The Myrmidon (WIP) (Minor update 03/10/2017)

These are all good questions and points, so allow me to clarify.

First:

‘Magic’ in this instance is a misleading term. It is merely the application of knowledge to ancient technological devices. For example in the beginning of the Noble path, Arinthas puts down a dainty little Fabergé egg that somehow contains an angry King Toise (who’s name is Chauncey if anyone was wondering…).

Obviously a turtle the size of a blue whale can’t be wiggled into a space that small, so something unusual must be at work here. In fact the little egg is a portable pocket-universe originally used for some bizarre purpose by the Pre-Fall humans. Perhaps it was a research tool, or possibly a sort of high-energy battery, or maybe some old lady just used it to store old newspapers and little porcelain figurines. We can’t possibly know. All we (Arinthas) knows is that anything stored in this pocket universe is kept in a perfect stasis, unaffected by the passage of time or the ravages of space. The egg can store things much larger than itself for an unlimited time and release them on command by tearing an aperture in our universe and allowing the contents of it’s own universe spill out.

Arinthas decided to use it as the world’s most unpredictable grenade.

So however flimsy, there is a semi-scientific explanation of how everything works. When Arinthas slows the passage of time, or causes fires, or seems to telepathically communicate with Myrmidons, there is a technological explanation for it. Magic by definition defies explanation, it does not require it. The world-building of this world demands that all things have a root cause that is more complex than ‘because he’s magic’.

As a Myrmidon you aren’t ‘using’ magic, you are magic. You can lift boulders over your head, take the form of anything you see, divine the causes and rhythms of the stars.

No, you more or less hit the nail on the head there. You get 10 points.

Imagined, no. Misinterpreted? Perhaps a tad. Arinthas has a positive surfeit of tattoos, detailing equations and blueprints for long-forgotten arcane processes, but they do not glow. There is fire, certainly, but there is also a cause. Arinthas can command a localized cluster of semi-sentient nano-machines that persist in the air as a fine mist around him. When he wishes, he can command them to raise their ambient temperature and enter a ‘vortex’ formation that creates a whirling blast of ignited air.

The effect might bear a great many similarities to a fireball.

That is one of the key points of Technomancy in this story, the notion that technology can look quite alien and unfathomable when you have no frame of reference.

Interestingly Homunculus was one of the original working titles for this piece, it was only narrowly beaten by Myrmidon because the Myrmidons in the Iliad were known for their unflinching penchant for following orders, no matter how brutal or heinous. It became a popular slang word in the 19th Century for people who did what they were told without question, and might well have become the word we associated with machines that serve were it not for Capek’s famous play Rossum’s Universal Robots (In Czech, robota means ‘forced labour’).

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So, the thing I promised you last night (a collection of all my teaser scenes) is late.

I know…

However, it being late means that I’ve felt compelled to add a little commentary to each scene, to add context to an otherwise slice-of-life stream of consciousness.

I’ll add it to the top post when a mod opens it up for me, and I will send that message out as soon as I’ve put this up, but here it is:

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It would seem that way…
I gato admit, I’m simply relieved it’s pussycats that I chaton about when unconscious.

I’m much too lazy to look this up, but isn’t there a quote that I’m about to butcher that basically goes ‘sufficiently advanced technology can seem like magic’ or something? I wanna say it’s Arthur C. Clarke, but I wouldn’t exactly place any money on that… But, yeah. Just seems fitting.

Preciouses~

I mean, uh… I enjoyed reading these again! That you threw 'em all in one place for easy access is much appreciated, thank you. I don’t think the lateness is exactly an issue, please don’t worry about it, but the commentary was a pleasant surprise - I love those sorts of blurbs.

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You are quite correct (after a fashion). The quote you are remembering is Clarke’s Third Law:

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

A quote I keep in mind at all times when writing, as so many of my projects involve simplistic pre-industrial peoples grappling with the technology of the Ancients.

I may be somewhat stuck in my ways…

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Are you by any chance familiar with the roleplaying game Numenera? The setting has many similarities to your own. It is set in a distant future after the rise and fall of a series of highly advanced civilizations. Teraforming, genetic engineering and other advanced technologies has left the Earth as what resembles a medieval high fantasy setting. There are “mages” that can manipulate nanobots in the air to create fireballs and other such miracles, and the game is based around the search for ancient technological devices with great power.

There are of course many differences in the tone and settings, but I tend to like settings take a scientific approach to magic and I found the parallels interesting.

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This has sparked a question within me that has most likely been answered and subsequently asked beforehand and I’ve either forgotten that or missed it altogether, will this stop me from asking? Of course not!

How do most people perceive the autonomy within machinery? Do they think of them as just “thinking machines” or at this point do they simply think of them as “people”? Do they believe their existence to be the result of mystical intervention? Or do they think the machines to be the result of their own efforts? In that way, do they look down upon them? Or up to them? Or just levelly and with no real glorification or damnation?

Edit: I have also realized that whenever I say “a question” I mean “a truckload of questions to bury you under” and I apologize for that.

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Velvety purple eyes and a teaser scene compilation are truly an embarrassment of riches. Now, shall I indulge in the cornucopia of commenting I so greatly desire?

On one trembling hand: Rampant hedonism.

On the other: Effort takes effort.

No, I refuse to threaten any of you gentlefolk with a ramble. Suffice it to say:

Yes, please.

Jack Davenport, in years past. A goosey laugh being integral.

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I genuinely was not, but a cursory glance shows me a world that sounds desperately interesting, thanks for the pick.

I think my main inspiration was The City and the Stars, a book that I’ve extolled the virtues of at least once or twice on this thread already, so I won’t repeat myself. All I will say is that if you’re interested in post-technological societies that have forgotten the how and why of their world, it’s pretty much the towering grand-daddy of them all.

I don’t think I could stop you even if I wanted to, I’m ready!

I would say that firstly on a very basic level the humans of the Rings have no idea how responsible they are for their world.

The Ring that they live on is such a monumental undertaking that they literally cannot imagine the process by which a human can organise its design and construction. Same goes for the Nomad, the Rings themselves, the Myrmidons, everything.

I mean, take a moment to imagine the Three Rings themselves.

They are two miles high. That’s four Burj Khalifas stacked on top of each other. Try to contemplate the enormity of that structure, the engineering principles that allow it to function, the materials necessary for its construction. No normal idiot would assume that his species had any part in it’s construction.

So mystical intervention is pretty much the only way the human mind can categorize a world like this.

Apologise for nothing, you’ve seen how seriously I take making up stuff and passing it off as real.

You’ve seen The Chain, you know how deep the rabbit hole goes…

More hedonism, more puns, more understated British talent in the casting. Your wish is my command.

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That’s a very dangerous mind you have there, you ought to watch out for that…[/quote]

That’s a very sharp wit you have, you ought to be careful you don’t accidentally cut yourself… :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

[quote][quote=“P_Tigras, post:978, topic:15992”]
When you talk like that you make them sound so vulnerable. Someone needs to…educate them, yep, that’s it, because education adds value… For the good of the nation, we will endeavor to add value to the “currency” instead of devaluing it. :innocent:
[/quote]

You have a delightful talent for making me feel protective of the Prince and Princess.[/quote]

aaawwww…I only wish to protect them from the true predators while helping them make their dreams come true. :innocent:

[quote][quote=“P_Tigras, post:978, topic:15992”]
Feel free. From what you’ve told us about our rebellious princess so far, warning her will only make the MC more intriguing to her eyes… :smiling_imp:
[/quote]

That little emoji conveys so much quiet malice…[/quote]

One person’s malign influence is another’s playfully fun and edgy bad boy.

[quote][quote=“P_Tigras, post:979, topic:15992”]
If you’re pussy-footing around the possibility of a potentially taboo “relationship” between the MC and their “adopted” mother as we’ve discussed previously
[/quote]

I’m not. I still don’t see any legs in that relationship. [/quote]

The relationship doesn’t need to have legs to be memorable or have impact. Not every assignation has to be a potential One True Love destined to last forever. In fact it kind of gets old after awhile when every non-purely platonic relationship in the vast majority of games is treated that way.

I do believe you’ve established all of the above save for the asexual part. I don’t think you’ve written about her sufficiently for the readers to conclude that her reserve is due to asexuality, at least not in the writings you’ve shared so far. It does kind of sound that some part of you would like to make her firmly asexual however, even though it perhaps doesn’t entirely mesh with one of the story events you’ve planned.

I’m all for character consistency, but we’re still early enough in that you can make adjustments without causing contradictions.

I don’t think Judd Apatow ever had someone fatally disassembled in the opening scene…

So if you’re worried about somehow losing the Apatow vibe, that horse has already left the barn…

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That machines takes DNA from two humans to make a child, so while I’m not ruling it out, it’s not the be-all-end-all solution to the matter of cross-species fertilization. I still haven’t 100% decided on matters of Human/Myrmidon hybridization, all I know is that narratively it serves the story to deny it for now.

There are some unpleasant parallels here, aren’t there?

Oh I quite agree, romantic relationships are often used as a form of ‘reward’ for good behaviour in a game, and I’m trying to steer away from that where possible. Someone can be a fleeting relationship, I just don’t think that Lady Calinas would pursue that option. I think most of her sensual power is in the promise of future pleasure, without the actual pay-off. She gives me the impression of being an unassailable mountain, inviting climbers to reach the summit or die trying. Explicitly showing her giving in to some small modicum of emotion and inviting someone for a roll in the hay undermines her in future.

She is more of a machine than her ‘child’ is, and showing the intimate vulnerability that is inherent in romance (however fleeting and physical) challenges that assumption. One can have emotionless sex, but one must at least give the impression of being emotionally available in order to get to the point where sex is on the table. That’s Lady Calinas’ understanding.

She was shown from an early age that eligible girls like her had one job, to be pretty statues who would recite pretty poetry on command. She took that role and owned it, subverting it and turning it from a submissive role to a dominant one.

I quite agree, that word doesn’t quite sum her up, but it was a good place to start. I should say that in her hierarchy of needs, sexual and romantic fulfilment are nowhere near her political ambitions, so low on the pyramid that she can basically ignore them in service of her higher goals and never feel any discomfort from them.

Aside from the horrifying image of Seth Rogen hurriedly trying to re-pack his own intestines as robotic manipulators come back to finish the job, that metaphor has yielded nothing good for me.

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We should start a club for overly inquisitive folks who apologize for being overly inquisitive. No name ideas at the moment, but I know that bitchin’ jackets are simply a must-have membership perk.

A ramble sounds like the opposite of a threat.

I feel like a complete fool requesting this, but do you have a visual aid to go along with this? I do have a picture of the Rings in my head, I just don’t want to be… wrong…

And much more useful in this age of the Internet, I assur-

Wait. Bad cat puns?

…I suppose I brought this on myself. There is an inherent wisk…er, sorry, risk to self-esteem when punning around online.

…I’m… gonna go ahead and resist temptation by attempting to ask a serious question-

Would the Lady C fake attempts at seducing the MC in order to gauge whether or not they’d be able to effectively sniff out that sort of manipulation attempt? An innuendo here, a gaze lingering a bit longer than necessary there, the MC is in her bedroom and stuff’s totally about to happen… but, nope, it was a test and they failed spectacularly.

…you say horrifying, insomnia says guilt-inducingly hilarious.

edit: …forgot some things.

Re: the teaser scenes and any you may have forgotten - do things like Momo’s three-way with the Doublemint Clones count as ‘forgotten?’ (Also, there was a scene with Ariadne much further up that wasn’t in the collection… or I simply missed it somehow.)

Also. I don’t know where this came from or… why it came… but am I crazy comparing the Lady Calinas’ relationship with the noble MC to Miss Havisham and Estella’s relationshup in Great Expectations?
(The actual thought was something more like 'Miss Havisham - batshit insanity and, like, twenty years + a crapload of political savvy = The Lady Calinas," but… eh.)

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Well there is the saying “an embarrassment of riches” so maybe it could be an “Embarrassment of Questions”?

I’m actually very curious about Lady Calinas’ childhood. We all know her so well as the manipulative “mountain” as you so described, but did she ever have that “childhood innocence”? If so, when was it trained out of her? Does she ever reminisce about how happy she may have been as an ignorant kid? Or does she despise her past self?

Do we, on the Nobel Path, ever get to learn about what led her to be… how she is?

For that matter did she, at one time, believe in the possibility of genuine love and perhaps even had a genuine, innocent childhood romance? Was it ripped away from her upon training? Or was that her first lesson: genuine love doesn’t exist? Or only exists to gain power?

Also, diverging from Lady Calinas I did some thinking (never good) and had an odd thought regarding the previous conversation(s) about Flash 2.0 aka “Using The Forge To Recreate Flash - Maybe At MC’s Expense Maybe Not”.

Could, hypothetically, this hypothetical backfire horribly? Not recreating Flash but either killing or effectively disabling the MC? Could the effect be half-done? Resulting in (as we talked about beforehand) a sort-of multiple-personality split? Only this time instead of being Flash or the MC in control at a time, it’s some odd Flash-MC insane hybrid?

Could it perhaps drive the MC to the point of insanity, combined with the feeling of defeat and loss, so much so that it drives the MC flat out insane? Perhaps to the point where they truly believe that they are Flash even though the procedure failed? But because they don’t know Flash, I assume their “imitations” wouldn’t be effective or convincing in the least…

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What would be the point anything that results from that will still be a pale imitation, a machine and a mockery of that person who once lived.
There’s also the “at the expense of the mc” thing you’ve just mentioned. The mc will have to, somehow come to terms with the fact that they are literally a child borne of murder, as there is no other way to describe the events that led to their “creation” as anything but cold-blood pre-meditated murder. However I fail to see how trying to bring back what cannot be brought back is going to help with that, murder, after all, tends to be quite final by its very definition.
Which, incidentally, is why the “justice” that (hopefully) follows as a consequence is hardly ever going to be anything other than the “best” that can be made of a rotten situation.

Depending on how much it affects the mc, I could see the ones who take up with the former friends of Flash possibly starting a personal crusade to find and destroy the remaining forges and prevent the knowledge from ever (well as long as they exist anyway) being rediscovered. In effect becoming a rather darker twist on the scientist and adventurer-archeologist archetype I tend to like, but instead of uncovering the mysteries and secrets of the past he’d rather ensure they stay buried.
Rather like Caradin and Shale destroying the “Anvil of the Void” in DA:O it won’t reverse what has been done to them, but it will prevent more Dwarves from having to suffer that fate in the future.

That’s a rather likely outcome, I think. They’d go full on mad scientist in trying to recreate what cannot be recreated.
In effect I could see any mc of mine who goes through that sort of additional trauma becoming this , a mad scientist who cannot let go of the past and constantly attempts to recreate the world “as it should have been”.

All in all I’d say you’ve got quite a fascinating WiP here @Moreau , though I’ve not been able to bring myself to follow the “noble” route yet, as that would mean giving Flash’s murderer what she wants, at least partially.

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Somehow I always wander back to endeavoring Lady Calinas as a less “noble” Marquise de Merteuil, (Dangerous Liaisons), only instead of sipping tea it would be the blood of the newly fallen. Though, obviously, Finn would never be her Valmont…

But…the ennui, the inevitable fugue state, the very shallowness of which I am capable…

(starts tangent on why Flashdroid should never be without a velvety purple cape and a wax paper sack full of multicolored taffy)

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I genuinely have no frame of reference here… I don’t know whether people have made any concrete pictorial studies of a structure this… big.

I’ve honestly been looking for the better part of an hour. I have nothing.

Hmm… I suppose it isn’t entirely beyond the realms of possibility. The MC will be having lessons from experienced tutors on every other subject from statecraft to swordsmanship, why not seduction?

I missed both of those scenes, so I’ll go back and add them in, although the threesome scene might not be strictly canonical… Maybe a bonus for people who play the game through twice?

The parallels are not entirely unwarranted, I grant you that.

I do have some interesting ideas about the Lady’s childhood, including a rather shocking revelation in the final chapter that I won’t reveal a single thing about, so you’ll just have to wait.

Forges are fairly complex, they aren’t exactly a plug and play interface. Anything could happen if someone tampered with the machine without knowing what they were doing.

Interesting take, we’ll have to see whether we can entice you to change your mind in the coming days…

It all comes back to Dangerous Liaisons in the end, doesn’t it? As long as we avoid the 90’s sinkhole that was Cruel Intentions I think I’m on the right track.

(Furious note scribbling)

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Now that I think about it, I wonder if we couldn’t reprogram one of those infernal forges to take over his life and looks, rather than be a mockery of Flash. As he was part of our “father’s” murder I don’t think my mc would have any objections to that and he has already got both the reputation and profession he’d need to carry out his goals. While he could certainly try to build his own accomplishments in the field, just taking over mr. Finn’s seems rather easier (and thus more efficient) to do, especially since he would be determined not to share any of his “discoveries” ,apart from some pretty yet entirely useless trinkets, with human society at large.
Or is there some sort of twisted version of Asimov’s laws in place to prevent us from doing so?

Frankly I’d be more interested in the magister route, you’ve not yet written. The “noble” route seems to involve some courtship and marriage and I don’t see my android falling in love with anything except an even bigger quantum computer/ machine intelligence, and in the case of the one “raised” by Flash’s former friends even that may turn out to be a star-crossed affair, as I don’t think they’d appreciate his stance when it comes to humans and technology more advanced then what they’ve already got.

He’d also need to determine who the “User” and thus the true murderer was, Finn (least likely), the Lady (possibly, she did commission the whole expedition, after all), the Magister (most likely) or another machine intelligence (a small probability, but you never know “mentally linked” says nothing about the distance nor the sort of mind that is linked up).

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Technically, we are. Dun dun dun. I was operating under the impression that Arinthas is the User as seemingly the only one capable of working the ancient “magics” of the Forge. Indeed, they all have blood on their hands as they all acted in accordance to having prior knowledge of Frankenflash’s fate, and yet I believe I would do the magister character a discredit to call him merely the sword.

Hm. It would be something if a bloop-esque anomaly had circumvented the original instructions where Arinthas had originally intended for something other than Flash’s brain to get bigger…merely a hint of some future sentient Forge trolling…

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Operative word here being “seemingly” the Lady is very accomplished at hiding her true abilities and motives, and an ancient machine intelligence might have been willing to play along with the charade and allow the ignorant humans to think they had control for its own nefarious purposes. I do agree that the magister is by far the most likely one, but I’m not quite prepared to rule the others out just yet. They all seem to possess far more knowledge than they are willing to let on.

Quite true, which is why I said I’d have no problem with the mc that is raised by Flash’s friends essentially taking over mr. Finn’s life in order to get his personal crusade going. Furthermore all my mc’s, should they ever find out the truth of it, would likely want to change their appearance to resemble something other than Flash.

Well in any case my first mc is quite intent on destroying the remaining Forges and making sure the humans never regain the knowledge required to rebuild them.

As for the teasers they all do seem to assume our android is willing to go for romance, which is not a given, not all androids are quite like mr. Data and not all desire to be (and feel) human. Indeed even some humans are not romantically or sexually inclined, or both. They also assume he/she/it prefers to fight with the current weapons, whereas in both the magister and the rebel path my android might like to go for “magic” i.e. a laser pistol, sonic riot suppression device, a taser, or arc-gun or something like that, if at all possible.
If he could build or recover it something like the phaser, variable settings from stun to disintegrate and wide, or narrow beam that would likely be his weapon of choice. Even if that is not possible a simple revolver shouldn’t be that hard to fashion.
He might also prefer to switch to a more efficient system of gathering energy and recharging than can be had by sleeping and consuming and digesting human food and drink.

As long as he has to consume human food and drink, might not bottles of (nearly) pure alcohol be one of the more efficient options available? Kind of like the Robots in Futurama, who use it as fuel?
Of course he might have to learn how to deactivate or disable any possible drunkenness sub-routines but if that quantum computer is capable of any self-improvement at all, I dare say that should not be all that difficult a task.

In sum, I think a path where the mc strives to become a more perfect machine, rather than more human, ought to be a valid goal too, but perhaps that is reserved for the as yet completely unexplored magister path, eh?

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…and with the word ‘Embarrassment’ in the title, there’s absolutely no reason not to use those fantastically garish 80’s ski jackets as the official club jacket…

It’s perfect.

…you could, for example, accidentally splice Jeff Goldblum’s DNA with that of a fly…

I’m gonna go with… Mr. Gray on the mezzanine with a syringe. Flash was gonna eat it whether or not the Forge was workable, it seems…

I agree, but the MC would have to know that they were a machine first, correct?

What else? …oh!
So, @Moreau I can’t remember if this was ever stated explicitly in the game or discussed here on the thread, but is the Forge the chicken or the egg in regards to the expedition to Vovoda?

Also, in general, I’d just like to say what a near on grand ol’ time I’ve been having on this thread. Thank you all.

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Correct, but it shouldn’t be that hard to figure that out. They already seem to know they are different and more than one place in this world seems to have still working ancient tech. Once they begin to encounter that, combined with the knowledge they already seem two have it shouldn’t be that hard to put the pieces together. And on the magister “technomancy” route they may know basically from day 1 (well day 2 in-game more likely, but still…).

I do have one final comment on the teaser scenes, on the Rebel route there is one scene were we get to discuss what the real Flash was like, only my mc would never frame that question as you did there, he’d never ask “what was I like before” when talking about the real Flash. I’d think he’d use either “what was my father like?” (if wanting to be seen as both human and trying to forge a real connection with the Rebels), “What was Flash like?” (neutral) or “What was the being whose looks I seem to share like?” (if he both knows he’s a machine and identifies with that part more than his external shell).

Again I do hope that using the ancient tech as a tool and a weapon, much like the magister does, will be available to us on more than one path. Particularly as the rather primitive weapons in play afford us very little chance of ever taking on the magisters.

Meh, he’s nothing more than a rather insignificant accomplice. He did not make the plan and had only a very small part in its execution, even if that part would have amounted to the literal execution.

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