I’ll admit that one cracked me up xD. Still though we won’t get stronger because of the power of friendship nor if we yell loudly. I’m afraid no anime cliche will save us here.
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Really, it’s a matter of luck and how quick you can think on the day. There have been loads of underdog victories throughout history. The Battle of Thermopylae is famous for this very reason, even though the victory was a tad bit Pyrrhic (very much so if we’re counting that battle alone, but my point stands).
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Joking aside, there are always unforeseen events too. I have great confidence in @Havenstone’s ability to pleasantly, or possibly unpleasantly, surprise us.
The defeat of the Spanish Armada in the late 1500s comes to mind as well - environment, unique skills, all very key in directing the tides of battle.
Thermopylae was the comparison I’d hope to avoid. The Spartans, the brave three hundred all died. Plus they did not fight demons or mages. They fought men. Not only that the Spartans only held for a little over two days. And that was with incredible natural defences. Our defensive measures are much worse.
The only reason it was considered a victory was because they had bought time for the rest of Greece to unite.
What I think would be a more apt comparison would be the forty Russians holding a single building in Stalingrad against the German army. That will be the rebels if all goes well.
Said the Vietnamese to each other about the French and Americans, or the Spanish about the French, or the Dutch about the Spanish, or the Afghans about everyone…
An insurgency doesn’t really need victory it just needs to persist. You have time, terrain and several possible safehavens on your rebellion’s side.
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Well…not really. You see the elderly and the children won’t be able to keep up with our flight from place to place. So if I were to send them away and they die or leave them behind and they die then all of this is for naught.
I guess that’s the advantage of having only 47 bandits…
Could I expand that list? The Vietnamese said to each other about the Chinese, The Iberian Peninsula about the Romans, the Hungarians and the Polish to the Mongols (Mamlukes don’t count because they won the pitched battle)…
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They could be used in any number of ways and we are talking about helot children and elderly (50s?) that have been on the move with a band of outlaws in an untamed wilderness for a year. They’ll be 'ight, there lives literally depend on it.
First a general comment:
@ Havenstone makes a good point about Calea not necessarily recognizing the worth of her cousin due to their formative years and not having a romance. As for a helot/Calea romance but I do like the idea of Calea being a rebel at heart as well, lashing out in ways she can get away with. I pity the poor helot caught up in it, of course…but in a more healthy society, Calea could still have been a ‘rebel’.
And if viewed through that light, I can even see Calea have great respect for someone rising above a system designed to keep them down…even someone like her. Or, she would just be pragmatic enough to figure the helot rebel would win, and wants to attach her sails to the winning side. Calea is nothing if not practical.
I figure the player would only be able to get by with it once or twice before the Hegemony closed up their security holes. Of course, it is also fair to assume previous rebellions did the same thing in the past, and current day precautions would take that into account.
@Lt Riply
[spoiler]
It is possible to raid the Alastor garrison successfully, but you either have to be combat heavy (Combat 2) or practice Theurgy. And if you practice Theurgy, your best bet is to get Linos to anoint you, though I think you can do it if you are sufficiently devout and have Bredan on your side.
By the way, I don’t mean to sound like I’m gaming the system, but I like playing to see what different choices can make 
For one part of the armed supporters, I believe either your Nationalism or Cosmpolitan rating needs to be over 75%. There are some key questions here:
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When Bredan asks what torques you off about the Hegemony, picking subjugation of Shayard is for national supporters, while the class divide for Cosmpolitan has the biggest effect.
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The next choice is who your second-in-command is. Choosing Bredan helps with National, while Zvad for Cosmopolitan. Note that it is possible to have Bredan, and still get a high Cosmoplitan rating or Zvad and have a high National rating. You may have to consider this since, if you go in for smuggling, Alaina won’t have much to do with you if you pick Bredan as your second in command, and you don’t have enough Intellect or Charisma.
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Choose which language you speak in. This seems to have a bigger effect on my games than number 2. Koine is good for a cosmopolitan route, otherwise go with Shayarden.
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Speaking with Horion, and he asks what you see for your rebellion. Choosing “any nation which will follow me” will aid your Cosmopolitan rating, while Free Shayard is good for nationalistic.
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Note that some of the minor background choices can influence things by a point or two, but I haven’t gone to far into each of them.
As for getting the religious armed supporters, when the second choice arises as to what you dislike the Corruption of the Church makes good choice there. From there, I make sure not to raid the Xaos, invite the Diakon, and get made Eclect. Note: it is possible to declare yourself Eclect, though with a lower Charisma you may need to be on good terms with Bredan. Also note that if you go full on Thuerge, you will be painted as a Goete, though you still might get some cred as a disbeliever. You just won’t get anyone to follow the path of Kenon.
As for my Anarchy level: For my current playthrough, I have it around 16 before the events with Hector. With this, I’m still able to get de Firiac on my side (if you go too high, or slay nobles indiscriminately, you go the Kala/Kalt route).
Just beating the Alastors raise Anarchy by 7 points…which makes sense since you are essentially showing the ‘cops’ as it were are powerless. However, it will increase your arms by 40 if you win that fight, a nice boost to things.[/spoiler]
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@Lys - you might want to include spoiler tags on the spoiley stuff. Ptherwise I love your breakdown. A job well done.
[quote=“Lys, post:3796, topic:1601, full:true”]
First a general comment:
@ Havenstone makes a good point about Calea not necessarily recognizing the worth of her cousin due to their formative years and not having a romance. As for a helot/Calea romance but I do like the idea of Calea being a rebel at heart as well, lashing out in ways she can get away with. I pity the poor helot caught up in it, of course…but in a more healthy society, Calea could still have been a ‘rebel’.
And if viewed through that light, I can even see Calea have great respect for someone rising above a system designed to keep them down…even someone like her. [/quote]
I have a hard time seeing Calea rebel against anything aside from Xthonos’s chastity rules, and she’s already ignoring those. Any seeming act of rebellion on her part would be carefully orchestrated to obtain some goal of hers, a product of calculation. She wouldn’t truly be rebelling, simply using the rebellion as a front to achieve her desires.
I have an even harder time seeing her respect a helot than she does her cousin. They’re not even really people to her. This is the woman who has her helot lovers gruesomely executed after she tires of them. It could be because she doesn’t want anyone else to have them afterward, and/or maybe she has some submission fantasies that scare the living crap out of her and destroying her lovers is a way to maintain control of her own dangerous feelings, and/or maybe she’s simply a cruel sadist who enjoys the thought of her lovers being torn apart. Regardless of her motivations, she has her helot lovers destroyed instead of simply putting them back on the shelf once she’s had her way with them. And that isn’t exactly a sign of respect. When it comes to helots, she’s like a black widow spider.
Agreed.
Nice guide at the end there btw.
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What about the Winter War, then? Finns on skiis versus tanks?
@Zolataya
Normally I wouldn’t be to concerned by spoilers on what is essentially old content in a game thread (the new content I definitely would put in spoilers).
However, I will agree some people might still not have explored those routes, so the tag is added. 
@PTigras.
Being a rebel at heart wouldn’t necessarily mean she is going to flout the current system to much; she would have to much to lose otherwise. Of course, I have no problem with her flouting the rules just to show she can. We don’t need to get into how many people in the real world do things because they have wealth or power to shield them from their consequences. It just can be fun to consider alternative motivations for a character, at least until the author puts something definitively down.
And I agreed she wouldn’t have much regard for helots by and large. However, I still stand by the thought she could learn to respect a helot. However, this wouldn’t be from a petty initial rebellious act, but someone by who’s actions and power she couldn’t ignore…especially if it is someone she can’t bring down. For Baldur’s Gate II fans, I basically picture her like Viconia in this regard. She has no problem with seeing someone slain, especially for her amusement…but someone who proves their strength might win her regard/affection.
Of course, Xthonos help the person who fell in Calea’s eyes 
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Likely this and in the case of a Helot rebellion it would apply to 99% of all noble “supporters”.
Of course she’s welcome to support the rebellion and the resulting government since the resulting “unity government” (or whatever the hell that thing is called) should only be in place for a couple of months at most (just enough to lull most of my mc’s enemies into a false sense of security) before the real revolution begins.
If my mc is powerful enough, or in a significantly advantageous position at the moment the Thaumatarchy is overthrown it likely won’t even be established at all and will merely remain a hollow promise.
Any surviving Keriatou’s will also be fairly high on my mc’s personal priority list and that’s only if they can provide a damned good reason why he shouldn’t kill them right away.
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[quote]Likely this and in the case of a Helot rebellion it would apply to 99% of all noble “supporters”.
Of course she’s welcome to support the rebellion and the resulting government since the resulting “unity government” (or whatever the hell that thing is called) should only be in place for a couple of months at most (just enough to lull most of my mc’s enemies into a false sense of security) before the real revolution begins.[/quote]
My helot MC is very much on board with this. While they prefer to keep anarchy as low as possible, they also realize that if the Thaumaturchy is defeated, they certainly aren’t going back to all the pre-Karagon old ways.
Which will make a very interesting discussion with Suzane de Firiac who might assume the nobles will keep all their prestige and power with no hiccups.
Heh, the way I do most of my characters, the Keriatou would have to be very persuasive to show they are worth more than being target practice.
Yep, though it’s Simon for me and while my mc likes the boy his first love is still his vision for the future.
That’s virtually impossible anyway due to the Xthonic caste system. The closest one might come as @P_Tigras has already pointed out is that most of the former Helots become day labourer wage-slaves who are only technically “free” and that’s the very best case, unless you break the caste system and the power of the nobility, serf or worse is a much more likely fate to befall the (former) Helots.
Totally agree the ideas of Evil Gandhi are far worse than Karagon ones. Gandhi would ending with a Maohist system With a High ruthless Aristocratic in place of the communist party
For my mc it would ideally be an intermediate phase as he does genuinely intend to eventually transform the Karagond Hegemonic mess into a more free and representative society, it’s just that the system is unfortunately such a mess that it currently must be rebuild from the ground up and that’s likely to require my mc to act as the “Chairman” and the party and government as his tools in the interim. The lengthened lifespan of a truly great mage should make such a thing just barely possible.
@Bagelthief
Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t the Finnish lose that war? If Finnish conduct on that war made the Soviets settle for a small piece of land north of St. Petersburg (Leningrad), instead of annexing the entirety of Finland then I suppose it could count as a victory of sorts.
Do you have a guide on gaining more followers when choosing to do nothing during the Harrowing? I’ve only gotten to 74 cosmopolitanism in my most min-maxed playthrough in the above route to date (as a skeptic, cosmopolitan aristocrat with 0 CHA).
Technically it was a loss but the damage they did was absolutely astounding. Look it up. Incredible.