Guns of Infinity(Continuation)

low-fantasy
gender-locked-male

#9652

Many years ago during my high school days I participated in Model Congress. While there I introduced a constitutional amendment to do away with the electoral college in U.S. Presidential elections and replace it with a popular vote. To me the electoral college looked like a future disaster just waiting to happen, but my peers voted it down. They didn’t see the need to do away with a tradition that appeared to be working fine at the time. Nevertheless, I guarantee you that today that same bill would pass with overwhelming support in today’s model congresses. Often it takes a crisis or disaster to wake people up and motivate them to let go of cherished traditions. Blogia is such a disaster.


#9653

Exactly without a crisis to shake out the traditional prejudice people don’t change. In fact In Greek word crisis meaning growth too


#9654

Hello, I’ve been following this thread for a while now and i finally found a good time to make a contribution to the discussion but…well… I’m Greek and…well…how can i put this delicatelly…the word crisis in Greek translates to “κρίση” and it does not mean growth. If you’re talking about about ancient Greek then i’m not sure.


#9655

@poison_mara

Supposedly the Chinese character for crisis is danger and opportunity. I am not a Chinese speaker so I don’t know for certain but this what I heard. I think this might be a more appropriate metaphor.


#9656

Regarding Wulfram’s charge:

Imagine you’re an enlisted. The Lieutenant-General and Councillor-Militant will be personally leading you and your comrades into battle. This shows that you will play a vital role in the battle, and your commander has the utmost confidence that you will succeed.

Then the Church Hussars arrive. Oh shit. It’s not looking good, but your commander is still here. Maybe he has a plan, or maybe there is actually a chance of success after all.

Nope, he bailed. It’s certain now: you’re going to die.

Imagine how many people would have deserted, or how many would have put up a half-hearted fight (resulting in even more deaths.) Telling someone you intend to charge with them, only to backtrack and order them to go without you, is devastating to both morale and loyalty.


#9657

“General Lee to the rear!”

That is all.


#9658

A post was merged into an existing topic: Politics Thread


#9659

For those unfamiliar.

The summary of the story is: Lee rides to the aid of fellow Confederate general AP Hill during the Battle in the Wilderness, alongside men from John Gregg’s Texas Brigade. He ends up showing up nearly an entire day late, and when he ends up joining the battle, is more or less strongarmed to the rear by the reinforcements he took with him because he insisted on leading the cavalry charge.

Truly a dignifying moment. :unamused:


#9660

Nevermind 21st century militaries, I consider the Confederate military of the Civil War era to be more advanced than Tierra’s, and even still General Lee struggled with the idea that as army leader he was too valuable to risk leading a charge. The Texans may have been wise enough to turn him back, but there were other occasions when no one stood in his way.


#9661

Beyond the merits of his decision of where to place himself in the battle (to which I would say reasonable generals can disagree), I think he made a couple fatal errors for which he can be held responsible.

The first and most basic is assuming away an enemy capability. “The forest is impenetrable to enemy cavalry therefore I will base my plan off this enemy vulnerability.” Was an extremely poor assumption to make and one of which he was so certain of he didn’t attempt to confirm it. I would say that is a generalship 101 level error.

Second was not accounting for the Church Hussars. Another known enemy capability and the enemy CoG. Lacking evidence of their presence and orientation should have started alarm klaxons in most officers heads and especially his.

Third was not having thought through contingencies and succession of command. It’s fine to have faith in your plan, but not doing some basic planning for failures and contingencies (like what happens if I die) is JV.


#9662

I agree with you on every single one of these points, and yet I feel I must point out that he never had an opportunity to take even a ‘generalship 101’ class and that the Tierran army’s institutional memory going into the war was basically non-existent. I’m not excusing him so much as pointing out that he was a product of his culture and time period doing the best he could to figure it all out as he went along. So it’s not surprising that his long string of victories made him overconfident and caused him to underestimate his opponent.


#9663

I vastly prefer the image that Wulfram weighed whether or not the best place was at the head of the cavalry brigade than the image that he was incapable of considering whether or not the army commander belongs at the head of an individual regiment, personally.


#9664

Personally if you ask me, I would say is that, of all his experience that he had known back in his old glory days fighting the Antari at sea, he know that the Antari will stick to their old ways, he know that they are not willing to change their ways of war and the methods they use. As seen in Sabres, the Antari fight in the ways that Wulfram knew when he was a Marine Officer. Besides that, Wulfram is the only general who had achieved such greatest ever since back in the old days of the Montjoy Campaign. And Wulfram’s army if you ask me? They are some of the finest men, led by some of the good commanders, but with a decent military system.


#9665

Perhaps, but I would counter that the school of hard knocks can be as effective a teacher. He certainly didn’t really have any right to be high on a string of spectacular victories imho. I’d agree that the political situation probably made him take more risks than he needed to, but here I’d agree with @Elfwine that he is as accountable for those taken risks as any other officer should be. Overconfidence is a hell of a drug.

In any case, his successes and failures should be instructive to future Tierran officers. Hopefully the politics surrounding his death and defeat will not preclude a critical examination of his career and decision making. Somehow I doubt it though…


#9666

I feel like Wulfram got too cocky, personally, combined with the King’s ultimatum of “victory or go home”. When we interact with him with Cunaris, he is completely and utterly assured of himself, to the point that even after learning of the size of Khorobirit’s army, he’s ecstatic that he gets to “crush the Bear” in decisive battle.

I mean, seeking a decisive engagement can be a good way to win the war. It can also be a good way to lose everything in a single stroke…

He seems like a supremely confident dude, who has reason to be - but in the end, his self-assurance about the forest and what Khorobirit was likely to do, as well as in the abilities of himself as commander and his army, left him vulnerable in the face of what Khorobirit actually did

I’m gonna guess that most people are going to avoid “tarnishing his name” and going against the Saintly Narrative of Duke of Wulfram; his death fits too neatly into Tierra’s cultural ideals of “victory or glorious death”. A few folks will learn, but it’ll be hard going against such an august personage’s heroism and glory in battle.


#9667

If he was super confident in the first place, you will be expecting him to deploy the army in full forces instead of using guerrilla tactics. He wasn’t super confident, but confident enough to believe that his plans can crush the bear.


#9668

Agreed, and I’m certain that had he survived the hard knocking he would have learned from it. Instead it was left to the survivors to learn from his mistakes.

Agreed again. I would say that his string of victories had more to do with the fractiousness of his opponents and the low military value of their untrained serf levies than his own brilliance.

The problem with condemning Wulfram is that it’s not clear that anyone else was necessarily better equipped to lead Tierra’s greatly enlarged army than he. It’s not like Tierra had staff colleges brimming with experienced or at least militarily well-educated generals and field officers. So I tend to see his failures as a symptom of the relatively primitive state of the Tierran military more so than incompetence on his part since a charge of incompetence tends to assume that Tierra actually had a standard of minimum competence for its generals that he failed to reach. He was certainly guilty of overconfidence, but that’s a hard thing to be wary of when you and those around you are unaware of the danger.

I suspect that much of this depends on how wisely the MC uses the small amount of credibility he’s gained during the war to both ensure that critical examination of the decision-making takes place and to influence the king and the Cortes to implement the recommended changes it concludes are necessary. A critical examination of Wulfram’s career would need to be very diplomatically done to avoid serious backlash that could imperil the MC’s efforts however. His son is one of the most powerful men in the realm and wields great influence in the Cortes.


#9669

Remember: that ultimatum only came after Wulfram promised a decisive victory.


#9670

And Tierra desperately needed one. As the nation itself has started to be in debt and bankruptcy, if the war drags on, things will get worst.


#9671

Surprisingly that was the first one I got. I just fumbled my way into victory after large amounts of trial and error. So in essence, every CoG I’ve ever played.