Yeah though iirc it was usually animal blood, so we could do that and still be on brand.
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Haven’t played the demo so apologies if this is answered there, but will we be able to dispell the rumors that we killed hodrion and the priest who’s name eludes me and posssibly ally with those who agreed with them?
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I’m not sure on the first bit, I’m assuming yes once we get to Grand Shayard.
But on the second bit, if I’m not mistaken, Horion was a Leaguer and they’re one of the factions we can ally with in Grand Shayard. So yeah we can ally with Horion’s people.
Though I believe we won’t be visiting Grand Shayard in this book, it’s been moved to the next book.
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Would bang-snap fireworks these things upscaled to the size of a sling bullet work as an anti theurge weapon? Not to kill, obviously, but if they’re big enough they’re probably like fuse-less flashbangs. Which could help distract and confuse a theurge long enough for a friendly archer/theurge/air gunner to get an attack in. And since they’re percussion activated there is no convenient fuse for a hostile theurge to light which makes a hostile theurge setting your explosives before you can even throw them less likely.
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Keep cooking king!!
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Hey there. @Havenstone
I wanted to ask if a few ideas of mine would be possible for the new system after Hegemony.
First about blood tax. I remember that was said abandoning the blood wont be easy, so I want to know could at least we make a hybrid system of tax? I was thinking about a system were everyone should donate blood regularly and just criminals would be faced harrowers? And if we could also add first child sacrifice for nobles only on top of that?
Second, as I just saw the vigil and I’m still curious about what was in there… would we actually understand what’s there and stop it in later games or it’s going to be mystery for ever?
About Wards… could we move it deeper in Xaos ar maybe just add it around vigil if we can’t broke what’s there otherwise?
Also I want to know if there is more chance of asking questions from Cerlota like the ones about Ward and Thaumatarch later in this book? Because the amount I could ask her after she told the secret was short and I couldn’t ask everything or ask and do activities besides. It’s saddening specially because doing activities would boost relationship with her and easier romance. And not asking questions: lower knowledge about ward and other topics we can ask her
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I saw your hybrid tax discussed on here before and iirc that is a planned option, but there will be major pushback by those who have never been taxed that way before and the aetherial component would be so diluted that if you sent everyone who ever brawled, murdered, stole or jaywalked to the Harrower you wouldn’t make up for the deficit from removing the sacrificial caste.
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Hey guys, one thing I’m wondering is, before Theurgy/Aether was discovered there were no border wards right? Cause no one had the sheer amount of “blood” required to upkeep those things.
So what was going on with Xaos Storms back then? Did they still exist? The hegemony is what 300-500 years old? I find it hard to believe Xaos storms predate the hegemony, how did Shayard and Wiendrj deal with Xaos storms pre aether?
I really hope we can completely outlaw harrowing, I’m willing to accept complete agricultural collapse if it means no more harrowing and helotry by extension. Also I’m willing to accept bringing down all border wards except for the ones protecting us from Xaos Storms, Xaos storms seem like the only threat worth keeping harrowing over. If there’s some solution to that outside of border wards I’d really like to know.
Wow, so we don’t know how old the phenomena is?
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Exactly what’s up with the Xaos-Storms is a seeekrit!
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Pretty sure the storms were not around before that certaintly if they were they were not the threat that they are now. Im still getting rid of harrowing there was a conversation about thr storms and wards long ago i forget all the details though.
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It’s funny that you mention this. Earlier this year, I had asked Havenstone about when the stories about Archlich Ghaesh had started circulating. He implied that the fall of Brauracha to Xaos and stories about Ghaesh cropped up around the same time.
In the post above, he gave the impression that the Restless Undead started being recognized around 360 years before the present.
If this info is reliable, then this point in the known timeline is just after the complete Karagon subjugation of Erezza and its claiming of Aveche in Shayard (~20 HE). However, the known timeline also puts the complete destruction of Brauacha to Xaos at 90 HE. This might be a mistake on the author’s part or evidence that the Xaos-Storms overtaking Brauracha was a gradual process. If the Archlich and the Fall of Brauracha are related, then maybe ~20 HE was just the initial creation of the storms (and possibly Ghaesh in his current form). The Great Border Wards were only put up in 91 HE after Hera’s assassination, which would be ~70 years for the issue to spread far enough to become a problem for the Hegemony.
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You are always, always welcome to persist in bug reporting, especially when I’m clearly not grokking the bug the first time around. 
The issue you point out was indeed unintentional, and will be fixed in the next update.
I suspect that even a MC with close mercantile relationships will be limited in how much commercial institutional innovation they can roll out…(here it comes, as ever)…in the immediate wake of a continent-wide imperial collapse. All the institutions you mention rely very heavily on a functional, non-predatory state with rule of law; of course they can (and in our world, widely do) profit on conflict zones, but my instinct is to say that they can’t evolve or be based in one. Let me know if you think that’s overlooking a relevant historical parallel.
Whyever would you guess that that’s the nom de guerre a Kalt unchecked by your influence would end up adopting?
A low anarchy MC will of course have the choice to follow a minimum-anarchy route by adapting as many Hegemonic institutions as possible. They’ll also be able to try to make more changes, and if they succeed, those changes will be more likely to get compliance than in a high-anarchy situation… but in making those changes, they’ll be pushing against power-holders (high priests, guildmasters, generals, noble faction leaders) who haven’t been much weakened by your revolt so far, and are very interested in ensuring the continuation of their institution with as little transformation as necessary.
I loved watching the construction material metaphor get beaten to death, but sadly have been left with nothing to add.
You’ll definitely be able to ally with their faction in Grand Shayard. If you actually killed them, that will eventually be a problem for you…but if you didn’t, you should be able to dispel the rumor with those who care most about Horion.
I think probably not. The risk of the Theurge sensing the pellets on you and killing you with them is too high. (They don’t need a fuse to ignite powder, they’re doing it as a direct elemental manipulation.) Non-explosive flammables would have a similar (low) chance of distracting the Theurge enough to matter in a fight, and a much lower chance of getting you blown up.
Thanks for the encouragement, bud.
I’m afraid criminals will be a bit of a sideshow in your future blood economy, unless you criminalize something as sweeping as “being a homeless refugee.” Here’s a clip from upthread with some detailed thoughts:
For the other half of your hybrid solution, the blood tax…a maximally efficient continent-wide blood tax could cover about 15% of the Hegemony’s current blood consumption. As also discussed above, that’s more or less enough for the yield-boosting bit of the Hegemony’s agricultural program – not the distribution side of it, nor the irrigation/rainfall, nor the industry and military, nor any Wards.
If you’re not turning the nobles into a new slave caste, it would be unlikely that you’d succeed in getting them to consent to sacrificing their firstborn Halassur-style.
The mystery of Vigil will be explained in later books. I can’t promise that you’ll be able to stop it, but at the least you’ll understand it.
The closer you get to Vigil, the faster and harder the Storms come to disrupt your efforts at Ward creation. Like in Horion’s story, set hundreds of miles from Vigil, where they weren’t able to finish their new bit of wall in time. I don’t think it’s plausible to build one super-close to Vigil, even before we bring the streels into the picture.
Yes, but there will be limits, in order to not totally murder the game’s pacing. Let me know what questions you most urgently wanted answers to, and I’ll see if I can work them in.
I think I’ve said somewhere that the Storms started around the fall of Brauracha – when they supposedly opened a gate to Xaos in their efforts to destroy the Thaumatarchy. The Wards were in part a response to this new threat.
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So I have another question. You always talk about the collapse of a continental empire, but what exactly does that mean and what impact does it have? Without that information, you can’t provide any historical examples.
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I think a relevant question for someone who understands theurgy is why she believes a Xaos storm will drop the city ward and the elemental mechanics of how that works vice the storm crashing into normally.
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Yeah I knew that and thats why I was thinking as a aristo and being super friendly with the nobles and having high CHA maybe I could talk them through to sacrifice their first or even second child for the betterment of country and their own life.. I would even give them better status. So that way along blood letting and criminal execution would at least cover 3/4 of the current blood system.
@Havenstone read this too please.
I am also wondering why we can only make inner voice with breden + cha 1? Was that intentional too? If yes why? I thought charismatic people could talk it through ALWAYS.
Can’t we sweeten the deal, more so when we are friends with them? That should make them more willing to follow our changes. Specially when they ALL know if we wanted we could have destroyed them from start. If we were willing to work with them, shouldn’t they do that too?
Even if they don’t we could still break them then and there. Won’t we?
Added in the first quote in this reply. Like to see your thoughts on it.
That’s why I’m suggesting a three way hybrid.
I was thinking about another way too.
As Cerlota said the theurges can have children but can’t keep and should give them to nobles for adoption. If even with all the ways I said first of this reply we can’t adds nobles theres another solution.
We can make theurges sacrifice their children. They can’t have them from start for secrecy and be more focused on the job so why not at least using the blood? That will also stop others like us getting hand on practice theurgy.
But sure I know it will make a powerful opposition because their power and they used being top of the power and it would be hard for them to know whose bloods are on their hands. But we need hard choices and they knowing whose blood they are using would make them more conscious about how it is used, wouldn’t it? It will make theurges more human and grounded in world as not gods or angels. Usage will be more for growth and healing, they can get comfort themselves this way.
Good. I already have a guess as the choise were there and Cerlota has talked about storm twice that shows they could be hand made, even several hands. Also we saw first hand she could start storms, if she can what someone like Sarsifer or even stonger than him could build?
The only thing that is making me doubt this guss is what we felt like a god there. But sure the guess is right as you said the gods and xthonos /xaos aren’t real!?
Why not? We would have a LOT of theurges to help. We could make our own storm to engage the vigil ones till we make ward, or we can even build a real wall with those dark stones of towers if we get to know how they were built later games.and after it is up..? We are saving whole land and would just need to keep the only ward that is located there, this means lower blood need from population. We can also build ward before sreels. There is lower storm rate there and safer distance and the storm beasts will fall in abyss without trouble.
Of course these are ideas for if you don’t add a way to just end the storm, but you are still thinking about that if I got correctly. It’s a long way till the decision is needed you may add something till then.
When I asked I was just thinking to ask all the questions that is there already because I was frustrated when I needed to choose asking for dream heal or about wards. So at first I was asking to at least let us ask all those questions you added already with not limiting to only 3 questions.
Now you mentioned I also can suggest some new one.. I was really interested to know and ask specific she talked with Abhuman guardian. She mentioned generally about that but I reallly am curious to know what was the difference between walls she mentioned or what other information she got there? Maybe add those questions after we ask her what now and she is telling about this talks.
Also I don’t know why I couldn’t talk with the Halassurq? I ask the first question then It was there again I mistakenly choose that again and then he said he need to go😐 think thats a bug.
Think that happened another conversation after that too.
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Now, I have two questions about the game’s underlying worldview.
The first is whether your view of politics is based on realism and pessimism, or on liberalism and optimism. The second is how highly do you estimate the capacity of human institutions and technology to change?
Of course, I’m sure there are many complex issues that cannot be answered by these simplified questions. But I still want you to answer these questions.
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Tell me more…
I mean, this does open the option for the MC to max out Homelander and Anarchy, because going off the anarchy cliff will wreck everyone else as much as it will the MC, and holding territory in Shayard means that all of those desperate Karagond refugees will make excellent fertilizer for the fields that feed your people. Meanwhile, Erezza, Nyr and Karagond proper get invaded by Halassur and turn into a tar pit for the invaders.
…why is Cerlota looking at me and holding a blood vial? 
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Here’s a fun question, does an infinitely tall ward beat an infinitely deep streel? Would a ward reach the bottom? Is there a bottom?
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Happy birthday Havenstone
Edit: Whops I meant happy forum joining day, keep forgetting that you get a birthday cake symbol for that too
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Gotta wonder if Theurgy could restore some of the Xaos lands territory into a farmable state to deal with the famine issue.
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