Growing Game Lengths

Does hearing that a game is 100, 200 or 300k words really tell a reader much though?

300k work can have a dozen heavily branched paths resulting in 50k playthroughs (just the text you see on screen) or it could have the opposite, longer and more streamlined 100k+ PTs. A game could also be not very efficiently structured code-wise (chunks of text being copy-pasted multiple times) resulting in higher word count there really is.

Imo average (mean) playthrough length is more informative in this case, if you consider that all the different paths in the story are more or less equal.

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@anon8836198 I think that’s explicitly what we’re asking–longer? Or more shorter? As I said, take it for granted that you’re getting 5 playthroughs out of any CoG title regardless of length. Do you want 10 playthroughs or do you want 5?

Well, since authors here are going to focus on author earnings, can you give us a general idea of how author earnings track with length of release?

Like for example, do 300k releases generally earn the authors writing those twice as much as do 150k releases?

I know there will be variance based on genre and other factors, but I would think a general relationship would be apparent either way.

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Yes; I see what you’re saying, now.

The relationship is not that direct, but longer games typically show higher projected first year revenue. Again, I’m talking about Choice of Games games.

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As an author, the element of game-length inflation does concern me a bit. I don’t want to feel pressure (from players or myself) to make longer and longer games (possibly in a longer along of time) for the same advance amount. A certain subsection of players are always going to say that a game feels short, no matter how long it is, just as there are always some people who complain about paying for the games. People gonna people.

As a player, I think it really depends on the game … which is a cop out I know! But a game doesn’t have to be super long to be indepth, enjoyable and replayable. Nor does a game’s genre necessarily mean that it has to be on the longer side. I’ve enjoyed plenty where the wordcount was on the lower end of the modern CoG games. I’ve played others with a high wordcount where I didn’t enjoy the ending so much because I didn’t feel like it had room to breathe.

Side note, I haven’t encountered CoG games where the demo was overly long compared to the rest of the game. The demos are usually about 3 chapters if I recall, which puts it at about a quarter to a third of the way through. I think that’s a very reasonable amount of free game to give a good idea of the themes and content, and to help players decide whether they want to buy the full game.

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I realize you’re talking about CoGs. I guess for authors it comes down to my question though, “Is it a logical economic investment to write a longer game?” And to answer that question, they would need to look at the data and do the math.

I’d be curious how Rebels, Cat, and others fair saleswise when broken down by word/sales ratio. (not asking for this info! Just saying that is the data that would need to be crunched)

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It might also be worthwhile to consider that some authors might have sources of income other than game sales. Monthly content subscription services like Patreon come to mind.

That is the data I have crunched. I think it is absolutely a logical investment to write a longer game, but I also believe there may be diminishing returns. I.e., a 150,000 word game may benefit from an additional 50,000 words more than a 300,000 word game benefits from the same amount. Does that make sense?

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It absolutely does. I know you folks must have your finger on the sales pulse. And I know it takes you folks a ton of time to edit and help develop CoGs, and you’d want to know where the “sweet spot” is for revenue versus investment.

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I think it’s not just that, but one thing I’d like to know is why (if it is indeed the case) a few longer games have “ruined” the customer base for shorter good games. Look at Pendragon Rising: a 115,000 word game that had very solid sales and was quite popular in 2015. People now (going by the poll alone) turn up their nose at 150,000 word games.

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On the note of ‘pushing back releases’:
With some games this year I got the impression the author got hit with writer’s block or similar thus having the game fall short. (or in bad cases they didn’t seem to have any interest in writing anything but the story present)
If that happens it might be better to push the game back and let the author do their thing?

I don’t know if there is a word for this, but I’ve noticed that, as some products get more popular, consumers will perceive something new that does not have the same amount of “substance” (in their opinion, this is completely subjective, and indeed unfortunate, I think) as a previous product as inferior, even if this is demonstrably untrue or purely a matter of opinion.

It’s like people might be thinking: “Yes, I bought this game in 2015 and it was 115,000 words, but now it is 2018 and these games are still 115,000 words?! They should’ve improved by now.”

EDIT: This becomes infinitely more subjective when the “substance” of a product is words, like so many would define as the “substance” of gamebooks.

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Well, they have. Our games are rarely shorter than 150,000 words.

I think this is not a fair take on the poll respondents preferences. @HannahPS stated it perfectly:

This doesn’t mean a player is turning their nose up at shorter games. Assumptions of this nature is why I hate these types of poles …

Edit: Just to make it clear @Mary_Duffy - I much prefer one longer complete game than several shorter episodically released series of games making one whole.

I enjoy both types but the amount of enjoyment I get out of those games broken down into multiple parts is dependent on many variables included time between releases, retcons and other factors.

This is all from a reader’s standpoint.

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While sometimes authors discuss their writing process or speedbumps along the way, such as the author of Choice of the Petal Throne, who talked candidly about her health issues when creating the game, it’s not helpful to speculate. There are any number of reasons why a player might not enjoy a game - an author having writers’ block could well happen, but it’s not really any of our business.

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True, I apologize.

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Heck, even not wanting to write something anymore is a perfectly valid reason, in my opinion.

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@MeltingPenguins I sense an assumption here that you think the beta process can/should/is expected to be a process during which the writer writes a lot more and/or significantly changes their game in response to beta feedback. That’s not always the case, nor is it always possible for many reasons, the least of which is pressure to any schedule.

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Well, assumption based on poll, discussion, and sales data, sure. It’s a reasonable conclusion for me. To go along with Hannah here, yes: I think we’ve released some very good “short” games that didn’t do as well as they deserved to.

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