Allusive's Reviews (Another Review - Psy High 2)

Ah, the teenage years, when so much seems important and dramatic that we later learn, with more experience, was just…not that big a deal.

I’m trying to spill! I just have to get through them first.

It’s funny (not really) that I can breeze through these titles like Psy High and Slammed! in a day or a few hours, and I’ve got two Hosted Games I’m reading that I’ve been reading for like, two weeks. But I just run into so many grammatical errors, plotting issues, terrible pacing, wrong pronoun usage, etc. that I read a few hundred words, or a thousand or two thousand words, and I just start getting restless. Like, “Hmm. I should really renew my car tags today.” or “You know what? Why don’t I get in some more writing time on my own game?”

Sometimes I just look from the screen with the Hosted Game on it to the Kurt Vonnegut novels on my desk and silently wonder what I’m doing to myself.

But I also know, that objectively, I’m doing a better service by reviewing the worse titles. They are the ones where the author needs more feedback, where the audience needs more warning, and where the reviews are, frankly, likely to be more fun for people to read.

But until then, I have to take deep breaths and wonder how much of a quarter of a million words is in a single playthrough and hope it’s not too many. :melting_face:

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On one hand I agree, on the other I detest this notion because I remember how much it hurt kid me to have adults tell me the things that were Big And Important were in fact not very important, because they were to me.

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Yeah, that’s the dichotomy of being young. It feels so insulting as a kid when the adults tell you it’s not important in the long run, because you’re right, it is important to you as a kid at the time. But when you get older, you really do look back and go, “Wow. I obsessed over that for weeks / months, and it didn’t truly matter at all in the grand scheme of things.”

Or just realizing how much of the issues and drama among kids and teens is just the pure lack of empathy or understanding they have because they don’t have the life experience to be truly empathetic.

One of my favorite mini-genres from Japanese anime is the older person, like 30s-40s, who somehow through mental time travel or drugs or magic is a kid and has to attend school again, and they navigate it all over again with extra maturity and empathy. Like someone is mean to them or bullies them, and their first instinct is to be worried about what the kid is going through to make them like that.

But no generation listens to the last one and the tradition of being told stuff as kids, thinking the older person is rude and out of their mind, then getting old yourself, realizing it was right, and trying to spare the next generation the pain, only to get told you are rude and out of your mind, is just going to continue forever. I think we do it though because there is always the chance one kid will listen and we’d feel bad if we didn’t try.

It’s really the heart of the “It gets better” outreach.

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It’s been discussed before in another thread, but this is just part of the style a lot of earlier CoGs were written in. Earlier games used to have a lot of moments where the voice of the narrator comes through and almost seems to address you and you choices directly as a player, as opposed to just narrating the consequences of what happens to your character. For example, in Choice of Broadsides, one of the first choices is about whether your character is a man or a woman, and the choices read something like “of course I’m a man/woman. [other gender] has no place seeing the horrors of war,” or something like that, to which the narrator responds “I quite agree.” Choice of the Dragon also has a lot of examples of that sort of independent narrator that addresses you directly.

I get why it’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but personally I miss when games used to do things like that. Those little moments were a big part of what got me hooked on these games. They added so much personality and connection to the games that I feel is lacking now. Nowadays when games try to do something like this, it’s usually in the form of personality stats influencing the narration/flavor text you get, which is fine, but not nearly as appealing to me. I get why some people prefer it, because it provides a more seamless, immersive experience that blends perfectly with the character you’re playing, but (to me) games that have a narrator with their own voice and quirks are so much more charming because they almost feel like another character in the story that will comment on my character’s actions with their own point of view.

I get why you felt judged with the “alright then,” but when I read Psy High, I did really appreciate it. It felt like in DnD when your DM lays out an obvious plot hook that you choose not to engage with, so they don’t force you to, but there’s nothing else for them to say besides “alright then.”

That’s just my two cents though, great review as always, I just wanted to talk about how much I miss the old CoG style.

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You might like The Ghost and the Golem - the narrator there feels like a proper character in a similar way to those older titles, and feels very fairytale in tone.

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I think it depends on the story whether or not it works. An author can definitely have a narrative voice in a work, but I also feel it needs to be consistent.

Most of Psy High is written very clearly from the character’s perspective as the narrator, so moments like these feel 4th wall breaking. That was actually my issue with it, that it happened so often it drew attention to itself.

Oh, that’s exactly what it felt like to me, and part of what annoyed me about it being 4th wall breaking. It definitely felt exactly like that moment you describe in DnD—I played a LOT of DnD in middle and high school. In fact, the wrestling friend I talked about in the Slammed! review? That’s why me and the other friend were at his house all the time. His other great love was DnD and as soon as wrestling went off, we’d be rolling dice until the early a.m.!

Anyway, that’s why I said it felt judgemental with that phrasing. Like, “Okay, I had a big scene planned here, but you’re not engaging with it, so ‘alright then’ we’ll move on.”

I much prefer the method more Choicescript writers use these days where they try to keep everything seamlessly contained in the narrative and viewpoint they’ve chosen. My group’s DM was actually great about this. We were a heavy roleplay group who would sometimes play for hours with only a couple of fights, most of what we did was roleplay, and he just seamlessly made everything flow and work like he’d meticulously planned the divergences we forced on him.

I don’t mean to imply Rebecca Slitt was being rude with the way she did it, I know that wasn’t the intention, it’s just I felt it was one of those things that didn’t need to exist. Like, the scenes could have transitioned immediately into the next label, but taking a whole page to just deliver two words to the player felt almost intentionally disapproving. Again, I’m sure it wasn’t meant that way, it’s just the feeling it created in me as the reader. Sort of a “Sigh. You’re missing stuff here, player, but if you insist, we’ll carry on.”

Each time was a little jolt out of the narrative due to inconsistency with the narration style of the rest of Psy High.

But trust me, Psy High is high enough in my good graces I’ll be reading the sequel. It suffers a bit in comparison to a lot of the other amazing Choicescript titles I’ve read lately, but there are other Choicescript titles I’m currently reading through that really make me long to still be reading Psy High. :face_with_bags_under_eyes:

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Hi! Author here :slight_smile: Thank you so much for this thoughtful review! I really appreciate all of your comments, both about the elements you liked and those you didn’t.

I also agree that it would be a very different game if I were writing it today, partly because of the changing norms within Choice of Games titles in general, and partly because I’ve grown and learned over the last decade-plus, so I would now write certain things differently. It’s weird to think of my game as being ‘vintage’ COG, but, here we are!

One addendum, about the students being brainwashed. That actually can happen to some of the people the PC is close to: Andrew/Alison, Carl/a, and Tyler/Taylor can all potentially be brainwashed, if the PC fails badly enough at certain things.

Anyway, I really enjoyed your take on the game, and I appreciate the time you’re giving to all of your reviews! Thanks again!

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Ah, thanks! I do get nervous doing these, since I know the authors can read them. I’m glad you thought it was thoughtful. I do try to rate with the full scale too, so a 6/10 is a positive score. That means I thought it was better than average.

Yeah, it’s always an interesting thing for me reading these, especially when they are ‘vintage’ (lol) CoG. If it’s any consolation, Psy High is actually ahead of its time for the period of time it was published, certainly for when it was written!

I’ll be reading the sequel soon.

Well, that’s interesting to know! I kept waiting for it happen to Carl/a, but it never did. I did relentlessly focus on the investigation and I don’t think I ever failed any checks, so I guess that’s why.

I thought it was funny too, and I realized I didn’t mention it in the review, but I was very unpopular, and slacked off a lot, skipped homework, and cheated, and was a very rebellious student and didn’t notice my Academics kept rising and my GPA kept improving for some reason, though I was undercover in the Blue Crown Club, so that might have been why. But at the prom I got the Academic Scholarship and I was just as surprised as the students and my character. I think I muttered out loud, “Wait. What?” and then laughed when I saw it was pretty much my character’s reaction too.

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Ah, yes, that would do it! It can happen if you try to destroy the Vinculum during the play in Ch 8, but fail really badly. Going undercover in the way that you did means that you had plenty of time to set up your plan, so you would at least get a partial success. Or you may not have tried to destroy it, in which case, that wasn’t a danger.

haha! Yeah, being in the Gold Crown Club gives you a bonus for that. You still must have accidentally done something right, though!

Anyway, thank you again for your thoughtful approach to this review, and all your reviews!

I hope you like Psy High 2! That game also plays with YA tropes, although a different set, and in different ways. I’m looking forward to hearing what you think!

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Psy High 2

by Rebecca Slitt (Word count still unknown. Inquiring minds want to know @ladybird …)

Published Aug. 2019

Psy High 2 is the sequel to (gasp) Psy High 1 where you get to continue your character after high school graduation as they take a job as a camp counselor at a summer camp, Camp Cedarcrest. There you discover a new mystery involving magic and can help determine whether or not the summer camp stays open or gets shut down by land developers.

I have a soft spot in my heart for summer camp fiction, and to me, the setup of Psy High 2 is more intriguing than the first game’s story. Mysterious missing memories, ghost lady in the woods, old objects suddenly turned new, etc. The concept of playing as a camp counselor is also inherently more interesting to me than playing as a high school student, so it had a lot going for it as I went in.

PROS:

:green_book: More interesting choices. The choices in Psy High 2 are generally more interesting than the ones in the first game, in large part thanks to a central conflict that has more layers of complexity. It says something that when I was asked to make a choice on what my goal would be regarding that conflict, I actually had to sit and think for a moment, and even decided to take a break to think on it some more before continuing.

It’s always a good sign when an IF game causes you to take a coffee break to debate with yourself about how to proceed.

You also have to often pick between doing what is best for the kids, the camp, or yourself, and all can be equally attractive paths of action.

:green_book: Lots of callbacks for an imported character. The sequel does a good job of referencing what you did in the first game, even importing your stats straight over unchanged. It remembers your hobbies, your interests, who you were dating, and what you accomplished.

I really did feel like the same character with another year under my belt, even if that may have caused some issues for the author to deal with…but more on that in a minute.

:green_book: Still one of the best CoG games with regards to power use. A lot of IF games that give the player powers seem terrified to let the player actually use those powers, but in Psy High 2, it’s a rare choice block that doesn’t have the option to choose, “I’m going to use my powers for this, please and thank you.”

Still, there was a notable difference in the sequel versus the first game, where I think at times I could almost see Rebecca Slitt sitting there as the author going, “Oh, no. The player has powers.”

CONS:

:closed_book: Inconsistent powers compared to the first game. So, getting back on how importing a character might cause some issues for the author…there are a lot of ways your character could have ended things in Psy High, and where that would leave them ability-wise. I can’t even imagine what this must have been like trying to balance here in the sequel.

For instance, my character, Maria, was a very selfish, very magic obsessed, and very driven student in the first game. I took every opportunity to make myself more powerful. I broke the Fairmath value of the Magic stat. I had a 96% value in Magic, which for Fairmath is just nuts.

Maria ended that first game as a sort of omniscient clairvoyant telepathic mini-god, able to see what was happening in the whole school at once, browse thoughts like reading street signs, and even protect her thoughts into other people’s heads.

I’m pretty sure you could also finish the first game with no powers.

So that’s the situation Slitt found herself in while writing Psy High 2. To me, it felt, in Dungeons and Dragons terms, that you had just finished a campaign where the DM gave you a +10 Vorpal Sword of God Slaying to fight the big bad boss. You then brought that sword to the next campaign, got the first minor threat put in front of you by the DM, and said, “I draw that god-killing sword.” Then the DM face-palms.

Only in the case of Psy High 2, the player’s powers are internal, so you can’t do something like take away the metaphorical sword.

Still, Slitt tried a little bit of revisionist manipulation to keep the powers from steam-rolling things. As an example, one of the first tasks at camp is to find an object you have a detailed description of. Now, you’re told you can’t use your clairvoyance to immediately locate it. There is some fairly good explanation given for this, but it still felt strained, especially since the very first use of our powers in the first game was locating an object we had only a description of, and locating it from inside a supply closet, inside a student’s backpack, walking through the hall. And that was with the baby version of our powers.

In another instance we’re told we can’t use our clairvoyance to look at papers inside a container, when we had read papers with our clairvoyance in the first game to cheat, and looked at objects inside containers in the first game too, even examined objects inside other rooms inside locked closets. Again, all with weaker powers.

I’m really sympathetic to Rebecca Slitt’s dilemma with this situation. Essentially, the player has an “I win” button if they ended the first game in the state my character did. Even with attempts to reign it in by the author, she does still allow you to hammer that “I win” button here in the sequel, for better and worse.

It does terrible things to the narrative. You can avoid introducing yourself to or meeting characters just by reading their thoughts. You can look at locations and never set foot inside them. You can spy on the people at the heart of the game’s mystery and never actually talk to any of them but one.

I’m fairly certain, because I nearly did it, that you can solve the mystery and resolve the conflict without ever having a face-to-face with the principal participants in it. I voluntarily had a conversation I could have avoided, and aside from that, I wrapped everything up with a bow without actually engaging with any of the main people involved.

:closed_book: The game might have been better with a new original character. I know I sang the praises of the author for making it seem like a seamless transition of your character from the first game into a new adventure, but I think the game would have been a better game if no character importing was allowed.

It would have made more sense to maybe call it Psy Camp and set the story in the same world as Psy High, but not have any character overlap, making the player take on a new role as a new character, perhaps with their own powers, designed to mesh well with this story, and maybe even an internal or external reason to make the temptation presented by Psy High 2’s mystery a better thematic fit.

There is very little overlap with returning characters as it is, and having a player character who isn’t clairvoyant would’ve enriched the plot. As it stands, the player’s motivation as a character coming in from Psy High with an established relationship and powers gives them very little motivation beyond altruism or selfishness for getting involved with the central mystery going on at the camp.

:closed_book: The mystery solution is presented too quickly. The setup is really intriguing, but I feel like it could have been drawn out more. Out of a six week long camp, the mystery is solved by the end of week one when after minimal investigation a character just lays it all out for you.

I was also asked to make a choice regarding which side of a conflict to side with, when I’d only had the opportunity to talk to one person and the conflict wasn’t even brought up. I wouldn’t have known about the conflicting stances if they weren’t presented as options, basically.

I really wish the mystery would have built and sustained itself for longer, at least until the mid-way point, and if the player had been more instrumental in piecing everything together themself. Instead, you just get the answers handed to you in one or two back-to-back conversations.

:closed_book: The antagonist isn’t very antagonistic. This is a pattern I’ve noticed with both of Rebecca Slitt’s Psy High games—she tends to defang her antagonists by insulating their wrong-doing from any meaningful harm. They violate consent and personal autonomy, sure, but no one seems to truly suffer from their actions.

SPOILERS:

In the first game, the principal literally makes the students he brainwashes into model citizens and helps them improve their grades and get into colleges, then makes sure they can afford to do so, because he also helps them with scholarship applications. He does this against their will, but the fact that many of them continue these learned behaviors voluntarily after the brainwashing is removed shows it wasn’t an awful traumatic experience for them. If magic wasn’t involved, it’s basically like an overbearing mentor figure or parent forcing a kid to buckle down and apply themselves against their wishes.

In the sequel, the White Lady is saving people in a time bubble and being very meticulous and careful about the amount of time she steals from people to accomplish this. On the surface, it sounds horrible, literally draining part of children’s lives away to fuel her magic, only the narrative immediately defangs the harm by mentioning she deliberately only takes 1 hour a night and 6 hours at the end of camp from each camper. That’s 48 hours per summer, or, if a kid attended all the way from 8 years old to 18 every year, less than three weeks from their total lifespan. Again, it’s bad, but it’s not that bad, you know?

Maybe it’s a consequence of her wanting to give the player the option to side with the antagonists, and she doesn’t want to let the player be truly bad, so rather than have morally ambiguous antagonists commit genuinely consequential wrongs that cause real harm, she ends up cushioning their actions in the narratives until objections to them almost become philosophical.

Final verdict:

:orange_book: :orange_book: :orange_book: :orange_book: :orange_book: :orange_book: :open_book: :open_book: :open_book: :open_book: (6/10)

Final verdict, I would still recommend Psy High 2 if you enjoy YA literature, liked the first game, or just enjoy summer camp stories in general.

Rebecca Slitt’s writing style and choices are all very enjoyable, even if I wish the thorns on that rose were sharper.

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I think I’ll check out the first book!

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Thank you for another insightful and thorough review! You are, as before, extremely on point in all of your conclusions.

Here are a few answers to those questions:
Word count: I think Psy High 1 was about 180,000 and Psy High 2 was about 225,000? Which is definitely Vintage COG word count numbers - like, both of those put together would not equal some of the single chapters in some recent/upcoming games! [EDIT: actually, Psy High 2 was 270,000. So, closer to present-day averages, but still nowhere the high end!]

Power differential: yes, you are exactly right about the difficulties of importing a character! When I finished Psy High, I had no intention of writing a sequel. Series were still relatively rare in the COG catalogue, and I had always envisioned the story as a standalone. So I made widely divergent endings, including the overwhelming success that you got as well as the one where you can lose your powers completely (voluntarily or involuntarily), among others. And then I got the idea for a sequel. Oops?

If you’re interested in taking a deeper dive on my decision-making process, this was actually the subject of my NarraScope talk last year: Help! I Accidentally Wrote A Sequel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYV9GRRif3c
(disclaimer: I have not watched this because I hate watching myself on video, so I have no idea what it looks like! But here it is.)

The antagonists: yes, you’re exactly right about the thought process behind them too. I wanted a villain that would seem appealing enough that which side to take wouldn’t be a simple black-or-white choice; bad enough that the PC could also legitimately want to oppose them; but not so awful that it would give the player the option to do really terrible things. This is partly a personal choice about what I was comfortable with writing, and partly an artifact of the evolution of the YA genre. YA books go much harder now than they did in the past, and I think that’s a good thing - young readers are more capable of handling those difficult topics than adults often give them credit for. But I still would not feel comfortable offering the player the opportunity to go really really dark, at least not in a YA game.

You’re also right that it’s far too easy to avoid talking to Josephine - the middle section just got really messy! You will probably be amused at the changelogs in the beta thread, where I had to squash a ton of bugs in which the wrong person was identified as having given the PC the info about the Timeless Circle, or where the PC just never talked to Josephine at all.

But I’m glad that you liked the conflict between Josephine and Felicity! I was really proud of that. It was actually a later addition to the story: in the initial outline, Josephine’s opponent was a different character entirely! But that conflict and that character never really worked, so I scrapped them and came up with the Felicity storyline instead, which made the conflict much more emotionally interesting, and gave Josephine a much more compelling motivation for her actions. Plus, Felicity turned out to be tons of fun to write.

I’m really glad that you enjoyed both games! Thank you again.

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As a player, I always want more, but as a writer myself, I think that’s more than enough to tell great stories with lots of choices. After all, that’s like 2.5 paperback novels each! At the end of it, you’ve written the equivalent volume of five traditional novels, which is wild.

I always try to keep that it perspective. For instance, the entirety of the Grimms’ Fairy Tales are less than 105,000 words, Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland are less than 30,000, etc.

At around 405,000 words for the Psy High games, you’re nearly twice as long as Moby Dick, and that’s a chonky book!

I had a pretty good idea that was the case, after the ending of the first book. After all, you probably wouldn’t have summarized or skipped senior year of high school if you planned on doing a sequel.

For what it’s worth, I have immense respect for the CoG authors who write a series with importable choices and characters. I could never. All of the ideas and story outlines I have are standalone for my own sanity.

Well, except for one, which is a “school story” that takes place over four years and would almost have to be multiple books, which is probably while it’s one idea I’ll never write and it will just sit as a collection of notes, outlines, and character studies forevermore, since I ‘like it’ but not enough to devote a decade of my life to telling the story. :dotted_line_face:

I come from a background of game design, and limiting scope was something we always focused on aggressively. Just slashing everything back, pruning more and more, until only the essential core remained, and building around that. Often we’d have multiple rounds of condensing an idea to the purest most distilled form, then condensing it more. Scope creep was a death sentence, so we avoided it at all costs. I’ve tried to carry that same idea over to my Choicescript story ideas, because, like traditional game design, I know that if you outline a story idea you expect to take 100,000 words, it’s likely to end up 200,000, so if you specced for 200,000, you’d end up with 300-400,000 easy, and that’s something to avoid if you wish to write multiple things in the next decade.

I figured that was the case. I tend towards darker personally with my writing, sometimes to the point of coming back to read a short story I wrote that started on the lighter side during my outlining phase, to surprising myself. “Hmm. That’s dark.”

I think I probably would have solved it in your case by taking away the option for the player to aid the antagonists and instead made all the choices about what form the opposition would take, the reasons for opposition, and the outcomes of different attempts and successes or failures at opposition—basically the price paid by the player to achieve their desired outcome.

I think that’s a great video and talk! I’d love to see more if you have links to other talks you’ve given.

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I was just on a car ride with my father-in-law, wife, and kids where we started Googling various word counts and realized I’d already written one-and-a-half Harry Potters. (The whole series, not any individual book.)

This is of course a cautionary tale. But I don’t have any other major creative projects on the boil and am happy to throw decades of my life at this one. :slight_smile:

Which is why the word count comparison isn’t entirely apples-to-apples. :slight_smile: I do plenty of editing, but still a lot less of my CoG work ends up on the cutting room floor than would if I were writing a novel.

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Yeah, Choicescript authors could definitely be turning out a lot more published fiction if it wasn’t for the interactive part.

Of course, I’m sure it’s the same for you, it’s a labor of love to write interactive fiction, because it let’s us as authors actually have readers explore and experience all the what-if’s that actually all authors normally have to prune, remove, or decide on themselves, but with CoG, we can include all those variations and let the reader choose themselves.

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