Politics Thread


#1442

The PSOE or the Spanish social democracy committed as all Spanish parties a terribly corruption and stolen public founds condemned in jail. So people with a terrible educative system and a unemployed rate over 25% Repite history. It is terrible as extreme populism right and left are dangerous more having account our natural tendency to passionate fighting.

What I would love is something in my country is impossible as our character makes it impossible That social democracy and conservative center right put shit together and act logically for once to shun extremism. But that won’t happen so even more unestability and rcism


#1443

Not sure what thread this goes in, feel free to move it.

Quote:

In separately reported incidents, apps posing as health assistants invite users to use Touch ID before they show a calorie tracker, or take a heart rate measurement, or some other seemingly legitimate function. Once you scan your fingerprint, though, the apps briefly show an in-app purchase popup instead, charging anywhere from $90 to $120, and simultaneously dim the screen to make it hard to see the prompt. In some cases, even if you decline to use Touch ID to enable a feature, the app asks you to tap to continue—and try the in-app payment scam instead.


#1444

Reading what both you and @Vertigo are saying about Spain I can’t help but make comparisons with our situation here in Brazil. We also just left a dictatorship of around 20 years, had a left party electing presidents for about 18 years, now we have lots of scandals of corruption from that left party showing up in probably the biggest investigation the country’s ever seen and we just elected a far-right president two months ago. Also with both parties resorting to extreme populism and splitting the country during the election.
History does indeed repeats itself.


#1445

Speaking of controversial Spanish news stories, I saw this today:

Are there case facts missing from this news article @poison_mara and @Meira_Litch ?

Or perhaps there is more to this than what is said in this article?

This whole situation seems very wrong to me, an outsider.


#1446

As someone from Spain, I am not surprised at all on Vox wining. This has been coming for months now. In my opinion, what is happening with Vox is similar to what was happening with Trump in a way.

Andalucia is one of the most poor communities in Spain, also one that has a lot of immigration, specially from North Africa. And what Vox is appealing to for all this working class people is “the money that should be going to our pensions and the people from our country is going to give housing to this immigrants that don’t contribute to our country”. Then, all this people gets upset and throws all the blame on immigrants, and they vote for Vox.

@Eiwynn let me read that then.

Ah, yes, I know that. The whole situation with that is shady at best. A few of them were thrown into prison before having a trial, and most people was accusing them of gang rape. The thing is, there is a video (that no one but the judge and the pertinent people has seen) that seems to prove them as innocent of rape.

According to the authorities, the video shows that the girl was willingly having sex with all of them. The medical tests done on her didn’t show sings of sexual abuse either. After that, they did then steal her phone and left her there after they were done.

In this case, the popular opinion sees them as rapists, but all the evidence proves to the contrary.

So, ugh, as I said, is shady as fuck. But when there is all the evidence proving that she didn’t suffer a rape, both medical and visual… well, you can’t just throw them into jail without evidence. Is a really uncomfortable situation in the whole country, to be honest. But at the end of the day, it seems like this guys were massive assholes that used her like a sex toy and had no sympathy for her afterwards, but not really committing rape (but yes to committing theft).

And I wanted to add that, something that makes all this even more shadier is the fact that no one can see the evidence. Which, I mean, I get it, but this case is so incendiary that not being able to see with our own eyes what the hell happened makes it all more confusing.

I was on the side of people that was pretty much sure that they did rape her, but then when the news started to say the evidence pointed to a “no rape situation” I was deeply confused…


#1447

It’s not clear to me how “non-consent” and “passive suffering” during sexual acts with 5 men in a basement doesn’t involve intimidation and isn’t rape, but that’s what the Spanish courts determined. Apparently for it to be rape in Spain, force or active intimidation is required.


#1448

It probably has to do with the street cameras seeing the girl willingly walking with them around. Before they entered the portal (is that how you call the entrance of a block of building in English?), the group headed to a hotel in which they asked for a room “to fuck” (not sure why they didn’t get it, maybe the hotel didn’t want the mess), all this with the girl present.

As I said, is all really shady.


#1449

In the America of my childhood a woman entering a bedroom alone with a man would have been considered irrevocable consent. Today, if she changes her mind, even in the middle of penetration, he must stop or it’s rape.


#1450

Yeah, and in Spain, if she says she has changed her mind, it would be consider rape too.

The reason so much people feels conflicted about this is, because according to what the people who has seen the evidence say, the girl never communicated she changed her mind in any way. As such, a judge can’t send them to jail, since, if she didn’t want to be there, she didn’t communicate so.

And btw, I am just stating the facts as we know them, I hope no one thinks I am defending them, because is not the case. I am just trying to give the data we know as we have seen it.


#1451

That’s rough. Neither a complete lack of empathy nor assholery is a crime. What do the girl and her attorney say? Is it possible the video is incomplete?

Does the girl have an answer for why she felt too intimidated to speak up? She must have entered the basement knowing what was going to come. When did she change her mind and what is her explanation as to why she felt too intimidated to speak up when she did? It is a bit odd that she willingly entered a basement with five men openly talking about having sex with her and then changed her mind but was unable to even say “no” or “stop”.

Understood. No worries. And I agree with you that it seems very shady.


#1452

This is why I asked about the news story - it seemed incomplete in its reporting.

The key is consent and its withdrawal. If consent needs to be verbally communicated or verbally withdrawn to be valid, I have issue with that.

The news article seemed to indicate that her inaction itself could be seen as a withdrawal of consent. These types of things are sometimes hard to judge - does closing her eyes and shaking in fright rise to the level of non-verbal communication? It can when physical intimidation is involved. Peer pressure alone would be considered corrosive in this situation in some courts.

Either way, thank you for discussing this. I was sad to see this but once I started reading, I was confused. You have helped me see more of the actual facts involved and I thank you for that.


#1453

I wish I knew a proper answer to all of your questions.

The girl did most likely know what was going to happen, the only thing I can think of is that she kind of “turned off” once she wasn’t comfortable any more. Instead of saying no, she just stood there. The fact that everyone involved was drunk doesn’t help either, to be honest.

About the video being incomplete, I have no idea. No one really knows what is shown in the video =\


#1454

Legally is not rape by our legal standards She agree it was afterwards when they stolen her when she denounces them. In my personal opinion she should be jailed to falsely accuse them. She just destroy those guys life. And bad mouth real rape victims . Rape is a terrible thing to false accuse people. If you give consent you have to active oppose to act by act o by word to be rape


#1455

Yeah, I know, that’s why I see it so shady. A lot of people seem to think that if this guys treated her properly after having sex, non of this would have happen.

I think another reason a lot of people is so weary is because it reminds them of the case that happened in a fair in the south, in which a girl accused to guys of raping her, and I think it was years later, when the lives of the two guys was already ruined, she confessed she lied because she felt like “a whore” after having a threesome with them =/


#1456

As of thursday the democrats are now up to 40 seats gained in the House.

If North Carolina’s 9th congressional district gets a new election, it could go up to 41. Assuming Mark Harris’s voters care that their rep is a fraud. (allegedly)


#1457

Quote: “Cal Fire, the agency investigating the blaze, has not made a determination about its cause.”


#1458

Ah darn.I made a bet guessing how the senate and house would turn out, I was spot on before, I need them to lose like … 5 think. So it went from lower than average to average gains. Then again I might still win depending on how the other people bet.


#1459

Well, if I’m not mistaken, most of the seats who were up for election the past month were mostly owned by Democrats anyway. So, maybe in the 2020 election we’ll see a change in the Senate composition.


#1460

Yeah at the time of the bet the Kavanaugh incident just occurred so I figured that having a lower than average turnout and combined with the fact that dems wee mostly on defending their seats, I believe my exact bet was lose 4 senate seats and gain 35 HR seats.


#1461

I still think “tsunami” is a little bit of an exaggeration, as a political tsunami to me would have been 60+ seats in the house plus control of the senate. For example, the nailbiter US Senate race in Florida would have tipped to the Democrats, staying in their hands in a tsunami. I do agree that the size of the wave is certainly bigger than it first seemed on election night however.