Samurai of Hyuga Book 3 (Patreon/Early Access info on Post 1297!)

gender-choice
low-fantasy

#167

So why are people okay with murder in their stories, but rape and pedophilia are too far?

If Devon removes those then he should remove every instance of murder and violence too. It’s weird to me how you can cut people in half, and be fine but need to put down the game and take a walk when the aforementioned “touchy” subjects are present.

Is murder not equally serious or worse? You’re taking a life!!!


#168

The difference here, I think, is that many readers are victims of those crimes, but murder victims, for obvious reasons, can’t read these stories. It becomes sensitive to people because the thing being written are their own life experiences. When not handled properly, it can feel hurtful to see something that resulted in significant trauma for oneself be used like that.

A few years ago, a friend of mine died in a car accident. This loss hurt me to a point that even today I still have to mentally prepare myself when I watch something that I know has a vehicular death, injury, or some sort of exploding car. I don’t want to get into specifics, but after my own accident this year, this sort of trigger did end up getting worse for me… That’s why I try to avoid any sort of media that involve car accidents. When people experience traumatic events that directly affect their lives, it’s natural that they want to have some form of warning so they don’t have to live through it again.

I don’t necessarily think that Devon should remove the scenes, because I believe that doing so risks becoming a bad example for other writings, but I think there should be some form of warning, beyond “scenes of a graphic nature.” If possible, I think that rewording the warning to “scenes that could be triggering for a reader” would be better, with an option in the stat menu or something that offers specific warnings so if someone wants to avoid being spoiled for something in the story, they can avoid that, and other people have an opportunity to know what they’re getting into.


#169

Oh! Also! Little plot hole thing!
You get to choose colors, and one of the options is "Black, because we’re going to a funeral"
Since it’s based off of Japan, shouldn’t it be white?


#170

That’s a good compromise, and a good explanation


#171

When it’s done to a separate character purely to give character growth to another? I think it’s done in bad taste.

And god…why do people so quickly jump to the “it’s historically accurate” thing in defense of all this? Like…cool we get it, bad shit happened in history; bad shit’s happening right this very second. It hardly offers any kind of immersion, if anything it makes me want to stop playing/reading all together.

Anime Logic makes ages blur if you squint hard enough, it makes a twelve year old child out to be an adult. But, the Masa debate is an age old one here on the SOH threads so I’m not touching it again but…it’s a bit much to claim “historical accuracy” and then have such painfully obvious “Anime Tropes” in a work.


#172

Black and white are both traditional mourning colors, though white is generally what you show up to the funeral with, and is used more broadly in any Buddhist funeral.


#173

and now I know! Thank you!


#174

I really REALLY did enjoy the bonding with Masa though…learning how to read/write was a huge thing I was hoping for for the ronin!


#175

I agree! Masa was delightful


#176

I actually enjoy historically accurate fiction (history major here), but I get sad because I feel like it’s only discussed when trying to justify tropes such as rape, pedophilia, racism, or homophobia against any sort of criticism. I feel like it simplifies real history far too much? Throughout history, people have tried to go against their societal binds, and I almost never see historical fiction explore those aspects. And I find that more often than not, when a writer uses that as an excuse instead of listening to the criticism, their stories aren’t historically accurate anyway, either because the author did not actually research the setting, or the setting is in a fantasy world with fantasy creatures and claim to be inspired by a hodgepodge of historical eras.

Samurai of Hyuga, as far as I know, has never tried to tout itself as historically accurate. Yes, it is clearly inspired by Edo Japan, but there’s possibly three female warriors (female MC with Junko and Toshie), and completely anachronistic phrases in the story, such as happy endings. I love the series but I don’t understand why people use historical accuracy to excuse some of its criticisms (If anyone wants to start a thread on historical accuracy vs writing for the modern viewer, I’d love to take part in it).

Getting more onto the topic of SoH, I haven’t had a chance to explore this option, but I remember seeing something about telling Hatch he looks more attractive with the beard? I was just wondering what happens when you select that.


#177

Regarding your question about exploring a particular option, I believe he just says something along the lines of ‘guess I’ll keep it around then’ and not much else. Clearly he was not an RO for this book lol

In terms of the other points mentioned above, I am in strong agreement that the aforementioned gritty scenes should NOT be taken out of the book. I actually think that historically accurate aspects should be incorporated into such games, and if someone does not want to read them, then just don’t read the book. I, for one, do find the contested scenes very important and relevant to the plot. As others have already said, the disclaimer at the beginning of the book can be reworded to include this to warn away unsuspecting readers.

If people still have significant issues with this, then SOH may not be the series for you. There are plenty of other fine books on this website that are worth reading.


#178

Hmmm, soo when did book mention about Jun’s trama? Maybe I missed something?:thinking:


#179

If you’re talking about Jun/ko which I’m assuming that you are then in the new book when you face off with the illusion of Sensei and ask him why he chose you as the heir over Junko, he’ll mention that Jun/ko was the child of a peerless samurai that Sensei feared. He’ll say that he had no weakness save for one which was little kids so that scene implied that Jun/ko was raped by his/her father as a child before Sensei took him/her in.


#180

Not to sound callous, but you won’t find survivors of murder reading these games. Those who knew the person who died may be affected if a similar situation comes up, but that is secondary to that of a person who has survived the latter. Again, not to sound callous or downplay anything.


#181

Technically you’re right on both count. SOH is heavily influenced by an anime called Rurouni Kenshin and the story of that anime is set in the late Edo and early Meiji period.

If you do not have a problem with agreeing that bad things indeed take place in the world then I suppose you should not have a problem with the author presenting those matters in his work. Of course they may not be on par with your personal taste but that opinion does not delegitimize the necessity of those particular scenes from the story.
And at the end of the day we can speculate as much as we like but the creation is up to the vision of the author.


#182

I really don’t think it’s too much to ask for an explicit warning at the start to go with the others like perhaps “scenes of sexual violence” or the like though.

But WHY is it always the same thing that’s included? Like I’m more upset that it happened to one character to further the development of another. Like it feels like her whole purpose was strictly to be there to be raped to provide depth to another character and then tossed aside.

It’s a tasteless trope honestly.

“Don’t like don’t read.” Okay but like I have read it? I had no idea it was going to happen going into it. Does it change how I perceive further instalments and my likelihood of continuing the series? Probably. But like…doesn’t change the fact that I already read it and I found it in poor taste and am I not allowed to be upset over such an act of hate/violence?

I’m pretty sure people are allowed to be upset or outright disgusted with the prospect of pedophilia being accepted openly in a game alongside a frankly unneeded rape scene however vaguely alluded to that it was.

Edit: I more so meant the acceptance in the potential of Masa romance? Like I know dark scenes happen I just really wish it was handled better if it is going to be included idek man


#183

Personally, am not against the inclusion of dark and heavy topics like the ones in the story but I do have issue with how they were handled

Like on one hand, these scenes were definitely not there to be tiltilating and generally there for your horror and discomfort. Which for me is a good thing! Lord knows there’s a lot of works which treats something like this as something like either “sexy but distressed” fanservice or as something (usually cis-male) can be rewarded with (“you saved the damsel congrats now you get to ravish her!”)

The gravitas these scenes are treated with imo are a good thing and I really wish other writers, should they have to have this, would also look at these events as they are: traumatic and brutal

But on the other hand, what do they do for the story? What is the purpose of including this scene? For discussion purposes I’ll use Momoko as she has more going down character wise

WALL OF TEXT AHEAD


For Momoko, my bone to pick is that as of 3 books, we have yet to see her as someone separate from the MC. The act of removing her tongue seems as something that’s set up for the MC to angst about. It literally has 0 to do with Momoko as a character or has anything to do with her character arc. I mean this in: 1) was this set up because of her own hubris, 2) does this give us any form of character growth given that she undergoes something horrible

On a meta level:

If the decision to include her maiming was a result of a character flaw or decision, it seems poorly exexuted on a narrative or thematic level. This isn’t a one time thing as consistently she gets the short end on the stick whenever she decides to do something out of her own volition

Like we have a doctor saddled with a lot of self doubt, guilt, and what not, from her stint with the Yakuza and when she decides to enact some form of agency – the decision to leave to atone for her sins – she gets punished for it?

Granted, it was noted that there is a war or some form of tension that says DANGER HERE but instead of furthering her arc, which is to say to answer to her misdeeds as the opium instigator, the answer to that train of thought is to…have her mutilated?

The idea of owning up to own’s actions is to have that? Even if karmic action is at work her, does it equate to her crime and her desire to make it right?

This in itself is an author decision, one that I disagree with, since the themes of redemption or furthering one’s own darkness makes this an odd exception. MC is actively answering to their past. If Momoko is answering to hers, I don’t see why she is robbed of the opportunity to do so consistently. She gets stuck as boob jiggler in the second book and the moment she decides to do something (again) to address this past, she gets brutalized and is largely absent and almost silent through it. We do not get to see the fall out of how she feels, what she does, etc etc after this. Which imo is crucial whenever you have this kind of drama or plot point

And while I understand that this speaks of Jun(ko)'s brutality, this scene imo also does her the diservice of being relegated into a Mcguffin character – you could literally replace her with any other character to show how far Jun(ko) has fallen.

If the reason for Momoko’s suffering is because the players are supposedly invested in her by this point feels now like that’s just it. She’s the cosmic chew toy, with no other purpose than to provide MC angst and reason for players to care for/rally against Jun(ko). It feels particularly big as a let down after having such a beautiful entry to her character.

(This is exacerbated even more considering her jiggle boobs arc for the MC in the second book)

In other words, Momoko is not her own character at this point (despite supposedly being 50% into the story – 3/6 books) and the fact that her aspirations is used to punish her is treading on a very fine line


No. We’re asking the author to treat his existing ones better given the premise and set up


#184

I thought the beginning of the game did have warnings such as that. But I suppose it could’ve been more clear.

Perhaps not, perhaps we will see more of the character later on. The incident took place near the end of book 3. So we cannot say for a certainty if the character will be included in the story or not.

Of course you can. Nobody’s asking you to stop doing that. But mind you those are opinion, they are subjective. They are neither inherently true nor inherently false.

I believe you need to be more clear on what you’re trying to say. If it is about the Jun/ko incident then I do not believe that particular action has been condoned anywhere in the game.
And if it is about Masami then I agree on the fact that they should not be available as a RO. It has been insinuated that it is an underage character. And personally I do not support having such a character available as a RO.


#185

I really liked the idea of our ronin getting a cool new outfit based on their spirit animal :eyes:!!! AND that we even got to keep it going forward too.


#186

The ending with Toshie got me, hoping we can continue romancing her in book 4, even after the mc walking off like that, i mean she beg on her knees asking us to stay with her ( which with the type of mc i have he should love her in the postion “ahem”), i mean my mc really lose it, lose Ige in battle thinking he was going come out 5 for 5 and pushing Toshie away like that, his ass better get himself together and come to his better sense in book 4. I swear if Toshie founds another before that happens or rejects him later, i hope Junko kills him because whole than his whole life would just be full of pitiful moments