Vendetta: Rise of a Gangster -- Reinvented

gender-choice
adult-fiction
historical-fiction

#326

The old demo is linked in the first post as well …


#327

It’s fair to say it was almost universally despised as only a handful of people “got the gist” and were able to generally keep moving in the right direction (if you get too lost / just wander blind, pursuing hitmen invariably catch up to you, and it’s Game Over)! It’s not something particularly suited to a Choice Game system, to be fair – it’s more just a nod to the roots of the whole CYOA hobby – and it’s not something found anywhere else in the game. In addition to having other options available to completely avoid the maze, I’ve since also allowed more time to find a way out by blind luck, and now give also more hints along the way based on your Streetwise and / or Awareness attributes.

Close – one of the pursuing hitmen heads around the block by car to cut off your escape, so you still have to deal with him even if you find your way through the alleyways before the others catch up to you!

Somewhat, yes (the Veteran Nurse backstory is also more detailed), although his memory is no clearer! Your particular questions do now get answered during his unique (‘Primary’) storyline, however, which initially involves him meeting up with an old ex-army buddy…

Edit: Neglected to reply to this bit – one useful old feedback suggested making more use of that newspaper you read in the barbershop. It does now serve as more of a mid-Chapter ‘Reflections’ piece, rather than just mentioning the death of ‘Spider’ McGeeghan or Furio Rossi (depending on that crucial earlier decision), since not everyone would necessarily see that entire story branch to its conclusion.

Don’t let Dino ever hear you call him that! Having a burglar on the crew is useful for certain jobs (Raimondo fills that role – you don’t meet him 'til Chapter Two though) but Dino considers himself, and his crew, to be considerably more than just petty thieves.

Well reasoned. I’m not sure many have worked out the most profitable combination – assuming you’re willing to “betray your roots”, so to speak. :wink:

Everything except The Dreaded Maze chat, at least. That was something at the beginning of Chapter Three, so has only ever been seen by the original playtesters, quite some time ago now.


#328

Which reminds me, I wanted to ask will he be a potential romance option for female mc’s now?
As I remember two of my (offline) female friends who played your demo for some reason taking an instant shine to the boy from his brief appearance way back when.

Just wait until my college boy mc hopefully takes that crew into diamond heists and art theft, then burglary will come in real handy. :wink:


#329

Furio is one of the two existing characters (the other being Nick Morello) who is now a RO for a female MC, chosen partly because he’s a handsome, charming, very masculine guy (quite Sonny Corleone in many ways) and partly because he doesn’t figure much in the male MC route until part way through Chapter Three – assuming he even survives that crucial Irish / Italian decision which the player sometimes has to make in Chapter One. He is, however, something of a male-chauvinist typical of the era, so the relationship won’t always survive much past the early stages, although it is possible for him to eventually accept our female protagonist as an equal. If not, well, there are always more fish in the sea. :wink:

whistles innocently


#330

What art heists actually happened during this time period?

I am inundated by the 1930’s and 40’s tragedies all around Europe of art being stolen and such but I rarely come up with heists from the 1920s…


#331

I believe that was when someone stole the Mona Lisa.


#332

Just to say All women doesn’t want very masculine men… Whatever that meant back then. I for instance dont, So my recommendation is when describing don’t suppose what people consider attractive. It is something many cog have. They made a detailed description of how npc looks then immediately jump saying how hot i find them… When my impression on their description is Kill it with fire wtf he is ugly as hell!!!

I know for your previous demo that you don’t usually do that but just a reminder. :wink:


#333

He’s clearly not the guy for you, so on the plus side you know now to avoid him like the plague. :wink:

I tend not to make assumptions, I just like variety. In the same way as all of the female NPCs / ROs are very different people, so are the male characters. Nick Morello and Furio Rossi are very much chalk and cheese, for example.

Perhaps the more modern term of “very macho” would be clearer?


#334

No, the term is clear. But nowadays in Spain there is the stuff of using the very masculine as a gay term for very muscular guys. So I assumed you didn’t mean that. Yeah, I hardly doubt due the setting of your game i would find a guy attractive. Maybe some other business guy or a con artist guy. I like exactly the other end of spectrum in guys lol.


#335

I see what you mean. I suppose it does have a lot to do with physical appearance / build (regardless of sexual orientation) but in terms of Vendetta characters at least, it’s just as much to do with attitude and bearing, i.e. the way they conduct themselves, generally speaking. Furio tends to be the in-your-face type, overtly masculine and strutting, whereas Nick Morello is more laid-back, gentler, quietly confident – but probably just as physically capable and tough when the need arises. He just doesn’t feel the need to demonstrate his masculinity quite so much, if you see what I mean! :smiley:


#336

I like suave, shy stylish educated pale guys. :wink: As I said hardly doubt I find a guy attractive in the setting except (Somehow you manage to make a Renaissance statue romanceable ) So maybe Mara in Vendetta will be bi.


#337

Far be it for me to discourage you from trying all the… options, still, you’ll be delighted to know there is someone who may be quite considerably closer to your ideal (although, to be fair, he does have one or two little… idiosyncrasies which you may find annoying! Such is life). There is however roughly only a 50/50 chance that you would meet this guy on a particular play-through, but that applies to a fair number of the ROs for either gender.


#338

There have always been custom commissions to steal art if you know the right people, often the original owners were embarrassed or status-obsessed enough to not report it and commission a forgery themselves.
Diamonds, luxury goods and bank safety deposit heists are also always available, assuming we can pull them off. I suppose a type of heist unique to this time period would be liberating high end, high quality alcohol from the ultra-rich who amply stocked their wine cellars before prohibition went into effect.

In general though my college boy probably likes planning and executing complex heists more then any other crime he can commit.

Indeed as noted in the pretty boy trope on TVtropes “pretty boys” aren’t weaker then there more grizzled, hunky counterparts it’s more of a question of built. body type and aesthetic.
For my Vendetta mc’s I think my college boy would lean pretty heavily into pretty boy territory with my union organizer being the more grizzled hunk with a perpetual 5 o clock shadow and my political bagman occupying a middle ground.
The only real effect of that would be that Campanini can probably spot the resemblance between my college boy mc and his late sister a bit more easily (though even college boy isn’t exactly androgynous mind you) while with my union organizer it would indeed come down to just the similar eyes.


#339

Something I wanted to ask, for the female play through, how will you be implementing the lesbian relationships (I think I read somewhere in the feed that there will be lesbian relationships, apologies if I’m misinformed)? Will you be including the discrimination of the time, or handwaving it in some way?

I ask because I was recently playing a wip where gay marriage was a thing in the 1800s without even a hand wave, so I’m curious?


#340

I absolutely love the idea of an MC-Morello romance already. Just the angst and tension alone from them being on completely opposite sides of the law while being childhood friends and lovers.

Psychopathic booze lord that would rather take the option of just shooting her way up the world versus the honest, diligent and hard-boiled detective. It’s a match made in Hell.


#341

It’s interesting you should mention this “mind’s eye” difference for your various MCs as I’ve recently been reading through the character generation discussions, with some apparently leaning heavily towards preferring to choose every facet of their MC – perhaps because it helps them build up a mental picture?

In Vendetta I have of course always kept it to a very vague tall and handsome description for the MC and simply let the player fill in the blanks as they see fit (no pun intended!). For the most part it has always seemed acceptable to leave it at that – you certainly have no problem imagining distinct differences for your own MCs, for example – but I admit, this topic as a whole does make me wonder. The current, rather vague approach just feels right to me, but perhaps I’m in the minority here? Is it maybe even worth a poll?

I deliberately set Vendetta in an entirely fictional city (with some obvious similarities to parts of New York, Chicago and Atlantic City) so I could be free to do what I wanted with such as the layout, local history, population diversity and distribution, and leading characters – you’ll see better what I mean with the new Word on the Street section (see Dev Blog #5), which expands on all of this in quite some detail.

What Vendetta was never intended to be, however, is an ‘alternate world’. Grim Harbor City is just an amalgam of the real cities mentioned above, but still very firmly set in our own past and the America of the early 1920s as it was, which means discrimination of all types is fairly pervasive throughout. The gay and lesbian communities were largely underground (figuratively speaking) so that is how they are represented in the story, with the MC’s relationships being for the most part hidden and clandestine. ‘Gay marriages’ as such are therefore determined by the only really important thing in those times, which is a bonding of heart and soul, not something determined by a piece of paper.

Throw into the mix that Nick Morello also clearly had more than just a passing crush on big sis Gina, and suddenly his real motives also become highly suspect!

It’s fair to say it’s unlikely to all be smooth sailing… :wink:


#342

@Vendetta, a very, very, very dumb question here, just checking if our MC can romance that girl of the guy who owns the fish shop (was it? May have to reread the scene again) if we save it after the bombing at the beginning of Ch. 2?


#343

I usually prefer to define the MC’s appearance, but vagueness seems to work for me here, although I’ll have a better idea once the female backgrounds are out. As for the poll, it’s relatively easy to set up and you’re not obligated to listen to the majority, so it couldn’t hurt.

Could we get a list and brief description of the ROs for a female MC ? (Or at least those that don’t spoil major plot points.)


#344
Feedback

Feedback: I would stick with the current approach of writing the rather vague descriptions. This is an efficient use of your writing and coding time and effort.

I would also add a stretch goal of more in-depth descriptions to be completed as either DLC (Author’s cannon) or completed if you meet most every other developmental goal.

The reason, I would approach it this way is because to do detailed descriptions justice (in other words: the way that RPG nerds will worship you or @poison_mara would want your babies) you will have to do a lot more writing and variable coding.

There are many different factors:

  • Some people that have prosopagnosia - face blindness (something I did not consider consciously until a month ago myself) and while they can describe what they are looking, features and descriptions do not otherwise gel for them.

  • Other people find immersion better if they can relate to their character - hair color, eye color and everything else skin deep is something we all differ in our association with familiarity and comfort. (Don’t look at my fair skin Irish/Scottish Italian Mobsters) … :rofl: This can be a reason some wish to be a part of the Irish mob :wink:

  • Then there are @poison_mara’s people … they love the gritty details and if you do not provide a beach-load of details in numbers equaling the grains of sand on a beach, they feel like they are being railroaded and not being given a sandbox to play in (:two_hearts: Mara)

Just remember the axiom: You can never please everyone … you only chose who you piss off … :lollipop:


#345

Either way works for me and the current vague description is enough for me to unleash my mind’s eye as my mc’s all fit within the vague tall and handsome category albeit in very different ways.
The only scene I can currently think of those differences between my different mc’s having any real bearing would be our first meeting with Campanini. My college boy would probably instantly stand out as his late sister’s brother to anyone who had regular contact with her while with my Union organizer it would indeed come down to the similar eyes. I don’t think that with such a big project that is not primarily a romance game going out of your way to introduce that sort of complex character customization code is going to be worth it.
My “mind’s eye” will cast an appropriate actor, model or composite character for all the cute guy roles including the mc anyway. :wink:

@Eiwynn says it more succinctly but this is what I was trying to get at with my Campanini example. It would be a lot of work to do such a system properly and Vendetta is already big and feature packed enough that it might not be worth the time and effort. Though if it does prove successful enough I wouldn’t be opposed to buying a DLC that would let me establish my mc’s as the kind of guys they really look like with appropriate npc reactions, but it would be a lot of work and if you can’t afford to or aren’t comfortable with putting in that amount of work in it then just leave the male as vaguely tall, dark and handsome and I will fill in the details for my various mc’s on my own.

Interesting you should say that as I imagine my college boy mc to be at that dark blond/ish brown/ish border with relatively fair skin. as one possible inspiration for my college boy is a young Ricky Martin around 1994/95