As someone who’s been on the forum for a bit, I definitely agree there. The chance to see a story unfold, to just check the thread a couple times a week and chat with the other regulars, to make the chance to make comments on it, all of that seems to feed into the popularity of WiPs and testers. The way a certain project can just become a part of your daily life is definitely an important part of the process.
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It’s really interesting to hear these perspectives. I only put up 3 chapters or so of Creme and Noblesse Oblige, and I think 6 chapters of Royal Affairs (so about half the game) - I’m starting to wonder about putting up more next time round.
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I would assume the loss of sales is largest among the group that played the game but didn’t really take part in the WIP thread (or who didn’t like the game’s ending or something, in which case… at least they won’t be asking their money back)
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Maybe I’m just burnt out lmao. I’m the kind of person who prefers story games over repetitive gameplay ones, so I prefer experiencing new things over “getting gud.” For me the sweet spot has always been playing a WiP that only has a couple chapters, then buying the full game to play the rest. It gives me just enough to figure it out, but not enough to give me the full experience.
I do replay games that I really enjoy, but it’s not something I typically do with most of them.
Edit: Upon further consideration, this ^ is not true at all 
. I replay games all the time. That being said, I do find that I play fewer games than I used to and finish them even less. Maybe I’m just a grumpy old man now. 
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I don’t frequently read WIP, I typically prefer to be pleasantly surprised when a new work releases rather than heartbroken if the author discontinues it. On the rare cases I do read a WIP, if I even remotely like it, I’ll buy the finished game once it releases, regardless of whether I intend to read the finalized version.
I do think, however, that reading the WIP can kind of ruin the experience of the final work. I love Fallen Hero Retribution, 11/10 amazing game, but it is one of the main works I remember reading the WIP for and then also reading the finished version. It didn’t stop me from buying it nor did it lead me towards buying it (since I would have purchased it whether I read the WIP or not). I think it did reduce the magic of the “first playthrough” but reading the WIP kept my attention on the series and author during the wait for Retribution.
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Are WIPs spoiling us? Yes. Is it necessarily a bad thing? Nope.
Fallen Hero: Retribution definitely didn’t disappoint me. The same goes for Fernweh Saga. Those two demos only managed to entice me more to buy both titles on the day of release because I wanted to honor the effort of their respective authors.
Then again, I’m one of those players who can repeatedly play a near-identical playthrough and still not be bored just because I’m so immersed in the story. If I enjoyed a good narrative once, I will likely enjoy it again. And again and again. Especially when I’m able to play the entire thing offline whenever I please. Sure, on the first playthrough, suspense may be an important factor but, for example, Fallen Hero: Retribution only got more interesting to me when I discovered the many different variations and possibilities.
As somebody who was involved in the Mind Blind beta for a while, I’ve already read a large part of the game. However, I’m still intending to buy it as soon as it comes out because I know what I’m getting and that I will 100% enjoy it. I guess I’d rather buy a game that offered me “too much” insight into its content and my prospective enjoyment than something that gave me “too little”.
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This is such a curious point, and especially food for thought for both writers and readers!
From the perspective of a reader,
I think it comes down to how you personally prefer to play Choicescript games, and whether you’re the sort that can still enjoy a novel on its second read through. Personally, I’m the sort to like rewatching shows or rereading books to notice things I may have missed the first time around. The same goes for WIPs to games–seeing the changes can be extremely satisfying in its own way or simply by changing a few choices here and there to see what happens. That may depend on how much variation is offered with choices though.
Of course, burnout is real, even if you love the material in front of you. The novelty and magic might wear, and curiosity might not be enough every time to justify another playthrough. (I believe there was another thread some time ago regarding whether people prefer to do a single playthrough or multiple and that the conclusion seemed to be that the majority of people leaned towards one.)
From the vantage point of a writer,
Having a greater chunk of the game available might both entice readers. Likewise just having a sign of life and seeing updates on the WIP/game can be encouraging so you can keep readers invested until release date.
Typically what I’ve found through code-diving and personal experience is that games branch the most near the end… Therefore, those sections are probably ones that would benefit most from thorough testing. There’s nothing more immersion breaking as heading to the grand finale, only to find out that it disregards your choices thusfar. So I can see there being a lot of benefit for writers who would like to have any potential issues spotted and sorted for a wide range of MC builds. Though I can also understand the concern of losing readers once you’ve got all your cards on the table already.
Also worth considering is that the forums will only comprise a certain amount of one’s potential readers, and having the additional feedback may very well be worth the lost revenue compared to say… a negative/one-star review by someone steamed that the game suddenly “broke” for them in the last chapters.
In summary,
I’d say that there are pros and cons. Writers have to balance the hypothetical benefits of more-testing for vital scenes & interest-momentum with tester-burnout.
For readers, I’d say that’s something you should look at personally in terms of content-novelty or engaging with the fanbase/developmental process.
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I will in fact play games like I would watch a movie or read a book.
So I will play it over and over and over again, often making the exact same choices because the excitement never really dies for me, unless (a) the project takes a turn that ends up disappointing me (like building tension and then just… not doing anything with it) or (b) I outgrow it (see, stories I was obsessed with as a kid, but upon review, no longer interest me as much). I don’t even care that much about spoilers (though there is a kind of magic in seeing it for the first time in the text as well).
So seeing the WIP doesn’t do any damage for me in terms of deciding to buy it. And frankly, between the public beta build closing and the game being released, I’ve forgotten enough that it’s fun again. Plus, sometimes I’ll get busy and not follow a thread for a while, then see the game published and be like, ‘hey, I remember liking that!’
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On the question of “public beta,” and why it doesn’t have to mean posting your draft HG for 100% open access, have a look at this thread and the ones it links to:
I’ve never heard of CoG objecting to CoG-label authors posting the whole game at beta. I did a fully open beta for XoR, which went on to have (at the time, 6 years ago) the best first-day sales of any CoG to date. I plan to do it again with XoR2. As I’ve said on a bunch of the threads behind the link above, any sales I might have lost were more than made up for by the feedback I got on the whole game.
I suspect the only reason more CoG authors don’t do open betas of the whole game is that nagging worry about losing money… which is understandable, but I’m not sure is actually borne out by the sales of games, CoG or HG, that have built up a forum fandom during development.
I’ve also yet to hear from any beta testers with buyers’ remorse, because there was nothing new in the version they bought… but that doesn’t mean you’re alone out there, @ClaimedMinotaur. I’m sure there are others who feel they’ve spoiled themselves for the final version by diving deep into the WiP, and all I can say as an author is thanks for your sacrifice if you gave me feedback in the process.
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I’d love it if you did. I only recently played Creme, despite having seen the demo up before. I automatically stuffed the game into the “teeny bopper in school” category, so I didn’t even bother with the demo, since it was so short. It’s only after getting a rec from someone with tastes similar to mine that I gave the game a chance, and I’m damned glad I did! It was a really good game!
Getting to see more of the game is a plus, and one reason I had joined a couple of patreons. I was kind of pissed when they stopped being allowed to share the alpha build with patrons because it was no longer allowed by CoG. As long as there’s a decent-sized demo available to the public, I don’t see why it’s any skin off anyone’s nose to have the alpha build available behind a paywall. Just my opinion, though…
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I totally missed this – when did this happen?
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Sometime last year, I think. Now, any part of the game that is shared on Patreon has to be shared on the demo thread (within a certain amount of time). At least, that was my understanding of it. It’s why a couple of authors decided to move their work to Twine (blech!), so they can share what they want via Patreon without having to make it all public.
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Ah, right – otherwise it would be commercial use, getting Patreon $ for a game only the people who pay you have access to. I can understand that.
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It feels like I’m alone . I’m definitely getting the sense that people appreciate the full access that they get. Idk. Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like it takes away some of the magic when you finally play the finished version. 
I remember playing Tin Star (the absolute GOAT, fight me) for the first time and being completely blown away by how much content there was. I’m still discovering more secrets about it to this day. I never would have felt that feeling if I played the whole thing before release.
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I’m guessing you don’t like spoilers, either. 
A lot of people do avoid playing demos for sequels, so you aren’t alone there. For one-shot games, you could always just avoid the demos. Or only play a couple of chapters to get a feel for the game. I often find that’s not enough to truly get a feel for things, though. I honestly started playing Wayhaven thinking I would be playing an actual, competent detective surrounded by supernaturals. That’s not the case at all, but I keep playing it.
People are just different when it comes to what draws them in and whether they replay or not. The more spoilers I have, the more excited I get. Without spoilers, I tend to speculate (if I’m interested in the game) and piss everyone off with my, umm, realistic take on things. Not pessimistic. Nope, not that… 
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From my opinion this might happen if a game has a dev cheat option so you can test out what happens if there is a certain threshold crossed so you can test everything without having to follow the exact same route again and then playing the game without those dev tools which makes it way harder.
Then about seeing everything beforehand and so not being hyped that is not a problem of mine.
Personally when I first saw everything I am even more declined to buy the work because then I can be sure it is to my taste. It happened to me more times that I liked, that I play demo of a game, buy the game, play the rest and then get more disappointed cause I feel like there whas decline in the game during playing that whas not in the Demo chapters.
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I hate spoilers, it’s true, but that doesn’t stop me from playing WiPs. If you think I can resist the content dangling in front of me on a string, you’d be wrong.
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Ah, so self-control is the problem! I’d give you advice on that, but when it comes to having interesting content dangled in front of me, the only thing going through my mind is, “Gimme!!!”
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That’s a part of it, certainly, but that never stopped me until recently. As this thread goes on, I am less and less certain about what it is, but it seems like these games are declining in quality for me and I don’t understand why. Maybe it really is burnout.
Edit: You know what it might be, actually? It seems like just about every game nowadays is written as part of a series. Maybe the endings to them feel… Idk… incomplete? With Fallen Hero and Zombie Exodus SH, especially, it literally felt like it ended mid conversation. I was like, “Wait… That’s it?”
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Is it certain types of these games you feel that way about?
The more games I find that fit my tastes, the less inclined I find myself to give games that don’t fit that mold a chance. I may play a chapter or two of the demo, but if it doesn’t grab me, I’m out (unless someone whose opinion I trust gives it a good rec).
Before, when there were so few games that appealed a lot to me, I was playing any demo I saw pop up. Now, I’m probably too discriminating. No romance built into the story? No thanks (despite loving found family stories and stories with strong friendship). Too many stats and seriously stat-driven? Nope, because that probably means my MC doesn’t really make connections with anyone (even if that may not be true, experience has made me make that conclusion).
It’s a habit I need to break, really, because I’m probably missing a lot of good games just because I scan the description and, if available, romance options, and decide they aren’t for me.
Do you feel that way about the one-shot games, though? I often feel the one-shots are less complete. Or rushed, one of the two.
OMG! FH2 had an ending that felt good, once I got a run that fit my MC, anyway. And it actually felt like it could stand on it’s own. Some loose threads, yes, but it worked.
Can’t speak about ZE. I tried the Safe Haven game, but trying to keep track of all my stats drove me nuts. And I think I kept dying. I can’t really remember. I never finished the game. There’s another one, where you’re dead or something, that was the same way for me. I just got annoyed and quit.
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