Well, I think we’re good, because I won’t ask if you’re fungus.
And thank you for the offer. We both are very committed to including an asexual MC that is well-written and isn’t locked out of anything, and I already intended to include a few different options in that area–where an asexual MC can avoid sex or touching altogether if they want, or they choose to have sex with their RO, with the RO understanding up front that it isn’t their thing and it’s being done because they want to please the RO and they would discuss it afterwards (though I was afraid of doing that in case someone got upset, but I figure if the MC initiates it, then it may be acceptable?).
When we get enough of the game put together, you will definitely hear from me. It may be a few months, so don’t be surprised if you get a message out of the blue!
In the meantime, please keep in mind that some asexuals actually do enjoy sex - we do have all the nerve endings in the right places, after all. We just don’t experience attraction to other people.
Also, please consider the existence of demisexuals, who are considered part of the asexual spectrum. Demisexuals can very much want to have sex with someone, but there needs to be a strong emotional connection before they experience attraction. (This is not the same as choosing to get to know someone you’re attracted to before taking the relationship to the next level - for the demisexual, the idea of wanting to get to know someone because you find them physically appealing is just … bizarre.)
I don’t expect any one game to include every possible nuance of asexual experience, of course. But the more you know to start with, the better you can decide what options you do want to make available.
I have a bit of advice myself. This is gonna be long since I’m a huge chatterbox, but I hope it’s helpful.
Several authors I’ve noticed seem to be struggling with whether to make the ROs just willing to forgo sex, or to make that a dealbreaker because some people are like that irl. I get where they’re coming from even if the latter is something I’d rather not deal with in games (had to make the compromise in Choice of Rebels). Naturally everyone has different opinions on this. I think it’s perfectly fine to write about that sort of thing without personal experience but it’s also a pretty common source of trauma within the community, so you REALLY need to know what you’re doing (agreeing to have sex anyway for your partner’s sake can still be an option regardless though, just not mandatory if you don’t want the drama). And honestly, it rarely adds to the characters in the eyes of the viewer. The character’s desire for sex may look really important to the author who has all sorts of ideas about the character that may not be touched upon in text (and that’s good, it gives ideas for later and can still make what we do see more consistent), but will the viewer’s perception of the character really change much if they don’t mind not having sex?
Breden from Choice of Rebels is the example I mentioned earlier. The subject of her wanting sex and not liking a sexless relationship was perfectly realistic, but it added nothing to her character. She wouldn’t have changed at all. So any of us asexual who like her have to feel uncomfortable for no real reason. It’s like every outgoing, rebellious, spunky RO has to want sex more than average when it’s touched upon. I don’t get it.
Also, as @AletheiaKnights said, including more types of asexuality is generally good. In addition to what they stated, it should be noted that aromanticism actually exists independently of asexuality. Someone may feel sexual attraction but not romantic. For that kind of representation, best to talk to an aromantic person. They have their own community.
Another thing is that while ace people CAN enjoy sex, they can also really hate it. Sometimes I feel that in trying to make people aware of the former, the community neglect those like me who actually do find sex really gross and off-putting. It’s funny because I’m Gray Ace, meaning sexual attraction is not entirely absent, but isn’t enough that I can really call myself allosexual (someone who isn’t ace). The two can go hand in hand.
As for all the different parts of the ace spectrum, it’s worth noting that all orientations exist on a spectrum. The Allosexual Spectrum has more than just what we usually think of when we think straight, bi, pan, and gay. Someone can be attracted to both sexes, but prefer one, for example. Some still choose to id as bi; some just go with gay or straight. There’re other, smaller communities too. and then there’s gray ace people, who overlap between the ace and allo spectra. the Romantic and Aromantic spectra are the same. Sexual orientations are really complicated, so there’s no way to include every single variation. So don’t beat yourself up if you miss some. Sometimes people will just pick the one that fits best.
That DOES still mean there should be more than one type of asexual though. Asexuality is a whole spectrum. Having only one ace orientation would be like if every allosexual character had to be bi because that’s the only option. Not bad necessarily, but it doesn’t quite feel right if you aren’t bi. It’s the same for us. I don’t necessarily expect every type of asexuality there is, but an option to find people attractive, but not have sex with them.
@AletheiaKnights It’s funny, because when I first heard about things like fungi and bacteria reproducing asexually, I was like “that’s dope! Why can’t we do that?”
I get that part. It’s how to write it that I worry about, so it fits the character well.
I did not know that demisexuals were considered part of the asexual spectrum, so thank you for sharing that. I am actually comfortable writing that already (I have a couple of characters who are demi), so that’s a start!
Exactly, which is why I am trying to get as much info as possible before working out the details (at which point, I will definitely need some input from you and anyone else interested in it).
Oh, I definitely meant for it to be a choice, not mandatory. We do have one RO who is very much about sex, but he’s part of a poly, so the MC not having sex with him isn’t an issue as long as they are emotionally intimate. And the other part of the poly is fine with no sex, too, as long as she has emotional intimacy and a bit of touching (not sexual, but holding hands, hugging, snuggling if possible). But those two will be having sex with each other, so the MC has to be cool with that–and they will make sure the MC knows they love them, because it’s a true triad.
The four other ROs (the poly is considered a single one because they are a package deal)… well, one is sex-crazed and doesn’t get love at all until the MC comes along and steals his heart. The others… they’re fine with no sex, but one is touch-starved. Another one of them is fine with no touching at all.
Yeah, I’ve noticed that, too. And they are, more often than not, players.
Thanks. I think, in my head, I assumed that someone who was aro was automatically asexual. I’m not sure how that will work with the ROs we’ve got, except for one who the MC can have a fbuddy relationship with–provided they state it up front that that’s all they want and have no intention on going back on it. There’s another… NPC in the party… who is not a RO at all, but the MC can have sex with her–once. If they think they can survive it…
Those two are pretty much the only options for someone aro. But friendships are there, so there’s that.
That option will be there. I think my main concern with all of this is writing the “auto’d” text in a way that fits the MC. Like, basically what we had in mind was having variables for romantic and sexual preferences and try (we may be biting off more than we can chew!) to flavor the text to match it.
One thing I’ve seen in a lot of IFs is that the MC is constantly thinking like they’re horny, drooling over every possible RO and describing them like they want to jump them right then and there. While that’s fine for some MCs, I don’t think it should be the default, especially if the MC is asexual or demisexual. So for the latter two, instead of introducing a possible RO as “jaw-droppingly sexy, with raven black hair and muscles that tested the strength of the seams on his tight, button-up shirt” it would be a less “drooling” description like, “with raven black hair, the man was quite muscular.” That kind of thing, in addition how to handle the romances themselves, obviously.
Of course, I’m the type who’s always taken issue with choices defining my MC’s personality–we intend to let the player set that up front and use it for flavor text and any autoing that must be done, leaving the significant choices and such as options that do not affect personality stats. That way, the foundation of the MC’s personality can be defined at the start, without having to worry that the “wrong” choices will suddenly turn a stoic character into Mary Poppins.
And don’t worry about being a chatterbox @comradelenin I appreciate that you took the time to share! And I found it very helpful!
@LiliArch Exactly what @AletheiaKnights said. That and I don’t particularly care for being told what my MC finds sexy or jaw-droppingly hot, because one person’s sexy is another person’s turnoff (example, some people like very feminine and dainty men–I don’t, and a lot of my MCs don’t, so being told that someone like that is sexy if my MC feels otherwise makes it difficult to RP and stay immersed).
Usually, that kind of thing doesn’t actually mean that the person is literally wearing an ill-fitting shirt. It’s meant to indicate that the viewpoint character is admiring the person’s physique.
I strongly recommend you revisit this thread. There’s some good stuff in it, including a post I’m rather proud of about the phenomena of primary and secondary sexual attraction.
Thanks for that link. Reading through it, I realize we were already going for one of these things: queerplatonic relationship (committed, more than friendship, but asexual and aromantic) and I’m hoping this applies to both same sex and opposite sex relationships of this sort. We wanted to have something that was more than friendship and committed, but we weren’t sure what to call it, so that helped already.
Interesting. For the last bit, are we talking some kind of monster or are they like one of those Asari from Mass Effect that kill during sex?
The one thing I will note (this is secondhand knowledge mind), is that aromantic relationships can still be deep and intimate rather than casual. Some even marry their partners. It’s just a platonic relationship rather than a romantic one. I honestly don’t know how the community views things like hookups, I don’t see it talked about much. I’m not really sure if any of this fits any of the characters, but info is info.
So, I’m not entirely sure what “auto’d” means in this context. I’d probably need examples to help with that. I do agree about the choices defining personality. I get the idea in theory, but writers just can’t predict every player’s rationale behind the various choices.
