Samurai of Hyuga Book 3 (Patreon/Early Access info on Post 1297!)

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No. As previously mentioned by others, MC at least recognizes the things they’ve done and is working actively to change that (at least if you’re playing it that way)

Jun(ko) doesn’t make that distinction and has done horrible things because they felt like it. Take what happened to Momoko for example.

No one is saying you can’t. What we’re saying is that Jun(ko) having a redemption arc is not for this story. Why? Because the set up and all other narrative elements are not in their favor for this. See above discussions for why

If Jun(ko) has no desire to want to get better then what’s the point? Unless they actually want to change, you can’t do anything – which in this case would probably be frustrating to play through. It’s likely to be set up as a false choice because again there isn’t enough evidence to support that this would actually manifest as a meaningful decision

You want players to feel their choices matter. Since Jun(ko)'s character arc doesn’t involve any redemptive elements or aspects on a narrative level, why put that there? I can guarantee you that there will be some who will definitely complain about spending how many hours only for it not to go as planned

Jun(ko) is a tragic villain but still a villain and I don’t see how they can plausibly (and believably and satisfyingly) join the heroes’ side in the span of 3 books left without throwing characters like Momoko under the bus

(Implications of what her character serves as becomes extra cringe if this happens)

In anycase, if we’re talking about things I’d like to see in the next book, definitely for the author to address the Kuniko and Momoko issue and for them to make appearances in general.

(Not going to repeat the arguments to why I feel this way – if anyone’s curious, please scroll up instead :)) it’s a long debate)

Also for some kind of more nuanced writing regarding the Toshi romance. Like the MC vaguely confessed and suddenly they’re that intimate? As a Toshi shipper am happy that they’re together but I was hoping for it to be more of a slowburn given who is involved here

Like at this point, Hatch out of all people is looking to be a slowburn romance (if ever at all) and I don’t know how to feel about that

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Well i wont argue about the jun/ko thing because we definitely have different opinions but thank you for disscussing it with me :slight_smile: and ur right will just have to see how the author goes about it! And lol i have to agree with u about the toshio romance it was quite quick tbh and i wanted as u said a slow burner i was hoping that in book 3 hatch wouldve been an RO and toshio for book 4 given how 3 ended up which would have given toshio time to sort out his feelings regarding the emperor and the ronin especially with them leaving tho i really cnt wait for momoko to return in book 4!

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I don’t know yet, it depends where the author decides to take the story… But in talking about a redemption arc for Jun/ko, we are kind of assuming we won’t end up being given a choice to side with him/her. I mean, it was actually Momoko who was on redemption path, and one could make a case, if Jun/ko is supposed to represent some kind of karmic force in the story on a path of justice/vengeance, that it was her price to pay for that redemption, and her past actions and all the lives she had destroyed. Or at least, I could see Jun justifying his actions that way. Assuming he/she is not just insane and there is more to his/her motives.

(Not saying I think Momoko deserved it! It’s just a possble route I could see things going.)

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3 books of character dev should be able to give us enough to predict where this is going in so far as book 4 is concerned — or enough to make plausible conclusions on what to expect and happen. Jun(ko) has yet to present a coherent argument for why they behave the way they do that’s not linked to their insanity and obsession.

So yes as of now it doesn’t look good

If the author confirms this is the case for her, I definitely would disagree with this. A cut tongue while she’s trying to help refugees as an answer for her past crime doesn’t equate on so many levels and frankly would be unsatisfying imo

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You know what? To hell with the redemption arc. I want MC to have the option of going full Brutal/Drifter and choose Jun’s side. No redemption for anyone! I want to have the possibilty of that tragic ending, MC saying something like “Let’s go to hell together!” and they kill each other or she goes full Sith and they become a couple of assassins that make Hyuga shake with fear.

Heh. The bad guy redeemed is good, but the hero becoming the villain and STAYING a villain… hehehe. What can I say, I’m a Jun fan to the bone. If that makes my MC become a bloody killer for pleasure, then hell yeah!

Honestly, I’ve always wanted to read a book where the hero/ine is seduced by the dark side and STAYS in the dark side. And the end is the bad guys win. FOR ONCE. I mean, why is it always the order is restored and peace comes back to the land blablabla?

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Indeed, I just got the sense the group was so concerned over the MC still loving Jun because there was a fear the MC might run back to Jun. Otherwise it doesn’t make much sense tactically to keep the knowledge of a potential threat secret…unless you are worried you might be betrayed or don’t trust a person’s loyalty.

Also, I just see Jun as kind of a fury, I suppose.

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As for Tosh’s romance, I have to agree with this. I do believe that there is an attraction to the Ronin, more like admiration or they worship them like @Harian and you concluded. I do hope that on the future books, it will developed more into true love and address the issue of Tosh’s unrequited love to the Emperor at the same time. As much as I love Tosh with my Ronin, I would appreciate it that she is just a replacement.

I really don’t know how many times I said this. XD I really need to address other issues. :joy:

As for the redemption arc, I really can’t say much about it. I am all for second chances but based from I read so far, Jun/ko seems very far from being redeem.

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The MC as a replacement for something seems like a running theme with all the MC’s friends/relationships so far. The group has been trying so hard to save the MC, but they all have issues to work out of their own. So I don’t think that is just Tosh.

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I was hoping that the author would make good on that line. The one that says something like Toshi sees the MC for who they are — not as the Sword that Cuts Through Heavens — and loves them. Like seeing all the ugly that they have and still decide that they’re worth loving

That would be such a good relatioship arc? From distrust and animosity to mutual respect and friendship to eventually lovers

I was hoping for this book we would get more serious (romantically) with Toshi and have major hints of taking things to the next level. Since as of book two, they were just building on that friendship. Like I liked the part when the MC pretty much saves them on the gallows with their deductive reasoning and imply that they want something more. And Toshi reciprocates that – more of those moments. Make me believe that they are in love or at the very least attracted to each other

So the sex scene was a little too left field for me

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I do too, but considering there are likely still 3 books left to go, I thought the pacing was fine. First, the kiss on the island is interrupted, and then also the “happy ending” is interrupted. So it’s like…the romance was interrupted before it really even started. But now it is established, what could have been… So lots of room to go from there, and unresolved tension between Tosh and MC. IMO, it’s hard to say if the MC’s own feelings could have been genuine either, while they had forgotten Jun/ko. That’s not the same as choosing Tosh over Jun, knowing full well what choice they were making. Tosh has to figure out you can’t trick someone into loving you.

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Thank you for this. At the moment, I’m having trouble putting my thoughts into words.

This is how I view the matter as well but some might not view it this way though :thinking: And I hope my Ronin get to called Tosh out on this

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That’s the most interesting part though given how the story is right now for better or for worse. Like considering how my hopes were dashed of how the pacing was – was hoping it would be book 4 or 5 when things got “official” official with the MC and Toshi – this is a very good drama point

It also frames their goodbye in a very different light imo

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Come to think of it, the same happen with those who romance Momo?

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Yeah I did get that RK vibe way back during the book 1. However as we progress I get stronger and stronger vibe of Berserk. Even some characters bear a lots of similarity in that reggard. Not that it is a bad thing.

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Hi I’m back with another thing about the game. I’m gonna keep it fair though, and I’m sorry if I come off as whiny ><;

One of the bigger issues I had was with the Ronin losing their memories. Let me clarify: I loved it; I love that Devon is slowly stripping the player character–who is hands down the best fighter of the group-- of everything they think makes them “them”: their body is essentially crippled at the beginning of Book 2, and a third of the way through Book 3 they lose not just their memories but their signature technique. Like, that was SO GOOD, and both instances lead to a lot of good interactions and possibilities.
My problem was with Hashimoto and Tosh, and how they gaslight the Ronin. Now I know it’s more for personal reasons I take issue with this (but that’s another story), but I also think it’s a big missed opportunity.
Imagine if they’d asked the Ronin what they remembered: both from the mansion (like in Fatehaven or earlier in the game when there’s several options but you can only choose one) or to ask about Genfu! It might not have a big impact on the overall plot, but how cool would it have been to have the Ronin remember their childhood? Give the players options like if they remember it fondly, or if there were blacksmiths or shinto priests they looked up to, or if they’re glad to put that part of their life behind them.
What if the Ronin realized there were gaps in their memory?
What if Masa/Tosh tried to tell them but were either interrupted or like in The Sea Eternal where they told the Ronin but they COULDN’T remember?
What if we got a scene where they thought their newfound “gentleness” was because of their lost memories instead of them attuning to their Spirit Animal? Or they were written with guilty body language. Like, even if the POV character doesn’t understand why they won’t look them in the eye or stop talking about certain things, the player would know
Idk, it left a bad taste in my mouth. I’m grateful on the whole that the team interacting with each other more than they did in the previous two Books, but I think there were some missed opportunities and…well, again, I have a personal issue with people gaslighting friends “for their own good”.
So maybe it’s just me.

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Trust me its not only you xD as much as i love our rag tag bunch of misfits i kinda got annoyed that they constantly had to put the ronin in the dark forcing them to be kinda useless half the time and confused as to why they are useless :frowning:

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Like I said before, this scenario shows that even the main cast are prone to making mistakes. They meant well but it backfired on them. Keeping secrets led to consequences. I am hoping that on Book 4 at least that there should be a confrontation or indication that they made a mistake.

Probably this situation irked some people because the immersion broke for them I suppose. They don’t expect their Ronin to acts like that. :thinking:

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MC stated multiple times that they killed innocent simply for money they didn’t necessarily needed. During scene on the way to kabuki theater with momoko we admited to killing multiple men, woman and children, and while MC maybe feels bad now (which was never stated, at least I don’t remember our ronin saying that they regret being killer for hire) that is also not an excuse, I found it funny that most people who wouldn’t give Junko another chance have no problem with rationalizating our MC past crimes that are almost equally barbaric

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One reason for me that Jun/ko seems unredeemeable was the difference of their present situations. The Ronin seems to be wandering not killing anybody, unless you play a brutal Ronin (I think) but Jun/ko on the other hand, seems to continue to satisfy their bloodlust.

Does anyone remember if it was stated what our Ronin what doing before they became bodyguard and then the “Chosen One” =P?

:thinking: Maybe I should play SoH 1 to 2 again.

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they were an assassin. Shiroyama apparently hired them to kill her husband sometime in the past!

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