The War for the West [Releasing Nov 14]

Against the rules to ask when it’s going to be released.

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Sorry. I’m new here

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Right there on the front page, pinned to the top:

Welcome to the COG Forums

Inside that thread: Forum Rules

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Hmm, am I the only one who never sees character images pop up even with the option turned on? So far the only img I’ve seen is Lord Ullus but never the others, not sure if I’ve seen the code for other images either.

That, and I can never manage to get to the convo where the MC runs away with Wyneva - and I wonder if this has anything to do with it

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This is an old idea I never got around to implementing. I think I’ll probably just remove it and keep the portraits on the stats menu.

Damn, you are right. I made the player jump to the singing itself by mistake, instead of passing through the whole convincing stuff. Which means it also skips that segment and one of my favorite lines on the game. :sweat_smile:

Coincidentally, I’m doing some small changes on the RO interactions right now. I’ll upload the fix with them as soon I am done.

EDIT: Actually, since it is just a matter of changing a line in this case, I downloaded the txt from the host, edited and re-uploaded it. That part should be working correctly now.

Thanks for the report!

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@MahatmaDagon 1- marriage options for females MC : I totally believe you can do it! :wink: Not only for Boglan but for the norther prince as well . It seems indeed that there are a lot of Lord Lodka , and after all if a male MC can marry one of his sisters , why a female MC can’t hope for a union with this Prince as well ? :wink:
2- heirs: you can certainly add more ways to get other heirs in your sequel if you think that now it will takes more of your time. But then again, even at this stage you can consider to introduce the option of twins or something like that, it will indeed increase the number of your heirs without disrupt your timeline .

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Follow up, bugs!

tfu net-resizeimage

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@MahatmaDagon In event 42 where the MC decides on budgeting meals, I suggest that the first choice #Simple and efficient meals, with enough nourishment to sustain one's body through any hardships. could mention the same food as the army. I’m not sure where the diet choices have an effect but I’m assuming eating peasant food lowers unrest and perhaps eating army rations could improve morale.

In twoway.txt, I suspect there is an error in the following IF statement:

*if (Combat > 70)
 *goto losingFight

*else 
 *goto losingFight
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I saved the game during the scene of the first Sielcner war conversation but when I opened it from the load file it took me to the stats page and would not let me return to game. Although it is completely possible that I accidentally saved on the settings screen I just basically want to make sure it was a mistake on my part and not a game glitch. Thank! Love the game so far!!

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@TeamCorvid Thanks, it seems I added an extra blank before going away for the holidays. :sleepy: Should be fixed now.

@Norilinde Dunno, I don’t think the MC would necessarily be eating army rations.

What I want to suggest is that the diet provided would be something that could be considered good for exercises and military routines, as according to the cultural limitations of that world.

They probably don’t know what proteins are, but there can be some theory on what type of food is good to make someone stronger. Some/most of it can be bullshit as well, as it often is when regarding to medieval theories for health.

Effects of a particular diet are sometimes surprising, although there is a reason given for each of them when the prompt comes a month later.

About the twoway.txt skillcheck, it was mostly me cutting corners to hurry things up. I might come back to that later, but I think there are other ways to win that.

@jfor894 Sorry about that. The saving plugin is outsourced and used for testing purposes only, so I can’t really do much about it. Once the game is released there will likely be a different one provided by CoG, AFAIK.

The strange thing is that this might not be the first report of something weird going on in that specific scene.

I once got a report that, when you are deciding what to do against Sielcner, you could only select a few of the choices and then the game would move on its on, without you selecting “Finish the preparations.” first.

Did you or anyone else get that bug as well?

Players should be able to select as many as possible (given a few conditionals that decide what options can appear) from below, and only proceed forward after selecting the last one:

#Ask for advice.
#Collect extra taxes for the war efforts.
#Recruit civilians for the army.
#Send scouts to assess the strength and position of Sielcner’s army.
#Send men to help defend King’s End.
#Demand that Lord Goyler sends his militia from King’s End to defend your castle.
#Assassinate Lord Noyedas Sielcner.
#Call out your allies for help.
#Finish the preparations.

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I had this when calling your allies for help, I just make sure to choose that one last.

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@MahatmaDagon If the MC is allowed to choose eating peasant food, I don’t see why eating army food would be worse (although I suppose that depends on the condition of the peasants) and could be good for building morale of the army.

The fight is still winnable after *goto losingFight but the code seemed redundant there so I wasn’t sure if it was on purpose.

It proceeds forward for me as well when #Call out your allies for help. is picked.

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Thanks guys. It was revealed to be another strike by my arch-nemesis, extra blank space.

Should be fixed now.

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@MahatmaDagon Sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner, but I played this a lot since you said it was fixed, and haven’t had the same issue again. Now that I’ve had a chance to see more developments, here is some content-based feedback.

The letter from the king would feel more genuine if it in some way referenced how your family acted during the rebellion. This should be pretty easy since that choice is made prior to the story starting.

I married Dana when given the option, and had also set up a trade deal with Sess…something Drown. Later, her “sister” appears claiming she needs protection from both the Dullacs and Drown. Naturally, I turned her over to her sister since those are the two factions I have the closest relationship to. Felt odd that it wasn’t referenced.

Is there really no one else writing a letter or inviting me to a feast to meet their daughter? No complaints about Dana or anything, but one of the responses is “I am promised to another,” and another is something like too many to choose from despite there having been no one else mentioned by an advisor or any other contact on the matter. This felt unrealistic.

When the meteor fell near the border, I didn’t know in whose territory it was, despite my scouts getting to it and being sending a message to aid them. I chose yes, and only THEN was told it was actually in the territory of the other nation. If I’d known that, I wouldn’t have said yes. I felt deceived here, like I was misled into thinking I was going into a skirmish in neutral territory.

Maybe something can appear at the top of the screen letting me know how long projects (recruiting, building stuff) will take to complete.

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Maybe the option “I am promised to another” is there because, during some play throughs if you keep on holding court, you may meet the northern prince and make a marriage deal with them. Maybe that’s the idea of putting that option in the conversation with Dullac.

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Yep. Even if the MC goes to Dullis before Lodka visits, he could still use this as an excuse not to be bound to House Dullac.

But then that raises the issue of veritability, and since Dulsen obviously makes use of spies, a fact check from Dulsen’s part if the MC lies that he’s already engaged should be feasible. Means more code though, what do you think @MahatmaDagon ?

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@MahatmaDagon
I’ve had the chance to play all the way through now…and I’m really unhappy with the turn it takes at the council. It felt very shark-jumpy. Here I had this fairly dry, yet interesting leadership sim with mainly interesting plot elements, but then it throws THREE major twists at the same time.

The Wizard is a huge revelation I didn’t really want. Then you have an embarrassingly weak “talk” about who will become King, and then some NPC you’ve never had any meaningful interaction with turns out to be some evil mastermind, Nellasha turns out to be in his custody (even though she was returned to Sessohana (big continuity error there), and your spymaster, who had made ZERO effort to warm you up to something like this, is now desperately trying to get you to surrender. It’s so much, and almost all of it completely inconsistent with the tone and previous observations.

I get that I am asking you to re-evaluate a major focus of your story, but please consider these complaints.

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The rebellion was around 80 years ago, and this is a young king who, as some playthroughs might suggest, is being actively sabotaged by the people around him.

I mean, I’m normally up for referencing past events regarding the player’s House background, and I do that on some opportunities, but I don’t really see why this should be done here other than some remark like “Stand by our side as you did/didn’t 80 years ago”, but it feel a bit gratuitous.

The only people who (rightfully) hold a grudge about those old events are the ones who were on the losing side of it. House Meinstrel won and has been on a very comfortable position since recently, and their current predicament has nothing to do with that. The fact that your House might have fought against them so long ago is actually something to be expected, given that they were your enemies.

Might be a consequence of the non-linearity of events in the game. I think I scripted it considering that the player would never visit Boglan before the event to meet Nellasha happened, but I think that isn’t the case anymore. (It certainly was at some point)

No. I think there are enough RO for male MCs in the game, and there isn’t really any other noteworthy female character available for marriage in the Western Peninsula at the time(considering only the Great Houses). You might argue that this is unrealistic, but all important characters are accounted for, and there are always some compromises that must be made for the game to happen.

As someone already mentioned, there are is a Hold Court event where a northern Prince offers you one of his three sisters in marriage. Other than that, I think the same point I made above applies here. Realistic is not always an achievable thing, although it is certainly an objective to aim for.

I had a look at the files, because I didn’t remember exactly what was said, and this is what your scouts report:

"Sielcner’s troops were there. Their captain insisted that those lands were within Sielccia’s borders, and that your men had no right to be there. "

But just because the Sielccian captain said the lands were within Sielccia’s border, this doesn’t mean that they actually are. There are three major points which I think I can argue regarding this:

1 - I often let NPCs present contradicting points of view regarding events and let the player make their own conclusions. Most of the dialogue in the game is tainted by a character’s own biases, and sometimes people can be outright lying, like when Dulsen’s spy possibly tells you that Sessanah was scheming against you in order to make the rebels attack you on your way to Boglan.

2 - Medieval borders were always a source of conflict between nations because maps were not that trustworthy or precisely exact. In fact, this is fuel for another situation in the game as well. (If you have a Wrathful father and meet Dulsen’s cousin)

3 - This also serves a balancing purpose. It would be too easy to say “it fell on your territory, it’s your right to claim it.”, and I don’t like straightforward outcomes where one decision is obviously the good one. I try to avoid it when I can. So, by making the player consider if it is worth it to pursue this, I feel like I am adding a reasonable impediment that will, at least, make people consider before making a decision.

In the end, there is no canonically right answer as to if the meteor fell inside your borders or in Sielccia. It fell inside the Thornwood, and there is no clear geographical mark that defines to whom that particular area belongs to.

There is yet another point, one that is not so obvious: Perhaps you indeed were purposefully deceived and misled to pursue the meteor. After all, there is at least one member of your court with a hidden agenda that involves making you the “Hero of Prophecy” and the ruler of the Western Peninsula. Acquiring the meteor proves to be quite important to reach that goal.

Now, I do think that the game should be self-sufficient and that me giving meta explanations outside of it is not necessarily an optimal outcome. But it is hard to perceive what kind the information a player will be able to learn because there are so many different ways to play it.

I spread what I perceive to be necessary information all across it, but sometimes those answers are hidden behind stats check, specific branches or merely hinted in subtext.

Detailed feedback(such as you are providing) is the only way for me to get a sense of what players are experiencing, and I do want people to have a good or satisfying experience regardless of the how they play, but I need a wide research pool in order to perceive points that might be recurrent problems. It’s okay not to get every answer in a single playthrough, but at least some of the major ones should be there.

Since there are limitations to ChoiceScript on what I can do on my end, the only way I can see of doing it would be on the stats screen, but I don’t know if it would be really worth the effort. Most of the time, you are given an estimative and the numbers are not exact (because I don’t like the idea of the player having the exact numbers all the time, I think this can break immersion and add too much predictability).

I could add a specific reaction from Lord Dulsen if he notices that the player is lying here, but I would probably put this behind a high Social check, since the man isn’t going to let you know he has spies on you just to confront you on this. He’s trying to be friendly and hide his true powerlevel on the feast.

Sorry you felt this way. I do think there are hints of at least some of what is going to happen spread across the game, but this comes down to that previous point of different possible experiences. If more people feel the way you do, it will give me more of a sense that this is a recurrent problem in playthroughs.

About the Wizard, this is a much-needed interaction to explain some of the mysteries that would, otherwise, remain unexplained. It serves the purpose of both explain the relationship between the Temple, the Abyssal Spawns and the people from Dagoria.

I was originally going to hide this particular interaction and only allow it to be done by characters with high Knowledge, but I felt that people might not be aware of its existence and think that I just left too many plots points unexplained. If more people feel that way about that interaction.

I can both lock the option behind a stat check as I originally intended and I can revise it to make it stronger, but I would need more feedback on what exactly you(and others) perceive as bad about it.

I do give the option for the player not to go to that event, though. So there’s that, at least.

Now, about you saying that there is a “embarrassingly weak ‘talk’ about who will become King”, I’d ask you this:

Do you think this is constructive criticism?

I have no problem being criticized (it helps me improve, and its often better than just receiving vague praise), and I do appreciate when people point specific things they don’t like, but how the hell could I make it better if you don’t tell me exactly what you think is weak, or how can it be improved, or what you felt was bad about it?

Now, about the “evil mastermind”, there are some branches in which you do have at least one interaction with him beforehand, and he is directly mentioned both in spy reports and in dialogue with some RO. He is also indirectly mentioned in some other situations, and the organization to which he belongs is also mentioned both directly and indirectly throughout the game, and are hinted to be the active forces behind many of the events that happen in the game. Funding Noyedas’ rebellion, assisting the peasants in their possible uprising against you, employing Nada, scheming against the King, trying to assassinate you, killing the Mulligan brothers, etc.

Regarding Nellasha “being in his custody”, it’s not necessarily that. The game mentions at some opportunities that Sartham is the most important political figure in Boglan and that he is the one keeping it all together. I don’t think it would be too far-fetched to think that he has somehow arranged for Nellasha to be released, since he is clearly a part of the conspiracy. So, it’s not necessarily a continuity error.

The same can be said about Jenneth. She made ZERO effort to warm you up to something like this because she was also part of the conspiracy. The fact that she insists on you surrendering can either be explained because she has feelings for you or because she pragmatically doesn’t want to rely on someone else to fulfill the “prophecy”. Yes, they could try to use your cousin and they could try to use your heir or a bastard in your place, but there are reasons given as to why that wouldn’t be the best outcome.

I would also like to read some more as to why you feel that this is most completely inconsistent with the tone and previous observations. If you clarify your complaint, I might be able to improve something.

I get that I am asking you to re-evaluate a major focus of your post, but please consider these complaints. :grin:

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My main problem was the ending scene. It is quiet difficult to infiltrate a city with your weapons and armour. Also from all I read about the Horned Host, and their Knights, they sounded like a very well trained knightly order, if not being the best in the realm. Even if there was say 10 to 20 of the Knights left, its highly likely to say most of them would be guarding the Tower.

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I think it’s not about the quantity of female ROs right now, it’s the interaction which @MahatmaDagon is currently working on