More transgender options in the cog/hosted games?

I think, for most authors and yes even trans authors, going into this is like stepping into a minefield. People are people and no two people are the same. No matter what designations you use and no matter how carefully you tread the subjects of gender and sexual identity and relationships, someone is going to be offended on such a passionate and contentious subject. I’m afraid it’s as simple as that.

I tried very hard to include a trans character in my last game but, even with the help of a very good transgender friend, the whole of my hope fell to bickering and nitpicking (not to mention some… interesting private messages). In the end, I dispensed with the character entirely and shortly thereafter lost the drive to even continue. While I don’t fault anyone but myself with that failure, I do wish there would have been more support and less controversy and judgment.

I think the honest truth is, when someone feels like they haven’t been represented enough and they finally find a representation with whom they can identify, they have the innate urge to make that person embody who they are. That’s only human. We all want to feel included and, indeed, loved. And ironically we sometimes exclude and scorn others in pursuit of that need.

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Have you considered approaching an established author and seeing if they’d let you help craft a trans-mc for their own game?

I got @LacetheDisgrace to help me with the female MC of Unnatural although she only got to work on the first episode before she had to stop because she got busy.

Yes, I considered it for about two seconds before I realised I really just don’t trust cis people enough. And the people who might not be cis I don’t trust here, either. Don’t trust anyone here much. Except for like, 3 people.

I’m chill with helping a few friends out with trans NPCs though.

Sorry to hear that.

Ironically thats proably the reason I don’t thiink I’d write a trans character becaue I don’t trust MYSELF enough to do a trans character justice.

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It all depends on the environment the story takes place. If the story is set in a modern era, then yeah adding a trans option would make sense. But stories like my own Hero of Eastcliff are set in an era where adding that option really wouldn’t be sensical.

Edit: Ignore my stupidity lmao
I goofed and forgot the definition of transgender.

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There have always been trans people. ALWAYS!

You’re not writing a historical game, are you? (Even if you were, there have ALWAYS been trans people). You’re writing a fantasy game, one with magic? It’s not a real era is it? It’s a fantasy land that you’ve made up based on ye olde times?

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Even if it is in a fantasy world there is still ways to include trans people. Potions, herbs, even magic. Same with scifi

Trans characters have already been in games that don’t take place in modern day. Both Cremisius Aclassi and Maevaris Tilani are trans characters from the Dragon Age universe, which isn’t exactly 2016.

Refer to my edit… :sweat:

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Always existed! Always always!!! I can get more sources but I’m just too tired rn.

Everyone likes to pull the “it’s not historically accurate” card, and then they never bring it up in the discussion of a modern, sci-fi, or magical setting… Hmm… I wonder why… :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

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Personally I don’t really feel strongly one way or the other, so if you feel you need more trans options in your story then all the power to you. I do think the execution might be tricky, because the expectations you have are probably different from a other trans person who might get angry with the way trans was handled.

However for me they aren’t interesting topics so I would appreciate it if the writer would give me the option to skip those parts of the story. It was actually the main reason why I hated the Sea Eternal and couldn’t finish it.

How did you forget? It’s like in the name.

Can people please back off @J3loodT4lon he admitted that he was wrong and that he made a mistake. I think one of the good things about this forum is that we’ve people with all different experiences, and we can learn from each other.

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I’ve been mulling over what you’ve said here.

I suppose I’d be a hypocrite to criticise, because one of the reasons I was drawn to Choice of Games was because they allowed me to play non-straight protagonists, who were every bit as kick-ass as any straight character, and for it to be completely devoid of issues. For prejudice to be a non-issue.

I was so damned tired of the exact same tragic stories that always end in death. I was so fed up of it. Sometimes I just wanted some escapist fun.

I think it’s similar for trans characters for me.

I loved Jinni of the Seven Winds, because it let me play a character who could flip gender at will, and choose how they presented themselves to the world. But it was also so much fun.

I find issues stories less fun. Sometimes if done well, I don’t mind so much if there’s prejudice, but I prefer it to have a happy ending. I don’t want to be ground down by discrimination, unhappy endings, and misery. There’s enough of that in real life.

Edit: This said, I do absolutely love how things like Twine give transgender writers a tool to tell their own stories. I think it’s one thing cis people writing stories of tragedy, and another trans people getting a voice to tell their own.

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I gotta say I agree on the issue stories part. At least for cog. Though my reasons are different. When it comes to social issues in a game they tend to be extremely heavy handed. Like in the Redemption Season.

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Im not sure, what do you mean when you say skip those parts? Like could you bring some example of things you would have liked to be skippable during sea eternal?

Because dont take it wrong but I dont think that you not finding them interesting would be a good enough reason to skip some of the story or re-write gender selections. At least thats the idea I got from your commentary.

I can understand the frustration of seeing a game you would really enjoy playing, only to realize it doesn’t include something you would prefer it to include, but it comes down to what the writer wants in their world. I can tell you right off the bat that I will not be including a trans option in Hero of Eastcliff. It isn’t because I don’t agree with people identifying as trans, but simply because this is my first game, and I have already made the coding complicated by adding in items, stats strength, dexterity, intelligence, constitution, wisdom, charisma… Some of those add modifiers to damage and initiative. Then there are some items that have magical properties that add additional types of damage and increase your stats… I have a vision in my head of what I want the story and the game to be, and (as I said above) the coding is already incredibly complicated for my first game without adding in more gender options that would effect NPC reactions to the character.

The main thing people need to understand is that we don’t necessarily make these games for the player. We make them for us, the writer. We have a story that we want to tell, and we are kind enough to put forth the effort to make it available for others to read and play through.

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I like character choice, A LOT the more the merrier, if playing non-straight protagonists is your thing then I feel you should be allowed to play the game your way. (Same goes for Trans characters.)

I myself am more traditionalist in that sense. I love playing these games because they allow me immerge myself in a fantasy world and just forget about my day-to-day life for a few hours and pretend I’m someone else.

I just don’t like engaging with trans subjects in my game. I play these games to relax myself and (maybe because I can’t relate) but when these issues (from the main character or NPC’s) are forced upon me during the game I simply wish that for the players like me there would be a option of “Nope, I don’t wish to get involved in this argument.” But I do see where people would like these storylines, so on the other side I also feel like there should be catered to these people.

For example, I encourage someone who would try to write a CoG aimed towards trans people. I however would not be the right demographic so if I know upfront then I know to not spend my money on that game because it’s not up my alley.

It’s been a while since I played it, but first I believe my SO (who I believe I had already broken up with? Atleast she was the only human in the city at the start.) wanted to switch genders, I was fine with that. I mean all the power to you.

[spoiler]But then there was the new human who wanted to switch genders and basically forced me a long into that storyline, which I absolutely hated it. Because it wrote that NPC very poorly (in my opinion) and totally too dependent on other peoples opinions about him/her.

I just wish that I had the option there to respond for example “If that’s how you feel cool I’ll respect it, but I don’t want to talk to so-and-so for you to convince them to accept you.”[/spoiler]

I’m not asking to rewrite anything, I just wish I could skip that sidestory, if that resulted in certain characters being angry with me even better because that would mean my stoic reply had consequences.

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I dont remember this part as being particularely forced or badly written. In fact, I think we didnt have to focus on this at all but it have been a while since I played. Your opinion is your own but I still dont find it to be a good enough reason to entirely skip something the author wrote. I dont want to push this further though because I do not believe we will agree on this point.

Also, if authors dont want to write trans characters then maybe we should encourage more peoples from the trans community to join us. After all they will alway write trans characters and issues better than non trans. Absolutely dont mean that non trans shouldnt write trans characters but I would definitely cooperate with the community to make sure nothing end up being insulting if I were an author. CoG have alway been a haven for equality and I would be delighted to hear that we have trans writers. I believe we already have one though but I cant remember who.

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Not in anything like the modern conception. There’s been a number of cases of ‘third genders’ throughout history, though not in all cultures, but a question like “what gender do you identify as” in a medieval setting would be about as anachronistic as asking what political party they belong to.