Spellbound: A Ghost Story (WIP) [Updated May 22, 2024]

Empress_Nightmare · 2020-06-23T14:17:06.583Z

Eiwynn:

Cortez is related to Callum. Watch this space

Hostage · 2020-06-23T17:07:55.668Z

CorvusWitchcraft:

@Nuan10 No idea why this is happening—as far as I know, it fundamentally shouldn’t be possible while Implicit Control Flow is enabled (which it is). I’ve coded a hard fix by just adding a *goto and label, but if anybody has any additional insight on why this would happen or how to avoid it in the future, I’d appreciate it.

The error is still popping. First, I thought it was because my mundane stat was over 65, (and I thought *goto was just referring the *if mundane <= 65 block) - what would be even weirder because the block is already inside a fake choice…)

However, now, my theory is that all of this is happening because you use *if instead of *elseif to check the option [#This is incredible …].

Maybe it is not a problem with the Implicitly Control Flow, but with the check. My mundane value was 72. When I pick [#Despite my …], it becomes 64.8 (~65), then it satisfies the second condition. And since Implicity Control Flow is enabled (I dunno, my guess is the block that is skipped is the one inside the *if checked - which would be just one option [Despite my …]), the game tries to check the second *if – however, it’s not possible to display that because of the indentation, so it shows;

Edit: Also, since we are on the topic, I don’t know if it was intended, but it seems weird to display both options if mundane=65. I don’t even know if that is possible, just an observation

Edit again: But also, that would be fixed if you replace**if* for *elseif… So I guess both edits are useless lol

Edit (last one, I swear): Implicit control flow is too high QI to me so I honestly dunno. I think the best way to check is to update the code and test it. I have a save exactly in that scene, so if you need, just let me know and I can check if it works or is all this was just a lot of nonsense

Ikarus_1337 · 2020-06-23T17:17:41.040Z

CorvusWitchcraft:

Cortez, the hate for him is definitely valid; he’s meant to be a pretty polarizing character!

235

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-23T18:42:09.379Z

The_Eski:

That said, Cortez reminds me a lot of Callum. Charming assholes. I’m sure they’d get on like a house on fire. Or kill each other, which ever comes first.

Probably the latter. For all their apparent similarities, Cortez and Callum differ significantly in their values and what they feel is important. They would almost certainly hate each other.

Hypothetically, of course. Not to say they’d ever interact in the story itself…

Eiwynn:

Cortez is related to Callum.

That’s an interesting theory, though…

@Hostage The reasons you suggested for why the problem might be happening honestly make no intuitive sense to me from a coding perspective (why would it test the second *if instead of just falling out of the block completely??), but a combination of changing it from a *fake_choice to a regular *choice, and changing the second *if to an *else, did seem to fix it, either way. (I think? I tested it with an MC with 72 mundane.) So…thanks, I think? Let me know if the problem persists, though.

Hostage · 2020-06-23T19:18:38.670Z

CorvusWitchcraft:

(why would it test the second *if instead of just falling out of the block completely??)

The original error occurred as:

*choice
  *if mundane >= 65
    #Despite my wariness of magic, this does seem rather useful. 
      *set mundane %-10
  *if mundane <=65
    #This is incredible. I can't wait to figure out what else I can do. 
      *set mundane %-10
      *set light %+10

~~(I’ve edited my post so many times that you probably missed it, but)~~ My guess is
Enters *choice → enters *if → the block that is skipped is the one inside the *if checked - which would be just one option [Despite my …] → The game breaks

I’ve found someone mentioning that, so I guess it is indeed not related to the value of the variable, just with the format. But I honestly don’t know how implicit control works when you put a choice inside *if. So, here’s the post:

New ChoiceScript features: implicit control flow, gosub parameters Announcements

I just wanted to point out some “limitation” so if you encounter it, you can make a work around for it (or avoid it). This doesn’t work *temp loop <Insert some number here> *label up *choice *if loop = <number1> #Choice A *if loop = <number2> #Choice B *if loop = <number3> #Choice C *else #4th option is always different from the others *goto somethingentirelyelse *goto up
Instead, do it like this to make it work
*temp loop <Inse…

EDIT: Ok, I admit my guess makes nonsese (as it doesn’t happen in other instances), however, the moral of the story is - If you put multiple ifs inside a choice and they will check the same variable, you should use elseif/else. If someone knows the reason, I would be happy to try to understand it

Lan · 2020-06-23T21:26:56.954Z

I’m not sure why CS works like this, but I’ve found it sometimes behaves unexpectedly when faced with two-line conditional choice options and series of ifs checking the same variable. (Your example has both!)

Changing either of these things produces working code:

Original (Buggy)

*title Original (Buggy)

*create implicit_control_flow true
*create mundane 66
*create light 50

*choice
  *if mundane >= 65
    #Despite my wariness of magic, this does seem rather useful. 
      *set mundane %-10
  *if mundane <=65
    #This is incredible. I can't wait to figure out what else I can do. 
      *set mundane %-10
      *set light %+10

*finish

Example 1

*title Example 1

*create implicit_control_flow true
*create mundane 66
*create light 50

*choice
  *if (mundane >= 65) #Despite my wariness of magic, this does seem rather useful.
    *set mundane %-10
  *if (mundane <= 65) #This is incredible. I can't wait to figure out what else I can do.
    *set mundane %-10
    *set light %+10

*finish

Example 2

*title Example 2

*create implicit_control_flow true
*create mundane 66
*create light 66

*choice
  *if mundane >= 65
    #Despite my wariness of magic, this does seem rather useful. 
      *set mundane %-10
  *if light <=65
    #This is incredible. I can't wait to figure out what else I can do. 
      *set mundane %-10
      *set light %+10

*finish

LastLau · 2020-06-23T22:12:48.619Z

Regina felt like a TV-high-school bully. How old is Valerie and Regina?
Cortez did not disappoint 10/10 ready to be killed again by an arrogant jerk. (love him )

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-23T22:36:55.049Z

Lan:

I’m not sure why CS works like this, but I’ve found it sometimes behaves unexpectedly when faced with two-line conditional choice options and series of ifs checking the same variable. (Your example has both!)

This is still super weird to me, but thanks for the clarification! I’ll try to keep that in mind for the future.

LastLau:

Regina felt like a TV-high-school bully. How old is Valerie and Regina?

Valerie is 23-going-on-24 but is (intentionally) a bit immature for her age. Regina is a little older, maybe 26-27? She’s a graduate of Runepoint, which typically runs from age 22-26.

I can see where you’re coming from with the high school bully thing But, TBH, I’ve seen real people behaving like her that are even older. I’d assume she’s more professional when she’s not around Valerie, who brings out her inner bully. (Though, apparently she’s still mean enough for Cortez to recognize her as a bully, so…maybe still a bit immature even in the best of times.)

That said, if it’s too much, I can probably tone it down a bit? Regina is meant to feel petty and vindictive, but not to the extent that it makes her hard to take seriously as the competent mage she actually is.

fisheye:

My reaction when callum announces the betrayal was not that my MC need to kill callum but more like my mC loses all motivation and honestly still didn’t think its brother could be guilty up until that moment

I can understand this reaction, but for the sake of limiting story branches (it’s very important that Callum actually die in the prologue), I felt that it was necessary to guide the MC’s reactions to a certain extent. There are a couple qualities that are inherent to all MCs, at least during their actual lives (there’s a bit more flexibility as a ghost, since so much time has passed). Determination is one such quality; you couldn’t have gotten to the events of the prologue in the first place without a lot of it.

Sorry if this doesn’t resonate with you! I hope you can still find something to enjoy about the experience.

LastLau · 2020-06-23T23:48:05.552Z

I guess a person would go for such an effort to mock if there was an audience (and there was, right?) Idk, feels like Regina is really smart though, I wanna like her can we have an option to call her out on beeing childish and her insults weak?

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-24T01:27:53.919Z

LastLau:

Idk, feels like Regina is really smart though, I wanna like her

I think you’re the first person to have anything positive to say about Regina, haha. But I’m glad to hear that she still comes across as capable despite her childish behavior!

LastLau:

can we have an option to call her out on beeing childish and her insults weak?

I can probably figure out a way to fit that in somewhere.

fisheye:

It seems like there could still at least be an option where MC kills Callum unintentionally while defending itself or something, for MC that doesnt want to kill its own brother

I really hate to say no to a request like this, because I definitely understand the want, but I just don’t think it’s in the cards. This would change the emotional tone of the confrontation pretty severely, in ways that I just don’t think would feel completely compatible with the rest of the story. The MC’s fundamental need to see their mission through, and resolve to do just that, emotional anguish be damned, is a major aspect of the past-era storyline.

On a practical level, consider also that the MC already only barely defeats Callum by going all-out in that last fight; my feeling is that any amount of holding back would have resulted in Callum winning and surviving. I could change that, but it would require me to completely rewrite certain aspects of how that fight plays out.

I’m really sorry if this still isn’t a satisfying answer for you! Like I said, the present-day segments will (hopefully!) allow for more freedom in terms of personality.

Titanwithwings · 2020-06-24T02:50:27.135Z

Some thoughts on the whole MC killing Callum thing. Maybe there could be some choices specifying what MC thinks about the situation? The story as far as I can tell doesn’t really specify how the MC feels about killing Callum, only that he needs to die. There could be an option that states that the MC doesn’t necessarily want to kill Callum, but realizes that they have to for their own sake or the sake of others. Especially since we do get similar choices for dealing with Cartwell/Leydriss later on in the story, with the option to specify whether the MC wants to kill them out of necessity, revenge, etc. I feel like this could be a good compromise, allowing the player more agency and input while not having to fundamentally change the way the scene plays out.

Anyway these are just suggestions, but I hope they’re at least somewhat helpful

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-24T02:54:12.786Z

I’ll have to review that scene to see if there’s a place I can insert it without interrupting the flow, but my initial thought is that it sounds doable. Thanks for the suggestion, and I’ll see if I can implement this in the next update!

Eiwynn · 2020-06-24T04:02:07.574Z

CorvusWitchcraft:

I’ll have to review that scene to see if there’s a place I can insert it without interrupting the flow, but my initial thought is that it sounds doable. Thanks for the suggestion, and I’ll see if I can implement this in the next update!

I kind of like it the way it is, because I do not know how my MC would think of the situation, not yet anyways.

There is a lot to learn about what happened between the MC and Callum from the farm to the final battle. As an example, before I can even think of answering how my MC would feel about killing him, I would need to know more about the first failure of charm making… and that is just one of the factors that would equate into how my MC would be feeling at the “last confrontation.”

The confusion in my mind is best left roiling there, until I can better understand what makes up the feeling my MC would have towards Callum.

Heck, I do not even know if it was Callum, a part of him, or the mantle alone that directed Callum’s actions that day… so to ask me to choose what my MC feels at that time makes no sense to me.

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-24T04:09:38.136Z

Hmm Well, my thought was that not knowing how you feel would itself be an option for this choice. But if you really think posing the question in the first place is fundamentally out of place, I guess I’d have to think about this.

Eiwynn · 2020-06-24T04:14:29.120Z

I think both @Titanwithwings and my feedback are valid and actionable … it will be up to you to take what you want and stay true to your vision … I just felt it right to present my opposite view there, just in case you could use the feedback.

One of my future projects will be a ghost protagonist, so I am keeping my eye on this WiP, trying to learn as much as I can

If my giving feedback so often bothers you, I can lay off.

Lala_Zarus · 2020-06-24T05:52:09.089Z

Hi! It’s really exciting to see all the new scenes in this latest update, and i especially love Cortez. How old is he, by the way?

I’ve noticed that in the latest scenes (especially after Valerie met Cortez and the Magus, and has been relocated to the HQ , Valerie’s dialogue seems to be a bit mouthful and packed with a lot of “…”. Perhaps her dialogues could use some more spacing to make it easier to read?

And again about Valerie, with her age being 23 and the fact that she lived and survived in the slums alone for some time, i think it’s a bit weird for her to be too naive or too childish. Especially if she had had to support herself from an early age. I honestly thought that she was around 13-17 years old. But again, maybe her more mature qualities would shine in specifics situation in the future updates.
Another weird part is how Cortez trust us more than Valerie, and doing it too quickly. I mean, the MC is practically an unknown ghost, their soul magically binded with Valerie’s as her familiar in an “accident”. From Cortez-Valerie dynamic, i could infer that the two of them have some history, and he knows that Valerie’s knowledge in magic and personality is a bit unreliable. But, why does he trust the MC, even giving us the rein in the interrogation scene, when he intentionally left Valerie out? In that situation, leaving us with Valerie seems to make more sense

Neverthless, i’m really excited to see more updates in the future! this wip is one of my favorite

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-24T06:22:09.182Z

Eiwynn:

If my giving feedback so often bothers you, I can lay off.

Not at all! I actually very much appreciate hearing different points of view before coming to a decision.

Lala_Zarus:

It’s really exciting to see all the new scenes in this latest update, and i especially love Cortez. How old is he, by the way?

Cortez is 32. In contrast to Valerie, he arguably acts a bit older than his age.

Lala_Zarus:

I’ve noticed that in the latest scenes (especially after Valerie met Cortez and the Magus, and has been relocated to the HQ , Valerie’s dialogue seems to be a bit mouthful and packed with a lot of “…”. Perhaps her dialogues could use some more spacing to make it easier to read?

I’ll take a look and see if I can do something about that!

Lala_Zarus:

And again about Valerie, with her age being 23 and the fact that she lived and survived in the slums alone for some time, i think it’s a bit weird for her to be too naive or too childish. Especially if she had had to support herself from an early age. I honestly thought that she was around 13-17 years old. But again, maybe her more mature qualities would shine in specifics situation in the future updates.

Well, there are a couple factors at play here. I can’t say too much about Valerie’s backstory, but her mid-to-late teens were…unusual. Parts of her grew up, others didn’t. Also, there are…other things that have affected her emotional development, with mixed results. I’m sorry I can’t be less vague than that

The other thing to consider, regarding her having to live on her own for a while, is that until a few years ago, Valerie didn’t really need to worry about real grown-up concerns—when she needed money, she’d literally just make some gold and pawn it off. It wasn’t until the Circle found her and told her to cut that shit out that she started living in the Drowning District, and obviously, she still hasn’t fully adjusted to that lifestyle.

You’ll see her act less naive in future chapters, though whether she’s any more mature or not is up to interpretation. There’s a lot going on with Valerie, and a lot of different (equally valid) ways to interpret the character.

Lala_Zarus:

From Cortez-Valerie dynamic, i could infer that the two of them have some history, and he knows that Valerie’s knowledge in magic and personality is a bit unreliable. But, why does he trust the MC, even giving us the rein in the interrogation scene, when he intentionally left Valerie out? In that situation, leaving us with Valerie seems to make more sense

He doesn’t really trust you. In fact, in some ways this is the point. The entire interrogation is a test—he’s trying to feel you out and see how much he can rely on you. The fact is that apart from confirming Felix’s involvement (which he does regardless of how well or poorly you do), he didn’t really need to interrogate Jacqueline about anything—he basically already knew the most important piece of information right from the start. He’s just seeing if you can catch up to where he is.

And yes, Cortez and Valerie are not personally acquainted until the events of the story, but he knows her by reputation and has very much already made up his mind about her. He definitely knows enough to not want her anywhere near a prisoner interrogation!

Lala_Zarus:

Neverthless, i’m really excited to see more updates in the future! this wip is one of my favorite

Thanks!

xelvmi · 2020-06-24T13:28:00.473Z

i just finished reading the update and i couldn't stop thinking of that b99 meme so i made one in honor of valerie because i love her a lot 🥺

1592999867687

i found myself relating to valerie a lot, and so far she’s my favorite character. i was planning on romancing cortez, especially after he murdered regina on sight, but then that scene happened, so . suffice to say i’m looking for a second candidate lol (maybe merrow? he seems quite interesting ). i’m definitely excited to see how everything would play out, i wish you luck author!

LX3CT · 2020-06-26T08:11:47.441Z

https://imgflip.com/i/46dy85
so i was reading the replies and immediately thought of this

CorvusWitchcraft · 2020-06-26T08:30:41.985Z

So, this happened faster than I expected. But Spellbound now has an appendix in the stats screen! And it updates with the progression of the story, because apparently I just didn’t have enough variables yet! And it’s set up so the descriptions will change depending on which time period you’re in, because I can’t live unless everything I do is as complex and intricate as possible!! I hate my life!!!

Also, apparently my stats screen is, like, 8000 words long now. (No, I’m not going to include it when I list my total word count.)

Anyway, I ran this through Quicktest and did some quick manual surfs for bugs, but given the complexity of the system, I’m sure somebody somewhere will eventually have problems with it. Let me know!

For the purposes of not making everyone play through the game again, I’ve set it up so visiting the end-of-demo screen (the one with the “next time on” junk) will flip all the variables to give you just about the maximum amount of information available at this time (even if you didn’t actually obtain that information the way you were supposed to, e.g. by reading the book). I’ll probably keep it this way until I upload Chapter II-3 (the update after the next one).

With that all being said, I haven’t actually been working on the story itself, so, uhh, I guess I should probably start doing that at some point. Still tentatively thinking of a July update.