I believe things such as sexual assault/abuse or descriptive scenes of violence/gore should definitely be listed as trigger warnings due to them being extremely triggering and can be troubling for readers if they are not warned prior to reading. However the rating system should also be an indicator for readers and what they should expect to find in stories.
how did i notā¦hnnngā¦see that??? iām gonna blame my post-test brain and bow out from the convo until my brain cells recuperate, lol
1 Like
The main obstacle would be stubborn authors who see no reason to add tws/change anything etc.
I mean, we had authors, on cog and hg alike, that have been told by multiple people that something is a no-go, and they just got pissy about it and/or ignored it. And/or went on to whine to their stans about things.
So, addressing the elephant in the room: what to do with authors that mock tws/etc in this way
4 Likes
Can anyone explain what these stand for? Google search gave varied resultsā¦
1 Like
TW = trigger warning. CW = content warning.
3 Likes
Thank you for explaining.
Dunno about TW, but content warning always should be there. For very simple example: violence and erotic thingy that meant for adults. And they should be put in WIPs description or starting page. At least thatās my take on it. I bet there are plenty under age people reading these stories in the end.
1 Like
Does both TW/CW have different meaning?
This is the first time I see the word ācontent warning,ā at least consciously aware.
1 Like
Theyāre often used in pretty much the same way and their definitions are samey enough that itās fine to use them interchangeably, but I believe some also think of it likeā¦ ācontent warningā is for something less harmful than a straight up trigger or could be used more broadly.
Like, content warning could just be āmentions of past abuseā and mean that itās not very indepth or bad but could be reason to be wary, depending on the individual.
and a trigger warning is more detailed and could be ādiscussions or depictions of childhood sexual abuseā which means it, as it is in the media being warned about, is probably enough to be triggering.
I donāt know, Iām sure thatās an imperfect example, but I might not have the brainpower at this hour to trust myself explaining. As I said, theyāre generally used the same way anyway.
2 Likes
Readers could, like I said before, choose to stop reading an authorās work, refuse to buy it and any future works from them, and possibly tell their friends to not support said author.
Forum goers could probably flag an authorās posts if they refuse to add TWs but donāt deride the people who brought it up, but I can see this met with varying success based on the topic/content involved. If an author went so far as to say that someoneās concerns are invalid, then I can see that particular post being easily flagged and possibly removed.
The biggest punishment would be if either of the brand labels refuses to publish a work because of how the author reacted to these suggestions (i.e. dismissing people as overreacting or being trigger happy, etc.) which would reflect negatively on the company itself.
Unfortunately, thereās not much that can effectively be done to punish that behavior (mocking TWs) in the moment. In the future, yes, the IF could be refused publication by the labels or the author could get a bad reputation that affects their bottom line.
Do you have any ideas Penguin?
Iām all in favor for adding warnings to games. Personally though, I prefer adding them at the start of a chapter rather than just at the start of a game. That way, people who need these warnings donāt have to constantly be on the lookout for troubling content and can just relax and enjoy the story during the safe chapters while still being informed that, watch out, potentially triggering content is in this specific chapter. I imagine that would be less stressful.
But really, wherever you put them, I think theyāre worth adding. Itās a small bit of effort for authors, but it can make a big difference for readers. The pros easily outweigh the cons, in my opinion.
Iām really not sure what COG could do though. Maybe they could add an extra line on the purchase/about page, but that brings about its own problems as well. What if people donāt read it? What if they do read it and decide not to get the game because of it, when the way this content is included in the game might not have been a deal breaker for that person? For example, they canāt play through a violent scene but they can stomach it being mentioned in an NPCās backstory if properly warned? Everyone does experience these things differently and just as people interpret wordcount differently (high wordcount = long game versus branchy game) I think people might interpret trigger warnings differently as well.
I donāt know if thereās much that can be done about them. I mean, if they straight up mock and insult people for asking about these things on the forum, I imagine staff would deal with that. But if they just refuse to add them, I donāt think thereās much anyone can do about it aside from not supporting the project, right? I see plenty of people not supporting genderlocked games, and I do believe that thatās a reason why so many HGās have gender options even though itās not mandatory.
Writing these games takes a huge amount of time and effort, so I imagine if an author realizes their stubbornness is going to cost them a huge chunk of their potential audience, theyāll be more willing to rethink their choices. Unless theyāre so stubborn that theyād rather see their game do worse than accomodate their audience, in which case, I really donāt know how youād get through to those people.
2 Likes
The main ideas have been listed:
wikified overview of tw/cw
warnings before you buy it/proceed into the demo
warnings in the about.
as for authors refusing to tag stuff/change things:
Thatās a tricky question as said. I could name three from atop of my head who are unwilling to do either.
CoG could of course refuse to publish somethingā¦ thoughā¦ on might argue games like OS getting published after what happened during beta shows andā¦ unwillingness?
2 Likes
Oops. Sorry I wasnāt specific with my question! 
I was asking if you had any ideas about solutions to the authors refusing to tag stuff scenario, but you already beat me to the punch! 
But yes, the biggest punch would be either brand label refusing to publish an authorās IF, compared to other possible solutions (flagging, adding in content tags to the thread, etc.).
Also, I believe that both MadMinnie and impeccably-stressed touched on some good points regarding what could happen after the TWs are added (people donāt read them, mainly).
There is a difference between asking an author to list tw/cw within the introductory post of a WiP and demanding they do so.
As a community, we must not do the latter.
Making demands on an author is the prerogative of CoG and they have made clear what they are demanding of the author already.
If you wish to ask CoG to start demanding such cw/tw, then you need to not only answer the question, why but answer the question of enforcement when going to Rachel or Jason.
Community enforcement is not going to cut it - the community does not (nor should it) have the power to close a WiP thread. This means the most that can be done is to flag the author and bring in moderation. At this point in time, I do not think this is a realistic ask. The moderators are extremely busy as it is taking care of everything they are doing now.
A Leader should not have the power to close a WiP, except at the request of the author or admin staff because the Work in question is under the authorās control and the thread is there for the authorās use. If a Leader does close a WiP thread then it would still need to be reviewed by a moderator, defeating the Leaderās prerogative in the first place.
This then leads to suggesting to the author a cw/tw section or format.
If the community is going to be doing this, such suggestions should be done so the author is shown how to do so, not just told to do so. What I suggest doing, is copy-pasting an example (such as @Dae-kalina 's wonderfully done listing) and then discussing in your ask, what the author can do to customize such a list for their work.
At that point, the community needs to respect the authorās decision to follow through or not.
As an individual, you can avoid that WiP in the future if the author does not include tw/cw but that is the most that should be done.
Honey attracts more than vinegar but even the hungriest bear will not always eat the honey offered it. At the point of refusal, only the refusal of you, the individual to read that WiP is left available to pursue.
I think this thread has progressed as far as it could, with perhaps, coming up with an agreed format to present to authors when making a suggestion for cw/tw.
Thoughts, @Gower?
6 Likes
I want to list TWs in my game, especially since 16+ young adults might be interested and read it. Not to warn people away from the game, but to prepare them for difficult topics. The first place I thought to put the TWs is the stats screen, like as a *choice. The player could see it was there and use it as a reference. Now that Iāve read this thread, Iām wondering if I should keep it there, or do you think I should put it as one of the first screens? On the plus side, the player would definitely see it. On the minus, the player would only see it once.
1 Like
Why not do both? Folks who donāt care about content warnings will just have to click through the first page once (not a big deal, imo), and can then ignore the stats screen tab. Folks who do care will see your warnings up front (which is useful; I have absolutely not started games because of listed CWs, and feel better for it), but can also refer back to them (also useful! My willingness to read about certain triggers isnāt constant over time, and I might not remember the exact warnings if Iām coming back midway into a story!).
It would be more work, but you could also make the stats screen tab more detailed? Like, e.g., the same general warning from the front, and then also add chapter-specific warnings as someone mentioned upthread.
2 Likes
Thatās true! Both is an option. I would be happy to do chapter specific warnings as well. Thatās real easy.
2 Likes
Obviously I wasnāt referring to WIPs, that should fall entirely on the authors responsibility. What I meant is, since the CoG staff reads through all CoG and HG before they are published, they have the chance to see if there is some of the most general triggering content, like, animal abuse, gore, sexual violence, etc etc. And then, tell the author to put trigger warnings at the beginning of the story.
Brings us back to the topic of:
What if the author refuses. Like, what if they say TWs would be spoilers or ruin their vision?
The only way to solve that case I can think of would either be not to publish things or more work for the staff as theyād have to put the things in.
2 Likes
I think that if the author refuses to put TW themselves then it should fall upon the mods/staff to put them up themselves. It kind of feels like a responsibility to be open and honest about what the consumer is agreeing to when buying the product.
If you have the knowledge that there is something that will likely trigger you prior to your purchase, it helps you to make an informed decision on whether or not this is something for you.
1 Like
Then in that situation, thereās nothing that the audience/readers can do. Itās unfortunate, but like Eiwynn said thereās not much more that we, as readers/consumers, can do if the author decides to dig in their feet.
So basically, thereās not much to discuss, much less implemented, on that particular angle since we, as a community, canāt make them include the TWs/CWs. Sure, we can boycott the authorās work and hope the author caves to peer pressure, but thatās about it.
Hereās what I have to say about putting the responsibility on the staff to reinforce TWs/CWs:
I donāt think it should be their responsibility to enforce this rule as a publishing standard since it puts them into the perilous position to judge what experiences/traumas/etc. are valid to warrant a trigger or content warning if they fall beyond the scope of the obvious (gore, sex, violence, profanity, abuse, drug use, etc.).
Iāll shut up now because Iām talking myself in circles.
6 Likes