Yeah, Jim is right. My grandmother has no idea that there’s a pandemic going on.
If his Alzheimer’s has advanced enough, doing a follow up with Eli so he understands the severity of the situation is pointless. He’ll forget.
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Alzheimers is a right bastard. It’s also very different from person to person. My wife lost her grandmother who had it. For her she was just forgetful. Saying the same thing over again, suggesting things we just did, or referencing something from years ago out of the blue. I also lost a grandfather who had it. He would become violently angry when he couldn’t find his wife, who had passed several years before. The only thing I can imagine worse than watching someone you love loosing themselves like that is being that person during those lucid moments and knowing what you’re loosing.
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Regarding the Alzheimers with Eli, Kevin specifically states that he was diagnosed with pre Alzheimers symptoms. Kevin tells us that Eli is forgetful and goes in and out of old memories. These are TOLD to us, but what have we actually SEEN of Eli’s symptoms.
I’ve read through some of chapter 8 to determine this. looking for the signs and trying to compare them to conclude what stage he is in. I’ve come across multiple points of interest that both show positive and negative signs of Alzheimers. I’ll mark potential symptoms with a * symbol.
We meet him out on his own and he drives with little issue. He brags about knowing every bump and turn in the road, *although hits a bump shortly after (however, we show no reaction to this, so possibly coincidence?). He’s aware enough to know his way around the area and gets back home.
He remembers Kevin’s name and proceeds to use the restroom on his own with no issue, even recites an old phrase.
*When attempting to grab rifle from Kevin he exercises poor gun safety handling, causing the rifle to fire off a round. (This isn’t exclusive to Alzheimers, but I will include it anyway). *After the rifle goes off, Eli calmly admonishes Kevin, without even yelling. He fondly remembers Kevin had long hair *and treats the previous issue like it wasn’t a big deal.
Eli talks business with no issue and appears to have no issue with math.
Eli caters to Nora’s needs showing potential romantic interest in her or at least capacity for charm.
During the presidential speech, Eli is scared and confused at what is being said. This is a completely normal reaction if youre unaware of current events.
*Eli forgets our name. Probably intended to be a sign of symptom, but we just met. Its normal to forget names.
I will include it regardless.
*forgets dad is dead
*forgets what day it is (again, this can be normal)
Confused and panics when informed of viral outbreak, again this is a normal reaction for someone unaware of current events.
*forgets sister is dead
This was where I stopped as it seemed to be most of the Eli content.
There are a lot of things listed above that someone with early signs of Alzheimers would have issues doing (driving, dealing money, interest in family). Most of the negative signs only really point towards some minor memory loss. The gun handling scene was the only time he showed poor judgment, but that could be due to a lack of common sense.
This simply isn’t convincing enough to lead me to believe he would open a gate with obvious hostiles on the other side. Someone with mild to severe Alzheimers, absolutely would! However, Eli barely even shows early signs of it.
Like I said in my previous post, I am nitpicking and its probably not a big deal, but if you want to make it more believable it shouldn’t be too hard to fix.
First, add some more clear signs beforehand (dementia, confusion, etc), have the watch notice the horde, the camp is alerted and scrambling to prepare, nobody notices Eli wander to the gate, he goes to open, the watch notices and yells at him to stop, Eli is confused and continues, somebody attempts to stop him, fails and the gates open. We get caught off guard and chaos ensues.
I think that would work pretty well. Just as long as Eli is shown having more severe symptoms beforehand, you can literally have him do whatever he wants afterwords.
Sorry for the long post, but it was fun going through analyzing it. Anyone have thoughts on this or anything to add?
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I think it could also be seen the other way around, the fact that it does not recognize the horde as hostile may be the first sign that Alzheimer’s is getting worse, which in my opinion is a worse scenario
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Now for something completely different!
I was trying to think up ideas and suggestions for the story. Frankly, I couldn’t think of much. Its already pretty solid. I did come up with 4 things though.
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Events throughout the story that occur due to how well your liked, but mostly hated in this case. For example, if you have a zombie on you and you’re with a companion that likes you, they will save you. However, if they don’t, they leave you to fend for yourself and you have to pass a stat check to survive. I was also thinking if enough people hate you, maybe they can vote to exile you? Kind of the opposite of when everyone votes for you to be leader if youre liked. Maybe they try to kill you at some point? Something along those lines.
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There was a part where you go with the teens and its mentioned that one or both can’t drive. I thought it would be a fun little extra activity to be able to teach them, if your driving skill is high enough.
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Regarding the mission with the teens at the junkyard, it also got me thinking about having a ‘teen only’ mission (or just make the junkyard teen only, no Kelly! Lol). It would be an exciting little extra bit exclusive for those who choose to be teenagers.
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This one is a little more complicated. I’m not sure where to implement this, but it does seem like something that can never really be avoided. We should add racial tensions at some point. Maybe there is an enclave of survivors that are really nice and well supplied and would make for an excellent ally. BUT, it also turns out they are all racist. So allying with them would cause issues in the future. And if Jaime is the leader, they are just hostile towards you.
Alternatively, we could just add a racist character that causes issues with others. I don’t know. Maybe something simpler. Something to consider, as this sort of drama and tension always makes things more interesting.
Thats all for now. Next post will be all the typos and bugs I found. I got loads already, but want to try to break a few more things before I post them all in a lump sum. Also need to clarify how to get to each of them so it will take some time.
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We already have something like this in game, the group members talk to you either with respect or distrust/contempt depending on your relationship with them or if they agree/disagree with your leadership style. It can even get bad enough to the point that they don’t do the tasks you assign them or listen to your orders.
Something to consider is that an infighting story-line with multiple characters plotting your death may take away from the main plot and may just cause us to lose useful people that can help us deal with the main threat/antagonist. Also, most of the characters in our group are still behaving like civilians who think other survivors are trust-worthy because they pretended to be nice, so mentally and morally they’re not in that headspace and it’s going to take a good amount of time and experience for them to change that mindset, which increases the likelihood that story-line could be put in late-game content which could interfere with every other story-line that’s been established at this point. Not to mention, most if not all the characters in our group are pretty complex so them killing us simply because they no longer like us in my opinion, sounds petty and somewhat underwhelming.
I can see Rachel trying to kill us or manipulating us if she thinks the MC isn’t a capable enough leader to make the hard choices to prioritize the groups survival and not every other survivors, or Jaime realizing that the MC truly does think being a warlord is what will keep the group and believes he needs to kill the MC,but those are in depth motives for the character that would make the drama interesting, without that I wouldn’t be on board with the idea.
That just sounds like an automatic game-over/bad ending that wouldn’t lead to any plot-points afterwards since the story is built on the premise that you need the group to survive the apocalypse. Also, what happens to players who have the nephew with them ? Are they going to be forced to leave him or take him with them ? Either way, that ultimately just sounds like your award for being the worst leader and here’s the ending you get as a result.
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Apologies I know this thread is meant for the beta testers but i gotta ask😅, what happens to characters going into part 3 that already have the fewest possible number of survivors with them?
My (over powered thanks to extra attribute points purchase + extras from completing the previous series) teenager MC is absolutely sociopathic/doesn’t trust or like other people and prefers to work alone but is kind of pigeon holed by the plot to join a group of survivors(which isn’t a bad thing! all my other MC’s like working with other people) I just kinda wish there would be a seperate storyline for characters wanting to explore this world alone as so far my MC has actively killed everyone they possibly could through a combination of picking the city start area to kill Gina & killing everyone else on purpose in hilltop battle and making decisions that get people killed(also why i never contact survnet or have a dog/nephew challenge - I wanna get that roster down flat 
)
- anywho, will there be more opportunities to cut survivors loose? will this bite my MC who absolutely hates people in the butt?
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Funny you mentioned this, I posted something similar yesterday. However, any chances of going solo are nil. This game, just like the previous one, focuses on group survival. To add solo content would change the game entirely and would require a separate story.
More then likely, there will be certain characters that have plot armor until the very end, for the sake of continuing the story. Pretty sure there won’t be an ending where you’re the lone survivor. But you could always suggest it. I’d wait for the part 4 beta though.
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Hahah that’s fair, I guess in the meantime I’ll just keep making reckless “mistakes” that get people killed till i’m down to the truly 100% plot armor crew - I guess I don’t mind having other characters but I do (sometimes) prefer a smaller cast.
On some of my other MC’s though I literally have as many people as you can possibly recruit in one go & I WILL kill(or recruit) anything that threatens my group
Bugs list!
-Found a possible bug when you visit the store with just Reilly. Shirley comes running with a horde chasing after her and I chose to stay inside. Shariff and Shirley both volunteer to go out and help Reilly, who’s outside defending. However, the only option thats selectable is Shirley.
-In the lab section I went to brain 1st and dealt with the crazed survivor. Afterwords, I went to pinky and after exploring it skipped the underground area. When I got back I told Rachel that I was imprisoned by some guy who just wanted to be friends. This never happened though.
-After the horde attack, i observe Baileys and tommys corpses. However, they were already dead at this point and should not have been here.
-On the tram to the museum, there is a line that says, ‘___ shields his face with his leather jacket’ no idea who the blank space is referring to but it doesn’t show the persons name.
-not really a bug but I though it was funny enough to add. When you’re at the museum and introduce yourself to Lena, she says her cousin has the same name. My name was ‘Test Subject Beta’! Guess she had a weird uncle/aunt lol.
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Thank you for pointing this out. It is now fixed and the story should continue through each chapter.
It definitely is likely I should do more to explain what is going on with Eli in the game. I have found with my father’s condition that some of my family deny he had Alzheimer’s as a safety mechanism. That’s what I was trying to do with Kevin but I agree, I need to make everything more apparent especially how things progress. I don’t disagree with what you have written, and it helps to see all the instances where his Alzheimer’s may come into play.
I’m not sure you are familiar with the show The Sopranos, but there is a character who goes through dementia later in the series that really put trays how quickly symptoms can change.
I definitely want to include things like this.
You actually can train them. I haven’t added the scene in Part 3, but you can train everyone in any skill in Part 2.
That is also coming in Part 4. The groundwork has been set right after the prom when you get some information from Eli about your parents.
I make some reference to race in chapter 12 but is this is a touchy subject. I’m not sure how to present racism in a way that would add to the story and provide meaningful impact without making it a racial sensitivity instruction game. Using your example of a racist group, would it be wrong to ally with them if it meant the survival of your group? In that way, I am bringing in a moral decision that could make it seem like I am promoting one way of thought over another. I tend to hate games with political messages, and I am sure I will take some flack for saying that.
That would definitely be a different game. As Giglamesh said, this game is about group survival. I tried to make Part 1 about solo survival at least in the first half. But I believe more people are interested in the story of group survival. It’s funny how I generally play solo games for my own enjoyment. Even when I play massively multiplayer games, I am one of the oddballs who never joins a Guild and solos.
Having said that, and this is a spoiler I am considering a chapter of Part 4 where you are stranded alone far from the Junkyard and must survive for a period of time by yourself.
Thank you very much for identifying and posting all of these bugs.
That’s pretty great 
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I wonder if it might be easier to implement some sort of classist tension, especially as the party gets into increasingly rural areas? “you’ve never worked a day in your life” vs “what would you bumpkins know”. Could work between different NPC’s, perhaps with a particular faction, or even directed towards the player (or available as a dialogue option) depending on career choice… Still adds some “not everyone gets along” (and potential resulting consequences?) while staying in milder political waters?
Woo! runs off to binge
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Are the events right at the end of Ch.9 predetermined? (When the gates are left open. Population control, +3, -3?)
Also not sure if anyone pointed it out already, but I recognized Sean as a former neighbor, but then he came up and introduced himself to me anyway, farther down the same page.
Oh, also, continuity issue, I think there’s some branches that are tangled up in the Museum fight on the ground floor - if I successfully take the shot at Cruz, he’s still mentioned later in the scene. (“I’ll kill every one of you” etc.). Also, Gilbert fires at Bailey, she returns fire and hits him and he drops his gun, Brick runs up and axes him. But then Brick rushes from cover again and charges Gilbert, but Gilbert runs over and shoots Bailey.
If I take the shot at Gilbert instead, I eventually shoot a light and knock Cruz to the floor, but then there’s a part where he vaults over the railing, drops 30 feet, and then lands behind the display case.
If I have my group stay out of things, the resulting text also seems to have some duplicates - Thelma asks about Paul and Darlene, Paul steps out, says Darlene fought like a warrior til the end. Then, a little later, after Mel tells them where the fuel is, and Jude makes his entrance, Thelma asks about Darlene again and Paul says she died “to” (should be from…) her wounds a few minutes ago.
I could tell you more for sure if I was looking at the code, but I only know how to do that on Steam versions. :-/
One larger piece of feedback, I know it’s still WIP but I think the final chapter of part 3 needs some more denouement (or a big cliffhanger, but I lean towards the former) so people aren’t upset about an abrupt stop in the story. Some more futzing around in camp perhaps and then a little reflection by the MC over the latest events?
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Pretty much, yes. A couple more characters can die if you’re not prepared, and I think Jim’s going to be making Gina savable.
Add scenes to the end of the game url to get to the scene list…
I don’t think this is the end of Part 3; I know there’s at least one other chapter on the way, and possibly two.
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nice. I figured it was something along those lines but hadn’t gotten to googling it yet.
Oh, duh. Good point. I was tricked by the “you’ve reached the end of part 3” message and forgot that more chapters could still be coming down the pipe.
Thanks 
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I think for me it’s just that some characters like Jamie really grate on my nerves. To me he’s like that annoying neighbour like Ned Flanders that you’ve only known a long time because of circumstance, not any particular affection.
Which means I’d get rid of him as soon as I can. Alas, don’t have the opportunity
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Why did he grate on your nerves? I think character-wise he is decently well made when comparing to others
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Well if you’re trying to play a warlord/bandit play-through or prioritizing the groups well being over strangers, Jaime is the biggest headache and objector to most decisions you make. Which is an understandable response to the behavior of the warlord MC, but when my pragmatic survivor talks about how he wants to prioritize the group’s well being over random strangers and makes decisions that reflect and reinforce that outlook, he says “that’s not the decision I would make if I were the leader”. Even though he’s the one that nominated me as the group’s leader, but now that I’m not sharing the same moral values as him, or leading the group in a way he would like he makes passive aggressive comments about my leadership decisions. So yes, Jaime can be your best friend and you can get along with him marvelously if you share the same outlooks on survival & morality, but if not he can becomes a pain in the ass real quick. Honestly, I’d rather deal with Rachel just being honest about not liking my decisions, and possibly attempting to stage a coup in the future, than Jaime’s passive aggressive jabs and occasional interference.
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This is quite far-fetched, but i think the reason he acted the way he did is because of guilt and trauma from his time in the raider group in part 1. If i remember right, the leader of the group (Dillian) Was a pragmatic survivor as well, he did some questionable things like robbing from people and dead ghoul. Eventually his moral value went way down, like attempting to rape a woman student and chasing down Jaime, taunting him in a sadistic way. Not only Jaime failed to convince the leader to change his way, it was the opposite, so in a way he is supporting the leader from what he did for the first two days. And Dillian ain’t a stranger, either. He and Jaime worked together in a mental hospital and likely have the same relationship as Jaime with MC, if not slightly worse or better. Dunno about you, but getting chased down like a dog by your former co-worker or friend is quite hard to deal with emotionally. So from part 2 onward, he tried to steer you in the “correct” way by hindering a pragmatic MC in fear of them becoming a new Dillian. Hell, during the party in chapter 10, if your MC ain’t a leader, Jaime will actually asked if you are okay and whether you need any emotion or mental help or not. Likely to keep the MC sanity in check and don’t go insane.
However, i do agree with the fact that he have a bit too much plot armour.
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