The Bastard of Camelot Announcement on post 3193

In that one, I make for one very-evil villain wishing to be stopped… :sweat_smile:

But that is there and this is here and I am off to bed. :grin:

Pretty sure Gally is in that same GIF corner due to Lance teaching the kid that Mordred is the villain by default (whether that be true or not). That guy probably feels like he is a knight who is falling in love with a dragon when he’s supposed to be saving the prince/princess. :joy:

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Lol, that’s actually galahad “the pure” from monte python and the quest for the holy grail in the gif

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Thought I’d give it a shot and… Omg this is so good, and so enthralling I didnt want it to end!!

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Idk guys I just don’t know I think I’m catching feelings for Merlin :scream:…anyway me and my friend were having a conversation about villians and stuff and she brought up a point about that how would one classify a villain and it made me think of Morgana. Like to some she could be considered a villian and to others she could be considered as someone who isn’t necessarily bad, just made some poor decisions.
What are your guys’ opinions about that?:face_with_monocle:
What classifies someone as a villain?
Just wanted some opinions :grin:

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please, not again ((( ;゚Д゚)))

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Sorry? I didn’t know that this was already discussed🙁

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Well, the nature and views about Morgana has certainly popped up in many discussions and from varying angles in both forum and Tumblr. :sweat_smile: I’d recommend looking back on some of previous posts in both places due to it being a topic popped up quite often.

The general consensus is that its…complicated. There are just many reasons to hate Morgana for the choices she has made so far and the people she has hurt as there is to sympathize with how crappy of a situation she ended up being in due to Uther and the people around him not stopping his cruelty. it’s really dependent on both the reader and Mordred’s view itself.

Don’t worry about it. Morgana and Arthur both have just been a matter that has been discussed in so many circular debates, that its best not to revive it too much. Needless to say, people definitely have their opinions on it. :sweat_smile:

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If that’s the case I’ll delete the message as to don’t start problems

Nah, sorry… I was being rude.

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NONO you weren’t rude at all
I should have checked back
But there’s a lot and as much as I love to read
It’s hard to read it all

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A moustache they can twirl and a cat to keep on their lap, oh and a killer laugh.

No, seriously though, generally speaking not just for characters in BOC I don’t like to use the term hero and villain, in my opinion a good character wouldn’t be morally black or white, the “villain” will be antagonistic to the MC but will potentially have a few understandable traits or motives not things that can necessarily be condoned by the MC though.

Like @Okami-Nora said, in relation to BOC now, it depends on how you view it, are her actions extreme? Probably, are they justified? Depends on your point of view. Everything she does is for Mordred but whether the reader agrees with the methods. :thinking:

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And the famous line: I’ve been expecting you

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Like I mentioned, don’t worry about it. It would be a little much to expect every new reader (or ones who aren’t often on the BoC forum) to go back through long forum posts and know which topics might have already been discussed at a noticeable length. the search option can minimize those back looks by a bit, but yeah Morgana’s name has popped up A LOT. :sweat_smile:

That said, your question about what makes a villain is a interesting thought to think about. My view on it can be summed with the phrase “no one is the villain of their own story”. Many don’t often pursue ambitions solely for the laughs (unless you’re a force-of-nature villain like the Joker or just complete monsters). They pursue these goals or desires for reasons that they themselves (or even a group of them) feel justified in doing. So one man’s hero will always be another persons villain of the goals end up clashing in some way.

For example, let’s use The Rebels of Bastard of Camelot. Merlin is doing his best to paint them in the worst light possible and have Camelot simply view these people as merely Highway men/women who are highly stubborn against merging with Arthur’s rule. But this is Merlin we’re talking about; guy’s constantly got a scheme behind his actions and the situation with the Rebels is no different. Yes, they are Highway people…however, they are also one of the few people to push back against Uther’s force (if I remember correctly) and have a hidden knowledge about dragons that Merlin is eager to obtain. Unlike the rest of Camelot (Arthur included), the Rebel King and his people are well aware that Merlin wants this hidden knowledge they have and of course would still not trust a alliance with Arthur’s kingdom, even if Arthur himself is a improvement when compared to Uther. Not Merlin is clearly still behind the new king. But because of Merlin and (possibly) some of the actions from the Rebel king and his people, there are varying views (in story) from both sides on conflict on who the true villain on that particular tale is.

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Yeah, I’ve already made my feelings clear on Morgana multiple times, about how I hate her and look forward to killing her in the game. But rather than go over all of it again, I’ll just direct you to some of my older messages in this thread. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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I think Morgana in particular is someone who can fall under the category of made some bad choices but was also forced into bad choices. Especially in this game, ice always had a bit of a soft spot for her though so I might be a bit bias lol.

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My thoughts on Morgana are that her actions resonably justified. Granted some of her problems, like her reputation and ‘bastard of a child’ are self-caused entirely. Yet I ought to give respect to someone dealt a bad hand and is making the most out of it.

Albeit she is a very bad influence and care-giver; she is just a mother who wants to make sure her child who is already suffering from her reputation and being fatherless, attains its birth-right or at least doesn’t get killed by Merlin. I would however understand anyone against her proactiveness in forcing decisions on us and how she did Arthur dirty.

To answer your original question on if I do think she is a villain;

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My Morgan is a Sympathetic Villain currently. He is not fond of Arthur, not fond of Morgana, and his magical outbursts are slowly coming more from a place of malice than emotions gone wild. However, their half brother and Gawain are the few folks he actually likes and cherishes. Hopefully as more content rolls in, he will be able to not only teach Merlin, Arthur, and Morgana a valid lesson in not using their kids as political pawns/ tools for personal revenge all while climbing to the top in Magic and in the social ladder.

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I actually wrote a paper on what makes a person a hero back in highschool and after much more research than I would normally give a highschool assignment, (sorry, not sorry, I’m naturally a lazy person). I came to the conclusion that selflessness was the prime characteristic of a hero. Therefore, I would say that selfishness would have to be the prime characteristic of a villain. That would be a sliding scale as well, the more you disregard the consequences others face for you to get what you want the bigger villain you are, and the more you sacrifice of yourself for others the bigger hero you are. That’s just my thoughts though.

Anti-hero, not a hero, because their selfish, but not a villain either, because they are also selfless. Their in the middle, neutral.

As I said these were just my thoughts. However, I feel like while the details may differ between time, culture, etc. the main principal of putting one’s own wants and needs before other’s is pretty universal. Again, just my thoughts. I feel I should also mention that I’m not bringing morals into this, because they do change, and I was only talking about the one universal characteristic heroes have.

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So, what about an anti-hero? Equal amounts of selfishness and selflessness?

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