alive which means I can’t have someone else do the raid because at least one always dies, and I need to not use theurgy on the ecclesiast during the winter temple raid. Theurgy is my primary means of fighting, I can’t just not use it unless I want to take numerous casualties.

You may be misunderstanding whatever guide you’re using. The temple raid has no fighting, and de Firiac only has a problem with crushing the Ecclesiast’s skull, transforming the her eyes into blades, choking her to death, or choking all the priests to death, all of which are needlessly cruel. Everyone else is fair game for Theurgy.

De Firiac’s also fine with killing a de Merre in self-defense (e.g. Zvad or Elery), and Ciels spares the whole family, but you might as well go yourself anyway to get the horse meat and helot recruits.

@comradelenin

If I want low anarchy, I need to basically NOT FIGHT A REVOLUTION. To have low anarchy I need to basically let my comrades starve or just not save them at the start because I’m too much of a pansy to actually fight. Begging Helots for food and hiding in the woods while everyone dies of tuberculosis isn’t a revolution, it’s the world’s worst camping trip.

It’s the Whendward Band—banditry is how they live. It’s just that the easy targets are the most innocent and defenseless. If you still want to fight the system, build up a mule force and hit the noble grain stores. That’ll get barley, at the cost of a few lives.

It’s also ironic that you bring up George Washington, since the winter in the Whendward seems to draw from the American mythological depiction of Valley Forge, which was a Bad Time rife with starvation and disease without much fighting, complete with Sybla as a von Steuben figure. The winter can be a time to bide your strength, recruit followers, and prepare to strike back hard in the summer.

@Ramidel

At this stage, all you’re really capable of is running around breaking things, not building a new Order. And when you run around breaking things without having a plan to put them back together, the people who suffer most are the helots and yeomanry.

Breaking things is, admittedly, part of building a new Order. That’s the whole choice of rebels business. High-anarchy rebels have somewhat more freedom in this regard—rob from the rich, give it to the bourgeoisie (to buy grain), rob the noble barns and Tithe Barns, etc. Basically, exercising restraint and lighting the Rim on fire without laying a finger on the helots or yeomen.

They’ll suffer from downward ripple effects, but idealism doesn’t extend solely to the pacifists out there.

[comradelenin]

I have seen your guide, some parts were indeed helpful, but it’s exactly the fact that you’re character is an arrogant aristocrat that made me unsure whether you’re advice would work for me. There’s also the fact that I wanted to avoid raiding priests for religious reasons, and the yeomen and Helots are the people I fight for in the first place. I think the biggest issue that put me off is that you planned to set Breden up to fail, which is at odds with my own plans for her (she’s my wife and if she is a spy, she’s one I suspect of turning to us for real).

I actually did manage to get through month one with fairly low anarchy a few times following your advice, but something always went wrong in the end. I think I could have managed it if, as I mentioned, I could reset the chapter more freely. With all of this in mind though, I did look over your guide once more, and I believe there are some things I can use regardless of the differences in our playthroughs.

[Havenstone]

@Havenstone

I’ve had one dose of vaccine and am hoping I’ll be able to get a second soon

Just for reference – got that second dose on Sunday. Now the primary threat to my health is dying of frustration at the obstructiveness and preoccupation with petty political infighting of large swathes of the government of Nepal. But here’s hoping we’ll get all our permissions signed and be able to bring oxygen equipment into the country soon.

[Impr]

Does anyone have an idea on a Joseph Joestar type character build for COR would be like stat wise, ideologically wise etc.

[BlaiseB]

I’m rather interested with the idea of Sarcifer’s return. If I’m not mistaken, you mentioned at some point that several Theurge-lead factions might appear in Game 5. Is it possible that he may be leading one of them or has it been long enough for him to pass on (if he hasn’t figured out how to extend his life with theurgy)?

[Shrish_Chauhan]

I have recently discovered this forum and Choice of Rebels is one of my favourite games. But I think the discussion about the game has advanced so far beyond the end of the first installment, that I find myself clueless. Can anybody tell me what is happening in concise, or if there is a demo available for the second installment.

[Havenstone]

@BlaiseB

Is it possible that he may be leading one of them

It is possible. Leading or co-leading.

[King2]

I remember that you said every new game you would be able to add plus 1 to a skill point. So can a MC who originally started off as 1INT become a theurge in the next game if you add a skill point to that,

[Havenstone]

Yup. You’ll even have a teacher.

[Havenstone]

Welcome @Shrish_Chauhan – great to see you here! Sorry to report that I’m still working on Game 2 years after you messaged me on FB, and there’s still no demo ready. But I’m soon going to switch to writing as my main job, which should mean Game 2 gets finished and the other sequels flow much faster.

If you want to catch up on some key information I’ve shared on the forum about upcoming games: here is a brief description of the five-game plot arc I have planned.

Here are some essential spoilers about how Theurgy works, which all players will find out in Game 2 Ch 1.

Here is a description of the culture of the Abhumans, who live south of Shayard and southeast of the Xaos-lands.

There are some links halfway down this post to the main hints I’ve dropped about the Unquiet Dead in the north and their leader Ghaesh.

This post on gender norms includes most of what I’ve shared on Halassur to the East (as well as some on the Nyr and more on the Abhumans).

Here’s the ever-popular list of planned ROs.

Here’s a bit about urban society, which you’ll see firsthand in the second half of Game 2:

Choice of Rebels: Uprising — Lead the revolt against a bloodthirsty empire!

Mara, just to check, on your pacifist runs, do you get this choice? [image] Like I said above, you should only be offered this choice if you’ve been consistently nonviolent throughout the game. If you’re not getting that choice, then you’re picking something earlier that the game considers violent. I can confirm that as a 2 CHA 1 INT character, I was able to finish the game and get the Nonviolence achievement from this point. However, on that runthrough I had also started a religion (keno…

And here’s a section I just posted about Sarcifer the renegade archmage (mentioned briefly in Game 1), a figure about whom people on the forum like to speculate a fair amount.

If you’ve got questions about other specifics, a few forum members have done yeoman’s work in keeping the Choice of Rebels WIki more or less up to date with spoilers I’ve dropped.

Hope that helps, and again, welcome.

[Shrish_Chauhan]

Hey!! Thanks for personally replying @Havenstone . So glad and equally surprised that you actually remember me messaging you about 2 years ago . Thanks for the the links. Please take your time, because we know that the wait will be worth it. Good luck for your future projects!!

[BlaiseB]

Cool

[Agentdeserin]

Hey @Havenstone , this is more of a minor bug thing but for some reason, at the end of the game, when I was asked what leader should I appoint in my absence, it let me choose ‘‘Let the band appoint one themselves’’, in the paragraphs after that, it just shows a blank space where the appointed leader’s name was supposed to be.
Anyways, glad to know you’re doing well! I’m currently keeping the game open on my desktop to rack up an unhealthy amount of hours on the game on Steam. Once I reach about 1500, I’ll leave a funny review. Yes, all that for a meme. Love your work as always!

[BlaiseB]

I have a question for the author. Just out of curiosity, how many religious movements will the MC be exposed to/potentially join? Karagond Codex worshippers and Nyrish skeptics have been covered in the first game and the MC can have the ability to preach their own interpretation of the Codex. Also, there are implications of the Wiendrj’s secret Forgotten Gods’ worship coming into play later. Are there any others and, if possible, anything you’re willing to share about them?