Shattered Eagle: Fall of an Empire (WIP) [509k Words | Interlude Update 06/19/2025]

Domestic abuse are those universal patterns. It’s why we can categorize them as domestic abuse. There are markers for domestic abuse that allow people to identify such a case.

You don’t know how most people actually play the game. What you’re doing is projecting your own preference and preconceptions on undocumented majority. Also, whether it’s majority or minority, it doesn’t really matter. Appeal to majority is a logical fallacy.

Sure, we can make a poll to see how people play their prefect. Projecting my preference? You think being successful at their goal, especially one that the players can choose, isn’t something to be expected on players? It’s absurd to think that it’s somehow irrational to expect that other players want their prefect to do well at their ambitions. Appeal to majority is the belief that something is factual if most people think it is factual in a case where belief is not relevant. That does not apply here. The point was about how people will want to play their prefect so it’s absolutely in line that what the majority thinks matters.

You have ignored in your argument that a self-serving Prefect doesn’t have to assist the ailing Empress and her daughter in a manner a morally upright person would, but they can instead use the given tasks as opportunities to form their own personal alliances and power base. Such prefect isn’t “taking care” of those characters, but using them to accumulate personal power, potentially to the point of usurping the throne.

Afterwards we have switched to a tangent you started, that the game prefers morally upright Prefect because “it wouldn’t make sense to be asshole to Augusta or Julia”. But not only this is quite misleading, as it pairs self-serving with asshole and morally upright with nice, the entire justification is basically your own expectation that the game will eventually punish asshole Prefect for being asshole to Augusta and/or Julia “because it’d make sense”. Unfortunately, until the game actually does such a thing – as it currently does not – this is only a conjecture and as such doesn’t really support your original argument.

How am I ignoring how that caring for a Julia and Augusta doesn’t have to be something only a morally upright prefect can do, when that is exactly my point? It’s literally in the quotes. The very act of caring will be more aligned with a morally upright prefect because such action is associated with being prosocial and empathetic. The motive could be selfish but that doesn’t change the fact that those narrative elements will be more resonant and impactful to a player who is genuinely doing those things because, I don’t know if you forgot, humans are emotional beings that interface with the people and experience around them.

It shifted around the topic of a sensible prefect not being an asshole to Julia and Augusta because you think that being an asshole prefect to the people in power totally makes sense even if you’re playing as a self-serving prefect who is trying to succeed. Do you play a game with no foresight with your actions? You think players don’t think how their actions will have consequences? Even if the game doesn’t punish being an asshole to Julia and Augusta, it’s still totally rational to expect that lowering your relationship points with them will lead to negative results. And this will inform players on how they will act with their prefect.

2 Likes

I loved playing Shattered Eagle! It was the best game I’ve ever played and here’s my character: Cassius Septimus!

8 Likes

Ugh, Constantine. One of my least favorite emperors (for MANY reasons).

Though I always point out that Rome was ALWAYS the capital of the Roman Empire. It’s a misconception that it ever stopped. It was the seat of the Senate and people and had a unique status up until the fall of the western empire (and even then, officials of the Eastern Empire were initially anxious whether the loss of Rome meant they were even still Roman — until Justinian forcefully reframed it so the answer was definitely yes).

Rome had a terrific ideological charge as the capital — but later non-senatorial emperors, much like some players, did not want to deal with it. So as you all know, emperors like Diocletian and Constantine avoided Rome and moved their courts elsewhere. Scholars these days don’t call them capitals (except for Constantinople, which by the time of Constantius II was taking on the trappings of a second Rome) but “imperial / court cities” to make it clear the importance of Rome wasn’t eclipsed even if decisions were no longer made there.

It’s a real Gothic name — you might recall it from the Battle of Adrianople.

4 Likes

Diocletian’s court was pretty mobile iirc.

Constantine based his court in Trier while he was Augustus of the Western Empire.

Why so high?

1 Like

Yep! And each of the tetrarchs similarly, and none of them took Rome. I’ve heard some scholars suggest nobody was allowed to take the capital as the seat bc it would imply one tetrarch was senior to the others (e.g. one augustus over another).

Why do I dislike Constantine? Mostly for his imposition for monarchical ceremonial (Diocletian is often blamed for this, but Constantine was the first to wear a diadem) on what was previously a civic magistracy. He also took the first real steps to impose a bureaucracy which drained the cities of the Empire of their town councils and magistrates. It was a “brain drain” (and wealth drain) that spelled the doom of the classical city state that was accountable to its citizens.

He was also murderous and cruel, especially to his own family.

I just tend to prefer emperors who remember they’re magistrates of a republic and not god-kings. Autocrats like Diocletian, Constantine, and especially Justinian earn my ire.

This is why in this game I sit at Consentia’s table. :wink:

4 Likes


If Justinian 1.0 is not your cup of tea, I dread to think what is your opinion of Justinian 2.0, Noseless Edition. I suppose it would be like going to a lower circle of Hell.

9 Likes

Funnily enough, Justinian II is the origin of my interest in Byzantine/Roman history. I was at a local book fair as a kid and found a used copy of a historical fiction novel about him, obviously very inaccurate and so on, but it piqued my curiosity about the Empire and the vicious, dramatic intrigue that went on in it. Later I went and studied Byzantine history in college for my minor, and then eventually set down to write this.

Justinian II is fascinating because he’s almost the inversion of that classic “lost prince” story where the privileged prince is dethroned by evil usurpers, learns valuable lessons in his exile and heroically retakes his throne as a changed man.

Except, he was already a middling to poor Emperor, survived his exile by allying with various ‘barbarians’ and returned to power by sneaking through a disused aqueduct into Constantinople. (seriously!) Yet, he ended his second reign and life as a tyrant put down when everyone had enough of him for good. It would be fit for a movie except for the fact that the man was just that awful that I doubt audiences could sympathize with him.

19 Likes

Justinian Rhinotmetus’s reign is so… movie-like, for a lack of a better description.

Just one example: You are an usurper and you just dethroned an unpopular emperor. Okay. What do you do with him? Well, no need to kill him, let’s just cut his nose off. He will be rendered unfit to rule due to religious/cultural reasons because he is not whole. Okay, nose cut off and you ship the dethrone lad to some faraway place. Problem solved, right?

Well, what happens if said noseless lad puts on an articial nose made of gold? Oh boy, and he is coming back with an army of pagans! Next thing you know, you are a temporary foot stool and eventually get killed.

Great revenge story. Unlike many dynasties that enter into history with a bang and go out with a whimper, the Heraclians came in with a bang and went out with an explosion. Justinian II is the reason why the mortality rate for future dethroned emperors skyrocketed.Since you can’t just cut the man’s nose off to render him unfit to rule, you need to straight up blind or kill him.

Also, The Twenty Years’ Anarchy (695-717) period is more Game of Thrones than GoT.

I would see him as being a morbidly fascinating protagonist. Have the first movie show the extent of his…personality and unpopularity during his first reign.

Then the second would be focused on his two successors with Justinian looming in the background, brooding and plotting (basically the greater villain). Ending would be his less-than-heroic return.

Then the third would be his final descent into madness, so to speak.

You can’t really find a good guy to root for in this story, but it would be a really dramatic story. I could see the number of people choosing Byzantine studies at uni go into the stratosphere after this.

12 Likes

You’d be correct that I despise him too, for similar reasons. Putting the death knell to the consulship (a process started by the first Justinian) and continuing to suppress the few remaining pagans isn’t very endearing to me. You might credit both of them for helping to transform the late Roman Empire into what we now think of the Byzantine or medieval Roman Empire.

Of Justinian (the first)’s contemporaries, I rather like Amalasuintha, Anicia Juliana, and Hypatius.

So this is my opinion about the story so far, since this is supposedly serious story about politic, intrigue and scheme I will treat it as such.

My opinion about the political situation

I am not sure about this story, it’s too much intrigue however the intrigue is crude, simple and shameless, the character is portrayed as flamboyant schemer not exactly intricate webweaver.

Everyone here is selfish politician, bad poker player, bad chess player as well, they really make their move visible, there is no bait and switch tactic there is no feint, it just either you with us or against us kind thing

My opinion about the relationship and social interaction

So far I didn’t notice much relationship in this story, the only relationship if that even can be called a relationship is either with Julia or Augusta, Julia because MC follow her for along time there should be somewhat friendship there, Augusta is somewhat feel like building relationship.

For other characters it’s more like buying friends than actually making friends because interaction with them is very lacking of goodwill as it overshadowed by them keep asking for favor each time MC come to them for help, this make the story imbalance between RO and depend on what Gender MC is.

My opinion about MC so far

By age of 40 MC barely have anything under control, their life is a mess they have not secured their position, their house is not in order, there is no child ( except if MC is certain Gender ) again pointing to imbalance story.

As 40 years old MC is naive they have no political capital, what kind of politician running in the office for that long and have no hook on others, no blackmail material, they have no spy network, no connection, prefect of the largest empire in the world, have access to treasury but hiring thugs and random crooks for doing their stuff, MC have no contingency plan in case something goes wrong.

In such important position, with so much influence MC have no personal retinue, no house guard, no personal guard, no trusted confidant, no underling, no steward, no spymaster, no advisor, no staff, no helping hand, not even single bodyguard.

At no point in the story suggests MC have their own wealth, owning own property, having source of income beside “being prefect”, owning land, I get impression that MC live in dorms instead having their own estate/mansion, having their own fief, complete with array of supporting staff fitting their status, instead they use Empire wealth embezzle funds for their own gain.

If author trying to portray MC as experienced and competent 40 years old politician they fail to do so, this is more like 25 years old newly appointed bureaucrat.

Suggestion
  1. Lower MC age to 35 or 30, because right now as 40 years old mc feel like they sleep too much on the job, incompetent, naive and unprepared.

  2. Shorten the time skip, fill it with what MC do to portray them as better character, building their network, building their political capital, getting their things together, organizing spy network, support organization, recruiting loyal follower for their own cause, building their wealth, developing their fief or estate or land, business venture, research, adventuring commission, etc.

  3. Make other Characters more Human, because right now they are like vending machine, I want beer and they answer for beer it’s 4$ non negotiable, human bartender at least will say okay bro this one on the house this time hoping for customer continued future patronage.

  4. Balance the story especially, right now playing as Female MC it feel like lacking especially hetero option, Male MC on the other hand is limited to Hetero option because why not bang Empress? What Female do? Yes can bang empress as well but that will not resulting in biological child, unless there is magic that miraculously make this possible there is surely reader that want their own child not adoption.

  5. Make it more flexible, I get the impression this is too feminist leaning, there is no option to be traditional here make it balance, adds replayability and variety, play both side of spectrum and more, explore every side be it role of Supremacist leader, uniting Moderate or bringer of change.

3 Likes

Firstly, I would like to say… I adore this a lot. It is so good. I am so invested.

Moving on from that, I wanna ask… can we romance the emperor? because I kind of want to. Augusta is my biological daughter, the emperor and I obviously have a strained relationship, but I have been trying to get Augusta to also rekindle some of her relationship with her… father… or whatever you wanna call him. I’m playing as: I am using the empress, but I adore my daughter, and although I get annoyed at Titus and provoke him at times… I also concede to him at times and try to reconcile because my character does feel a little guilty.

I am using every single character… full on. Just pretend flirting with every single one. By the way, in the future, do we ever get a choice where in the end we decide whether we are still just using them or if we actually fell for them, because I do also like that idea. The character I am playing would definitely start off using everyone. Gathering power. At the moment I have the barbarians or whatever as my allies and the prince as well. I want to gather more. I want to gather them all. lol (Pokemon gotta catch em all)

Anyways, point is I am very invested.

Last little note: In the scene where they are describing that the goddes made women/men to be kind, etc… or whatever it was… before listing maybe use a colon :

Ex: They were: gentle, sweet, and kind.

I also kind of hope I can slightly balance Augusta to being a ruler who is both cold, cruel, and yet cares for her people and will be benevolent towards them. I want her to be cruel and rutheless towards her enemies, to make her people fear yet love her, I want her to also be benevolent to her people, spend where it is necessary. Perhaps learn either economics, philosophy (scholarly), rhetoric, or to fight. Maybe subterfuge, if possible. I want her to be cunning, calculating. I want to teach her about the world and let her experience some of it. I want her to become calculating, educated, and adaptive to the situation… I wanna maker her look up to me more than the empress.

Anyways, I went on a rant. I just love this so much. Also I probably switched topics 17 times for which appologize. ADHD.

3 Likes

I am not sure how is that possible to implement, as Male MC you can cuckold the Emperor by siring Augusta with Julia in this case Augusta will be your Hidden bastard.

As Female MC you can’t because obviously Augusta will not born from the Empress, she will be born as your child as Female MC with you as pregnant mother as your pregnancy in case you slept with Emperor Augusta will be known bastard her father will be unknown.

Like I said previously this is imbalance in the story, however the gender can’t be changed since the Empire is Matriarchal Empire, it’s Empress that hold power not the Emperor.

Unless as Female MC you have the best of both world (have Breast as well as both V and P) that make you secretly androgynous, so you as female can sire child with other female.

Genuinely asking: “feministleaning,” do you mean because to switch it up they went from the stereotypical Roman Empire thing of women are very much weaker in society to that being men? Wouldn’t it just end up the same if the roles are reversed but instead “male leaning.”

2 Likes

Feminists leaning in context of how there is no option to pick other side here according to the story, no alternative narrative player can pick.

The story so far is :

FMC living for 40 years and never once thinking about making happy family? Focus on finding good man, all MC do is just work being career woman, the only mention is unknown dead late husband that MC didn’t love, doesn’t even bother to remember the name and have no child from that union, after that MC just drop this entirely.

Isn’t this too feminist if player play as FMC?

Lets not jump to what if scenario outside of the story, I am speaking strictly from the option in the story and how the story is being told.

This you? This account was made exactly a day ago when C_Kagara got suspended over argumentative behaviour, and then you magically come back to this thread spouting the same ‘woe is me Female MC has expiration date because she’s 40year old and no pregnancy’ or something. C’mon.

29 Likes


“And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren’t for you @SourPeaches.” Cue Scooby-Doo theme song

24 Likes

Genuinely a strange thing to do. Especially to keep arguing for… what, fem MC having a happy “traditional” (in a setting totally different from ours at that, with different traditions) family instead of focusing on their political career and allies and/or the empire and/or imperial family in… the political career/imperial drama game?

I don’t get it.

15 Likes

Just saying my opinion doesn’t need to shame and frame people.

Is it weird to suggest younger MC?
Is it weird to suggest more option to be added?

Just giving my two cents about the story so far nothing more.

From everything I wrote, you only focus on one thing the age.

I wrote the story lacking several necessary detail like how weird is it to have MC as Prefect that have no trusted servant, no support character (like steward, maid, lady in waiting, agent) no support staff (example like secretary, personal courier and whatever else to complement their position), MC despite their position doesn’t seem to have personal guard, doesn’t have security detail.

Next is what achievement and reward they get so far?

Next is do they have fief, do they own a land, a house, a mansion, castle? how about MC source of income? Plantation, maybe from trade? How about MC family? That and many more I put in there.

One can be politician and be something else, the story will be better, more option means player have opportunity to play in whatever style they want, the story will be more vibrant.

In the end it is just suggestion to the author.

2 Likes

Is there anything you like about this game?

2 Likes

Leaving aside the opinions themselves, I believe the main problem lies with the fact that you have given far more than merely two cents on these topics.

Feedback is expected around this forum, but reiterating it over and over again, in a rather uncompromising way, is simply rude.

Your two cents were certainly acknowledged by everyone, including the author. As you can most likely sense, neither the author nor most of our fellow players agree with them. Since such a discussion hasn’t lead anywhere, it should reach a natural end.

If nothing can be done, nothing should be said any longer.

14 Likes