Ironheart - Discussion Thread

Jesus Christ Awesome. You just might pulled me into the betatesting mood and i wasnt in it for for most of past year. I even betatested few COG things but its quite long time since i did and you just pull me back @Wiwyums You asshole :smiley: Where im supposed to get the time for all the things i want to do :slight_smile: ?. Damn.

I must say that Space part is a bit too long Imho. it seems you overcompensated for it being too short. Also check Stats increases in space part i feel some of them dont give stat additions. I would rig some sort of Save system as one of first priorities in this betatest imho.

Way to do the space thing might have Been between Play Prologue and Choosing Summary with Stat Increases. Summary being TLDR on Long Page.

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This is fabulous.

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@DontJudge @FutbolDude21586 Iā€™m definitely going to add an option so players can choose for themselves how the stats are displayed (text/numbers/both).

@Bourbon_neat Thank you! As an aside, I wonder if I should make Tonzo romanceable? He isnā€™t at the moment because later in the story heā€™s apt to change in ways which might conflict with his status as an RO. Still, I could make it work if players really wanted to romance him. But would they? (Heā€™d have no objection, for sure!)

@CaesarCzech Thanks so much! Iā€™m thrilled to have got you back into a betatesting mood and grateful too - Iā€™m still tinkering with the space section and the save system is something Iā€™ll look into right away.

@COGZealot Thank you! :smiley:

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Well, you will have no objection from me either.

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I would hardcore romance Tonzo. Hard. Core.

:no_mouth:

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ok hi Iā€™m adding myself in the Tonzo pileā€¦ would romanceā€¦ would smooch for sure.

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@Wiwyums

Yo Dude Man.
Just out of curiosity but how much are you willing to change the story at this stage?
Since you ask for constructive feedback but if you are at chapter 8 of 10 surely there must be very little that could actually be changed story wise at this point in time.

Or are you beseeching us for reviews of the first part of your story based on its general quality?

Just wondering.

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@Bourbon_neat @Isabella_Taylor @ghostsnwitches Okay, Iā€™m going to make Tonzo an RO. :heart_eyes: He was thrilled when I told him but also wanted me to clarify that he isnā€™t a pipe-and-slippers kind of guyā€¦ He wonā€™t be settling down into a monogamous relationship but if youā€™re okay with that then heā€™s more or less yours for the taking!

@LordNanachi I am a brutal editor of my own work, so much so that I even scare myself at times! Itā€™s not unusual for me to cut more of a chapter than I leave intact. So yes, more or less everything is still up in the air and Iā€™ve already changed quite a few things according to feedback received here. The general premise will stay the same but the details are mutable.

For these first chapters, I guess Iā€™m especially interested in how well the overall mood works. As I was writing, I was conscious of being tugged two ways - on one hand, I love the period and want to make it feel as authentic as I can, but on the other hand, my game has giant robots in it! I know itā€™s possible to hit a sort of swashbuckling mood that can marry the setting and the silliness together, but have I managed it consistently here? Thatā€™s the question that bothers me the most as Iā€™m writing.

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So if he wonā€™t be monogamous, will there be an option for a polygamous relationship with him and someone else? Or is he just a casual, no-strings-attached casanova? @Wiwyums

Well, a little of both, I think. As I began to write RO options for Tonzo, I realised that I just couldnā€™t square the character Iā€™d written for him so far with the behaviour needed for a steady relationship. I donā€™t think heā€™d be capable of committing in that way but equally I think heā€™d be honest about this inability. So what I have currently is this:

Heā€™ll jump at any level of dalliance as he does with more or less anything that moves but if you press for a more conventional relationship heā€™ll give you a little speech advising you not to trust him and warning you that his love is ā€˜too broadā€™ for any one person!

There will be the possibility of including him in a polygamous relationship with certain other ROs who are open to that sort of arrangement. Currently, there is the option of a polygamous relationship with Ygraine and the Cathar twins who are already her lovers (a kind of open secret) so I see no reason why she wouldnā€™t also permit Tonzo to share the fun. The poet Ibn al-Maā€™mun would also be pretty accommodating, I thinkā€¦

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So Ygraine has the Cathar twins as her lovers? Howā€™s that gonna work when we start dating?

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Awesome! Donā€™t be TOO overly ambitious and burn out, but I think poly/open routes with Tonzo and Ygraine/Ibn would be something I would really enjoy!

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Essentially, however you want it to. If she likes you enough to be with you, sheā€™ll happily give up her non-professional relationship with the twins if necessary. It was never a romantic one from either side, purely physical. Sheā€™s been very lonely for many years, a victim of circumstanceā€¦

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Ok cool, so when does she tell us? Before we start dating or something?

Itā€™s good to have more options than idealized regular modern Western-style monogamy.

Which, incidentally, makes me wonder how Islamic polygyny has adapted to a more gender-and-sexuality-equal world?

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@No_This_Is_Patrick Currently, it only becomes an issue to raise with her if youā€™re aware of it and the only way this can happen is if you yourself have a sexual relationship with the Cathars. For players who choose romance only (say early when asked that they arenā€™t interested in sex), it wonā€™t come up at all and for everyone else it would be assumed that she gave up any carnal relations with her aides when she started a relationship.

@Ramidel Funnily enough, this is exactly the issue Iā€™m wrestling with right now. In previous chapters, the only Muslim household youā€™ve seen at close quarters is that of Vivienne and her husband Malik Adil, but he has been happy to defer to her wishes and they live more or less as a 21st century couple, in private at least. The section Iā€™m currently writing sees Caliphate players socialising and setting up their own household so this issue naturally arises. To accommodate all players, the historic polygyny of many Muslim societies of the time will have to have either been overturned or shifted to a broader polygamy which allows the same rights to all (a more interesting approach, in my opinion) and Iā€™m tinkering right now with the details of how this is assumed to have happenedā€¦

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Wait, so sheā€™ll still have them as her lovers when weā€™re dating her and the only way we fund about it is if we have sexual relationship with the Cathars?

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@No_This_Is_Patrick Currently, if you have any relationship with the Cathars, that will always come before youā€™re able to date Ygraine. In other words, if you donā€™t then it will never be mentioned that she has either and it simply wouldnā€™t be a feature of the story. Though I guess thereā€™d be no harm in me raising it regardless.

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Maybe have her tell you that sheā€™s going to end her relationship with the Cathars when you start dating, if you havenā€™t done anything with them. Cause otherwise it will look like sheā€™s seeing them behind your back.

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Well, if Iā€™m not mistaken, the major factor breaking medieval gender norms has been the shift to giant robots as the arm of military power. If thatā€™s fairly recent, you can portray a system in flux where people are figuring out new rules as they go along - some women are effectively taking on the patriarchā€™s role with harems of their own, other people are moving towards favoring monogamy or egalitarian polygamy.

I may be overcomplicating things, though.

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